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Old 12-09-2015, 07:26 PM   #26661
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ermahgurd
So much nope!
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Old 12-10-2015, 12:03 AM   #26662
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Old 12-10-2015, 12:35 AM   #26663
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Originally Posted by sixshooter View Post
The original star wars parody film from 1977, Hardware Wars:

(video)
True story:

I'd almost forgotten how awful that film was, even by the standards of late 70s B-movies.


Image content:

A Google Images search for "pony star wars" turns up a truly staggering number of results. I'm not going to torture anyone here with them. Instead, here is cat.











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Old 12-10-2015, 08:49 AM   #26664
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Does anyone else know my pain?
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Old 12-10-2015, 10:16 AM   #26665
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Does anyone else know my pain?
Not being able to properly embed images?

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Old 12-10-2015, 11:12 AM   #26666
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Mobile Joe. And being lazy.
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Old 12-10-2015, 11:35 AM   #26667
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Does anyone else know my pain?

4.3l vortec fun?

Last edited by flounder; 12-10-2015 at 12:00 PM.
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Old 12-10-2015, 11:37 AM   #26668
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Does anyone else know my pain?
GM spider injection

Fun times
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Old 12-10-2015, 11:44 AM   #26669
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Yes and yes. 3rd spider unit in 32k.

Also on the 4rth fuel pump... In the same time, think i finally got a good one.

Note- acdelco isn't what it used to be.
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Old 12-10-2015, 11:57 AM   #26670
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Yes and yes. 3rd spider unit in 32k.

Also on the 4rth fuel pump... In the same time, think i finally got a good one.

Note- acdelco isn't what it used to be.

Make sure you replace the fuel filter too, if you haven't already. Delco pumps are the only ones I'll use on those vehicles.
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Old 12-10-2015, 12:01 PM   #26671
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I'd never even heard of Central Sequential Fuel Injection before today. I imagine someone at GM was faced with the challenge of being dragged kicking and screaming into the latter half of the 20th century, but not wanting to give up the mechanical complexity and packaging constraints associated with carburetors.

The design review meeting probably looked something like this:


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Old 12-10-2015, 12:31 PM   #26672
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Originally Posted by flounder View Post
Make sure you replace the fuel filter too, if you haven't already. Delco pumps are the only ones I'll use on those vehicles.
Yup that's was done within the first 100 miles of owning the truck, and has been done again since to rule it out as a cause in prior troubleshooting.

Up until very recently (like January) I agreed about only using delco, on these motors especially. I went through 3 fuel pumps in less than 10k miles, they all failed the same way. After 2-4k, they would just gradually start loosing pressure until the get below the coveted 58 psi, and then the injector nozzles quit opening. All 3 were sent back for warranty, all 3 were denied. A new fuel pump fixed the truck every time..... They would say, well it turns on when we apply 12v so it works. I would ask if they checked pressure and never got a response.... 3 times. I only kept buying delco because they have that whole reputation of being the only thing that works on these GM motors that rely on parts being made accurately with no adjustments, instead of making parts and adjusting things to make them work with all the manufacturing tolerences etc.- like distributor timing for example. Every delco pump I got was physically light, and completely made of plastic. I don't see this as an inherent flaw, just something to note.

The 4rth time, I got a carter.. for less money. Its twice the weight, and is made of actual metal. That was 20k ago.

I can pull the bed and have the pump replaced in about a half hour now, ive gotten so good at it.

Keep your delco offshore junk.


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Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
I'd never even heard of Central Sequential Fuel Injection before today. I imagine someone at GM was faced with the challenge of being dragged kicking and screaming into the latter half of the 20th century, but not wanting to give up the mechanical complexity and packaging constraints associated with carburetors.

The design review meeting probably looked something like this:


What I have is just Central Port injection. Its not sequential, its batch. As in one huge injector( like 2000cc? idle quality sucks), spraying all 6 "nozzles" once per crank revolution. Sequential didn't come out until 96, (CSFI) Central Sequential Fuel Injection, and in 98(I think) it became (MPFI)Multi Port Fuel Injection. Prior to that everything was throttle body injection, not carbureted. Carburetors were phased out by GM by about 85-86' depending on the model.

I wasn't those meeting, so im not for sure, but this is the story as ive heard it: Gm needed to modernize their TB injection units for whatever reason (ive heard emissions, but im not sure how a CPI makes that better?). So someone came up with multi port batch. As in, an injector in each runner, but all fired together once per crank rev. Then an accountant came in and said, what if?... CPI was born. You get the cost effectiveness of a TBI setup, but with port injection. We can use it as marketing and get the EPA off our back all in one swoop!

It failed so often, it was recalled, and California sued GM ( because one failure mode was that raw fuel pisses right into the plenum, making AFRs go low to say the least, and subsequently killing all the Elf Owls). It was a debacle, you can read a lot about it on the internets. They reinvented it to MPFI, which just made it more complicated and didn't really fix all the problems. They finally made a retrofit kit for the CSFI where all the injectors are in the actual runners where they belong like an MPFI, and physically mounts like a centrally fired spider, with an integral harness that runs wires to each injector. That system is ok, but still fails more often than it should, and unfortunately I cant upgrade my batch system to a sequential at all, so im stuck with these terrible CPI units.

When my dad and I owned and ran a shop, literally 30 percent of our business was GM spider injection or fuel pump related.

Last edited by hi_im_sean; 12-10-2015 at 12:53 PM.
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Old 12-10-2015, 01:12 PM   #26673
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Luckily those are old enough that hardly anyone brings those to the dealer anymore. This is what I deal with more.


I have that, cam/lifters in a ls, timing chains on a 3.6, rear diff in a tahoe, and a transfer case in a h3 all sitting here waiting on parts/approval.
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Old 12-10-2015, 01:14 PM   #26674
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Originally Posted by hi_im_sean View Post
What I have is just Central Port injection. Its not sequential, its batch. As in one huge injector( like 2000cc? idle quality sucks), spraying all 6 "nozzles" once per crank revolution. Sequential didn't come out until 96, (CSFI) Central Sequential Fuel Injection, and in 98(I think) it became (MPFI)Multi Port Fuel Injection.
That sounds like it's as horrible as it sounds.

Bosch invented port injection in the 60s. D-jet was the first, in 1967 (this was a purely analog system, but it was pulsed and electrical, not mechanical and continuous like the original K-jet.) They introduced closed-loop control in '76 with K-Jet Lambda, which Porsche installed in the 911s. LH-Jet, which was microprocessor-based, came out in '82 and used a hotwire sensor.

As weird as these systems might look to an EFI specialist trained in the 21st century, they were damn reliable, made good power, ran clean, and weren't nearly as hard to maintain and tune as the shadetree mechanics raised on emulsion tubes and distributor weights in the 50s and 60s made it sound.

This is the complete wiring diagram for a D-jet system:



It's simpler than a Megasquirt, and note that the diagram above includes a full EGR system. Without EGR it gets even simpler.
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Last edited by Joe Perez; 12-10-2015 at 04:57 PM.
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Old 12-10-2015, 03:44 PM   #26675
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meanwhile in the amazon shipping department:



Those are cat treats. They are not fragile, nor are they 1 foot in any dimension.
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Old 12-10-2015, 03:46 PM   #26676
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ive complained to you about that same very thing and you said I was crazy!!!!
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Old 12-10-2015, 03:48 PM   #26677
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No, man, it's free cat toy. You should be ecstatic, I love getting free things from amazon.

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Old 12-10-2015, 03:52 PM   #26678
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Originally Posted by B6Tfastiva View Post
Luckily those are old enough that hardly anyone brings those to the dealer anymore. This is what I deal with more.


I have that, cam/lifters in a ls, timing chains on a 3.6, rear diff in a tahoe, and a transfer case in a h3 all sitting here waiting on parts/approval.


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Old 12-10-2015, 05:08 PM   #26679
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The ultimate form of recycling?

Curious to know where Ford is getting a steady-enough supply of old blocks to meet the demands of new production.

Do modern Ford cars not have aluminum engine blocks?

And has Ford, like Chevy, ever broken bellhousing-compatibility across generations when designing a new engine?

When I was a kid, after you were done with a bottle of milk / soda / whatever potable liquid, you took the container back to the store to get a refund. But unlike what is done with plastic bottles and aluminum cans in the US today, they didn't shred 'em and recycle 'em, they just rinsed them out and re-filled them.

Nobody complained.

This practice still exists today in some European countries. If you buy any Coca Cola product in Germany, for instance, it comes in a plastic bottle. However that bottle is much thicker, heavier and more durable than the ones we have here. They get re-used until totally work out, as you can easily tell by the scratches and wear marks on the outside of the bottle, particularly at the bottom. I think I still have an empty Mezzo Mix bottle somewhere that I brought back from Düsseldorf.



Firecat:






And a dog taking a **** in the middle of Wall Street:

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Old 12-10-2015, 05:32 PM   #26680
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