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Old 08-14-2016, 09:50 PM   #6541
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Originally Posted by rleete View Post
I believe you have it ***-backwards. The reality is, that the select few can live like in the top pic, as long as the vast majority are forced to work and live like in the second pic.
He has it correctly if you look at it from the perspective of countries (economies) not people.
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Old 08-15-2016, 02:46 AM   #6542
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This just in, peeking over at a woman is now a hate crime.

#feminism

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Old 08-15-2016, 10:18 AM   #6543
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Originally Posted by rleete View Post
I believe you have it ***-backwards. The reality is, that the select few can live like in the top pic, as long as the vast majority are forced to work and live like in the second pic.
why would living like youre in Dubai require others to be "forced" to live and work like they are in Rio?
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Old 08-15-2016, 10:48 AM   #6544
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why would living like youre in Dubai require others to be "forced" to live and work like they are in Rio?
I've never quite understood this polarization...

The fiefdom model is certainly one method of socioeconomic organization, but it's far from the only one capable of providing a high standard of living for the upper-classes.
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Old 08-15-2016, 10:53 AM   #6545
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I believe you have it ***-backwards. The reality is, that the select few can live like in the top pic, as long as the vast majority are forced to work and live like in the second pic.
Economics is not a zero sum game....you not only get your piece of the pie, but the pie itself can also change in size.
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Old 08-15-2016, 11:30 AM   #6546
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Economics is not a zero sum game....you not only get your piece of the pie, but the pie itself can also change in size.
This is 100% correct. The poorest of the poor in the USA are a million times better then the richest of the rich in 1500.
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Old 08-15-2016, 11:43 AM   #6547
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This is 100% correct. The poorest of the poor in the USA are a million times better then the richest of the rich in 1500.
and of the poor in most other countries now.
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Old 08-15-2016, 12:37 PM   #6548
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Posit:

What if 50% of all the poor* families in the US started their own businesses tomorrow? Let's assume that they are all successful businesses which produce a variety of goods and services, and create a net income which lifts these families to an income level which qualifies them as "middle class." For the sake of simplicity, we'll assume that they don't employ anyone outside of their household.

Does this make the rich poorer? Not one bit. Those households which are still in the top X% of income / wealth will remain there. If anything, they will become slightly richer, for two reasons. One is that all of the new income-earners will now be paying taxes, and so the net effective tax rate on the X% will likely drift downwards over time. And the other is that these new earners will now be buying goods and services provided by the companies which the X% own or invest in.

Does it make the poor poorer? Not one bit. Again, the poor will likely benefit from the increased number of taxpayers contributing to medicaid / welfare / etc, as well as the reduced competition for these services.


There's no absolute chart or graph which says that if I earn X, other must earn Y. And as olderguy noted, we live in an era in which "poor" people have access to air conditioning, medical care, transportation, communication technology, and other amenities the likes of which the royal families of medieval Europe couldn't have even dreamed of.


Like the universe, the size of the economy is finite but unbounded.


* = For mgeoffriau, we'll define "poor" as receiving some form of transfer-payment income for two years in a row, without being of social-security age)
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Old 08-15-2016, 12:41 PM   #6549
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* = For mgeoffriau, we'll define "poor" as receiving some form of transfer-payment income for two years in a row, without being of social-security age)
So salty.
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Old 08-15-2016, 12:44 PM   #6550
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the poor in my area benefits from the Apple Ipod. One man's greed is another man's benefit.
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Old 08-15-2016, 12:59 PM   #6551
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So salty.
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Old 08-15-2016, 01:24 PM   #6552
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You guys never hear of cynical sarcasm? Sheesh.
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Old 08-15-2016, 02:52 PM   #6553
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
Posit:

What if 50% of all the poor* families in the US started their own businesses tomorrow? Let's assume that they are all successful businesses which produce a variety of goods and services, and create a net income which lifts these families to an income level which qualifies them as "middle class." For the sake of simplicity, we'll assume that they don't employ anyone outside of their household.
Does this make the rich poorer? Not one bit. Those households which are still in the top X% of income / wealth will remain there. If anything, they will become slightly richer, for two reasons. One is that all of the new income-earners will now be paying taxes, and so the net effective tax rate on the X% will likely drift downwards over time. And the other is that these new earners will now be buying goods and services provided by the companies which the X% own or invest in.
Does it make the poor poorer? Not one bit. Again, the poor will likely benefit from the increased number of taxpayers contributing to medicaid / welfare / etc, as well as the reduced competition for these services.
There's no absolute chart or graph which says that if I earn X, other must earn Y. And as olderguy noted, we live in an era in which "poor" people have access to air conditioning, medical care, transportation, communication technology, and other amenities the likes of which the royal families of medieval Europe couldn't have even dreamed of.
Like the universe, the size of the economy is finite but unbounded.
* = For mgeoffriau, we'll define "poor" as receiving some form of transfer-payment income for two years in a row, without being of social-security age)
The statement above shows the importance of the Productivity Level in the U.S. As we become more productive, our standard of living (ALL of us) goes up. Which is why it's so disheartening to see that the productivity level has gone down in the last two years. Americans are taking home less money, and the money they do take home buys less.
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Old 08-15-2016, 06:06 PM   #6554
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In other news, coming to a suburb near you.
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Old 08-15-2016, 07:05 PM   #6555
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"We need our weave, I don't wear it but we need it."

No words.
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Old 08-15-2016, 09:33 PM   #6556
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Originally Posted by stratosteve View Post
"Take That **** to the Suburbs. Burn that **** Down!"
To be fair, that's precisely what I've been saying that angry mobs should be doing ever since the Cincinnati riots.

If you've got a beef with whitey, and you're feeling arson-y, don't burn down your own neighborhood, hop on the bus.
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Old 08-15-2016, 09:50 PM   #6557
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The world needs more of this:


Cliffs:

Peaceful protest in Ferguson commemorating the 2nd anniversary of whatshisname being killed. Some genius decides to block traffic by standing in the middle of the street. One driver doesn't give a ****, and just plows through the dude at full speed like he wasn't even there. Then, long after it's all over, one of the peaceful protesters starts randomly shooting.
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Old 08-15-2016, 10:15 PM   #6558
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OMG, that guy got hammered. ^^^^^




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Old 08-15-2016, 10:19 PM   #6559
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The world needs more of this
I'd be pissed off and protesting if I had to take videos with a first gen Motorola RAZR, too.
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Old 08-15-2016, 10:26 PM   #6560
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OMG, that guy got hammered. ^^^^^
Yup.

Realistically, I doubt that I could pull a stunt like that, mostly out of fear of getting caught. But it's insanely gratifying to watch people claiming to be victims get a hard, chrome-plated lesson on what being a victim actually means.
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