Want or do not want? Subaru BRZ STI
#542
Outsider? LOL
I think the term that sums us up is: "cheapass"
I just bought my wife a 2010 Prius. Top of the line, bla bla bla.
When I opened the glove box and found the original sticker, and it was 33,xxx I was floored, since just 2 years later I paid well less than half for it. Still got uber low miles, still got the NEW CAR smell, etc.
But back on topic:
Ryan, the engine I posted is actually a 2.0 OEM from a legacy that "might" (cross your fingers) make it into a brz some day. Vs all custom kits the modders are putting out these days in a crazy scramble to get their name known in the brz/frs world that is exploding nowadays.........first on the scene type bs.......this is why I won't even consider one for at least nother 2-3 years. Let these jokers settle down a bit and sort stuff out
I think the term that sums us up is: "cheapass"
I just bought my wife a 2010 Prius. Top of the line, bla bla bla.
When I opened the glove box and found the original sticker, and it was 33,xxx I was floored, since just 2 years later I paid well less than half for it. Still got uber low miles, still got the NEW CAR smell, etc.
But back on topic:
Ryan, the engine I posted is actually a 2.0 OEM from a legacy that "might" (cross your fingers) make it into a brz some day. Vs all custom kits the modders are putting out these days in a crazy scramble to get their name known in the brz/frs world that is exploding nowadays.........first on the scene type bs.......this is why I won't even consider one for at least nother 2-3 years. Let these jokers settle down a bit and sort stuff out
#543
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Joe - Take your used Porsche comparisons and get out of this thread about the FR-S. I mean, why would I pay that much for a Porsche, when I can get a C5 Corvette and wipe the floor with the Porsche in terms of fuel economy, straight line speed with some modifications, cost of maintenance, and still have the utility of a large hatch area?
It's a fruitless point of argument.
Now, NC vs FR-S is a more reasonable discussion to have in this thread. That's where things like appearance, coupe platform, theoretically useable (short-term) back seats, etc. come in to play.
It's a fruitless point of argument.
Now, NC vs FR-S is a more reasonable discussion to have in this thread. That's where things like appearance, coupe platform, theoretically useable (short-term) back seats, etc. come in to play.
#545
This is going to sound crazy, but lately I've been eyeing the '13 Hyundai Genesis 2.0T R-Spec as a contender to the brz/frs. I gotta say, with the new setup producing 274/275, torque everywhere, and 3400lb weight (that can easily be "dieted" to lose at least 3-400lbs), and I'm sure bolt ons and tune will pick up a ton of power/torque, might be worth considering.
I know I know, its probably a wacky thought, but doesn't look like it at 1st glance
I know I know, its probably a wacky thought, but doesn't look like it at 1st glance
#546
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I mean, why would I pay that much for a Porsche, when I can get a C5 Corvette and wipe the floor with the Porsche in terms of fuel economy, straight line speed with some modifications, cost of maintenance, and still have the utility of a large hatch area?
I can't speak to appearance. To me, the NC.5 is every bit as ugly as the BRZ-S.
Back seats are hard to place here. If I actually needed useful back seats in a new vehicle of approximately this class, and I had recently suffered a major head injury which caused me to want to purchase a new car, I'd...
well...
I just realized that there aren't any other vehicles in this class.
Ok, I think you win.
(Maybe the BMW 128i.)
#547
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This is going to sound crazy, but lately I've been eyeing the '13 Hyundai Genesis 2.0T R-Spec as a contender to the brz/frs. I gotta say, with the new setup producing 274/275, torque everywhere, and 3400lb weight (that can easily be "dieted" to lose at least 3-400lbs), and I'm sure bolt ons and tune will pick up a ton of power/torque, might be worth considering.
What I am really curious about is how you figure that you can "easily" lose 300 to 400 pounds in that car? Caveat: since we are talking newer cars that are $25k+ and likely to be only vehicles and/or under warranty, I'm assuming things like ditching carpets, power windows and air conditioning are not included.
B) The 128i is a $30k+ car. Not totally out of the neighborhood, but a good 20% over the base FR-S. With included factory maintenance, that does even some of that cost comparison.
The 128i is about 400 pounds heavier. Interestingly, with 230 BHP and 3200 pounds, its weight to power ratio is about comparable to the FR-S at 200 and 2800, respectively. The Bimmer does have quite a few more torques, though.
#548
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I bought my Lexus new because the damn thing depreciates excessively slowly. 15,000 miles would have only saved me like $5000 or something stupid.
I also wanted to give myself a new present
I also wanted to give myself a new present
#549
I think the Genesis is a reasonable comparison, but more fitting in the same class as a Camaro or Mustang.
What I am really curious about is how you figure that you can "easily" lose 300 to 400 pounds in that car? Caveat: since we are talking newer cars that are $25k+ and likely to be only vehicles and/or under warranty, I'm assuming things like ditching carpets, power windows and air conditioning are not included.
What I am really curious about is how you figure that you can "easily" lose 300 to 400 pounds in that car? Caveat: since we are talking newer cars that are $25k+ and likely to be only vehicles and/or under warranty, I'm assuming things like ditching carpets, power windows and air conditioning are not included.
lighter suspension components (alum bodied coilovers, etc)
lighter seats
stuff like that. just a guess
#550
I bought my current Miata brand new in 95 (I traded my 90 Miata that I bought new). If you have a tendency to hold on to your car for a long time, what is the big deal?
The act of modifing a new or newer car is not so bad either. Everything is so clean, bolts are easy to loosen, no broken harness connectors. It is quite a pleasant experience.
#555
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And the rest of it?
1: As a general rule, the 128i will hold its resale value better. A quick perusal of Autotrader shows that 2008 model 128i Coupes are averaging about $22-$23k, which is a discount of 28% versus the 2013 MSRP. By comparison, a non-WRX Imprezza hatchback of '08 vintage can be had for $9-11k, versus $18.4k MSRP for 2013, a drop of around 45%. I understand that the secondary market for the BRZ-S is a tad wonky right now, but give it a few years for the luster to wear off. It's never going to be a WRX STi.
2: The 128i does not come from the factory with a pre-installed backwards baseball hat mounted just above the driver.
When did you become Jeremy Clarkson?
In general, the 128i is just a better car. It's faster, it's not significantly more expensive, and it projects an image other than "I pwn n00bz."
Go away. Your Camry is even less relevant to this thread than my Beetle was.
Last edited by Joe Perez; 11-12-2012 at 05:11 PM.
#556
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I also bought my Camry because it is a Toyota.
Winning.
The 135i that I drove was an awesome car. Lots and lots of fun. I felt totally comfortable whoring on it in the hilly turns straight off the dealer lot. I bet the M coupe is delightful.
135i with the JB4 would be ****. 335i was like land whale in comparison
Winning.
The 135i that I drove was an awesome car. Lots and lots of fun. I felt totally comfortable whoring on it in the hilly turns straight off the dealer lot. I bet the M coupe is delightful.
135i with the JB4 would be ****. 335i was like land whale in comparison
#557
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While I have heard this argument many times, I can't quite accept this line of reasoning. I understand that auto-repair shops charge money for car repair, but I have never seen any data to support the conclusion that the total cost of ownership for a typical used car of a reasonable age exceeds that of a new car over any reasonable time-frame.
The reason for this is simple. Salt and snow. Rust kills cars long before their time, hence the slang term - cancer. Sure, that 1999 truck only has 110k on the clock. But if it's spend it's life around here, the brake lines are shot. The gas lines are shot. Hell, chances are the gas tank and filler neck are shot, too. If the brakes have any life left, the parking brake cables have turned into one solid snake of rust. The floor pans may be gone as well. This assumes routine washing to remove the worst of the salt. Further along examples will have rusty springs, frames in danger of breaking and perforated trunks. Not uncommon for a relatively clean small car to have the spring perches rotted to the point of the car collapsing. Exhausts break before they should because the hangers rust off, and they can't support themselves.
So, $18-25k new, and don't worry about a thing for at least 3 years. Or, buy one 8 years old, and take it in at least twice a year for gas/brake lines, exhaust, parking brake, or some other rust induced failure. No, it's not an equal trade off, financially. But a lot of people pay big bucks for convenience, and not having to take a car in someplace is a huge deal for a lot of people. Remember, most people shudder at the thought of changing a tire, let alone real work. A lot of people get rich by charging people for things they are too lazy to do themselves.
But no, it's not comparable on a simple monetary exchange. There are some things more valuable than money to some people. Most of my neighbors think I'm crazy to work on cars. Too much time, too much effort.
I was once told that you know you're getting old when you can't imagine paying the prices for things that you used to buy. Welcome to the club, gramps.
#558
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I can also say with confidence that it is easier to carry a set of track wheels and tires with you in the FR-S than it is in the Cayman.
#559
Having a factory warranty is worth more to me than what you would expect. I purchased a new Boss302 in April of 2011 for 42,000+ttl. I did 8-10 track days, 4 autox days, and a day at the drag strip hot lapping 12+ passes and ran a 12.6 bone stock on factory tires. A few of those track days were on 18x10's with full slicks. Left one set on for a week after a track day at TWS to troll Corpus. I went 150mph+ at least 100 times on and off the track, and have touched 170mph a few times on empty Texas highways. I clutch kicked 3rd maybe 100 times, half were roll races. It was probably stopped light raced maybe 70-80 times, majority were Camaro's and never lost, launching in 2nd gear at 6k.
Traded that car with 15,000 miles in September for 37.5. I feel like I got my monies worth. Sure I could have done most of that stuff in a 02-911, but I wouldn't have. So your comparrison also faulters on that aspect, Joe. I never had one problem with that car. But if I had popped that 15k motor, 5k trans, 1k diff, etc all would have been taken care of. I could leave work with my suit on, show up to the track and pop a tent, change clothes, run TTA all weekend, drive home Sunday night, go on an appoinment for work Monday morning. I would have never done 10% of that stuff in a 911 being scared to pop a trans/motor/rear end and be out $$. I dont want to discuss the morality of warranty on a track car, my opnion is they advertised the car as such...
I would love a 911, but would only feel really comfortable owning a new one under warranty which I can't do. I might be the exception to the rule, but I have a suspicion that others might also want a warranty for similar purposes. It sucks but I would only use a 10 year old 911 for balling around in. In your position I would probably own one in cash and use my savings as my warranty Lovely cars, I've drove a few in anger being an instructor for PCA.
I think in new car $$$ the FR-S offers an extremely good value to the spirited driver. I don't think you could pick anything nicer brand new for that mid 20's price point. One funny but true point is that you could drive one for 6+ months and sell it for more than you paid for it. Sounds like an exceptional value to me.
Traded that car with 15,000 miles in September for 37.5. I feel like I got my monies worth. Sure I could have done most of that stuff in a 02-911, but I wouldn't have. So your comparrison also faulters on that aspect, Joe. I never had one problem with that car. But if I had popped that 15k motor, 5k trans, 1k diff, etc all would have been taken care of. I could leave work with my suit on, show up to the track and pop a tent, change clothes, run TTA all weekend, drive home Sunday night, go on an appoinment for work Monday morning. I would have never done 10% of that stuff in a 911 being scared to pop a trans/motor/rear end and be out $$. I dont want to discuss the morality of warranty on a track car, my opnion is they advertised the car as such...
I would love a 911, but would only feel really comfortable owning a new one under warranty which I can't do. I might be the exception to the rule, but I have a suspicion that others might also want a warranty for similar purposes. It sucks but I would only use a 10 year old 911 for balling around in. In your position I would probably own one in cash and use my savings as my warranty Lovely cars, I've drove a few in anger being an instructor for PCA.
I think in new car $$$ the FR-S offers an extremely good value to the spirited driver. I don't think you could pick anything nicer brand new for that mid 20's price point. One funny but true point is that you could drive one for 6+ months and sell it for more than you paid for it. Sounds like an exceptional value to me.
Last edited by jacob300zx; 11-12-2012 at 09:40 PM.