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Old 05-15-2015, 06:54 AM   #841
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Noticed this when browsing through photos recently. Shot with a zoom lens from far off. Endplates making the most of the wing; bowing inwards at the lower tips - higher pressure on outside of endplate, low pressure on the inside under the wing.



-Ryan
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Old 05-15-2015, 01:40 PM   #842
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Wow, that's pretty stout
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Last edited by sixshooter; 05-15-2015 at 07:53 PM.
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Old 05-15-2015, 05:35 PM   #843
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Wow.

So spam.

Such truck.

Wow.
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Old 05-15-2015, 05:38 PM   #844
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Ryan, I thought the endplates were part of the support? How are they bowing in? Also, I still cant get over how good your front end paint looks.
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Old 05-15-2015, 06:02 PM   #845
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mx5autoxer View Post
Ryan, I thought the endplates were part of the support? How are they bowing in? Also, I still cant get over how good your front end paint looks.
Why thank you

Nope the wing has standard upgrights, the endplates are just endplates, just very effective ones (these were my test units that lead to the development of our high-efficiency endplates).

The endplates are bowing in due to the pressure differential between the outside of the endplate and the inside.

Faster moving air = low pressure and vice versa. The air on the outer side of the endplate is basically at atmospheric pressure, so for the endplates to be bowing inwards indicates that the air inwards of the endplate under the wing is being significantly accelerated and thus at a lower pressure. (i.e. more downforce). With small/basic endplates the wing loses much more effectiveness on the outer sides of the wing as the air mixes much more with the stationary air outwards of the endplate. Well designed/larger endplates isolate the air under the wing much more so the wing can get its groove on.

-Ryan
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Old 05-16-2015, 06:51 AM   #846
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This leads to a question i have always wondered...

So why does bigger not always mean better.....?
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Old 05-16-2015, 09:37 AM   #847
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mx5-kiwi View Post
This leads to a question i have always wondered...

So why does bigger not always mean better.....?
Because drag becomes a limiting factor. Needs more power to overcome greater drag or the car will be slower on the long straights. If it is a slow, curvy course the bigger wing is a plus, but if it is a course like many of the F1 tracks that are just long straights punctuated by slow, tight corners and then another long straight, too much wing could yield a slower time. It's always a balancing act.
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Old 05-16-2015, 04:11 PM   #848
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Any obstacle in the airstream creates drag, and that increases with size. So with endplates, the largest/most basic priority is just to know where material is important for the performance of the wing and where to remove material so that you're getting the most performance you can for the cost in drag. Just going large without that knowledge usually results in excess surface area where it is not best utilized.

However, as a broad statement, the cost in drag from endplates is lower than the cost in drag from aggressive AOA, so 10 out of 10 times I would choose larger endplates and less AOA rather than small endplates and more AOA.

The significance of endplates is why endplate surface area is limited by the rules in almost all professional racing.

-Ryan
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Old 05-16-2015, 07:54 PM   #849
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Yep sorry was talking about endplates only....does the side surface area have much drag or is it mostly the edge facing the air flow that is the factor....

I could only ever come up with cross wind instability or an increased resistance to turn as being the biggest possible reason but rules is something didn't think about....

For most of us running in track days and non sanctioned (in an aero manner anyway) events, larger end plates would likely be beneficial?
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Old 05-16-2015, 08:35 PM   #850
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mx5-kiwi View Post
Yep sorry was talking about endplates only....does the side surface area have much drag or is it mostly the edge facing the air flow that is the factor....
The total surface area is a factor due to surface friction drag.

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For most of us running in track days and non sanctioned (in an aero manner anyway) events, larger end plates would likely be beneficial?
Yep.

And while I would even say that as a blanket statement for very basic oversized endplates, cleverly designed endplates can further reduce drag by manipulating the vortex that is shed at the ends of the wing (this is a large portion of the drag created by the wing). This can more than offset the additional drag from the increased surface area of the endplate itself.

-Ryan
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Old 05-16-2015, 09:02 PM   #851
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This technology is above my pay grade.



Read the plaque:



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Old 05-16-2015, 10:33 PM   #852
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That plane stuff is interesting, i was trying to compare the loss in the middle with the gain outside thinking the winglet area might be less but it would have less drag and (i think) higher leverage of lift.....maybe. Drag probably the biggest thing as it relates to fuel cost.

Anyway, the new slats in F1 versus the old slots caught my eye the other day and the pass's info made me remember to look it up....its probably not especially relelvant to us (too subtle for our heavy cars and we don't have a huge rear tyre messing with our wing aero zone) but interesting none the less.

The top forward part (slots) of the end plate might have some relevance....

Analysis: Rear Wing Endplates | theWPTformula
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Old 05-16-2015, 11:00 PM   #853
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I've actually played with applying most of the endplate features covered in that article to production car applications. Some only apply to an open wheel car or need fine tuning in CFD.. But interestingly, not all of them are wasted on the cars owned by us mere mortals.

We applied some of those elements with success to a set of custom endplates for a special project on a C6R wing recently.

Speaking of F1, I had the wing from the 2010 Williams car - specifically Hulkenberg's - in front of me this morning. Very cool:

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Old 05-18-2015, 11:00 AM   #854
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neet!
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Old 06-09-2015, 12:00 PM   #855
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Hey Guys, trying to design a splitter for my GV lip on the NB. I'm going toward a form follows function approach but I still want the splitter to be athletically pleasing toward the lines of the car. Any suggestions on the options I came up with?

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Old 06-09-2015, 12:03 PM   #856
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<p>Option 2.</p>
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Old 06-09-2015, 04:56 PM   #857
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2.
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Old 06-09-2015, 06:09 PM   #858
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I can help with grammar but as all those options look okay to me, i'll let people better than me work on the aero!


"Aesthetically" ......
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Old 06-09-2015, 06:35 PM   #859
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Mo' surface area, mo' betta.

-Ryan
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Old 06-15-2015, 12:46 AM   #860
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Apologies, double post.
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