The Better Bilstein Ebay Coilover Thread - Page 39 - Miata Turbo Forum -Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 05-25-2016, 08:43 PM   #761
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Originally Posted by Girz0r View Post
FWIW.
lol. The entire reason the MSM Bilsteins ride so nice with high spring rates is that they have less high-speed valving.

I have been running 600/350 MSM Bilsteins on my 02 for about a month now. I got my shocks with a set of eBay sleeves which sketched me out so bad I ended up throwing them away. I used Mazdacomp SM sleeves which encapsulate the circlip fully. They are definitely a little underdamped over big undulations, but for the price, they are damn good. Ride height is ~4.25" front, ~4.5" rear, and I can go a tiny bit lower. I am using 7" springs front and rear - the Comp sleeves go a bunch lower than the eBay sleeves do.
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Old 05-25-2016, 09:35 PM   #762
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Savington View Post
lol. The entire reason the MSM Bilsteins ride so nice with high spring rates is that they have less high-speed valving.

I have been running 600/350 MSM Bilsteins on my 02 for about a month now. I got my shocks with a set of eBay sleeves which sketched me out so bad I ended up throwing them away. I used Mazdacomp SM sleeves which encapsulate the circlip fully. They are definitely a little underdamped over big undulations, but for the price, they are damn good. Ride height is ~4.25" front, ~4.5" rear, and I can go a tiny bit lower. I am using 7" springs front and rear - the Comp sleeves go a bunch lower than the eBay sleeves do.
I've got the same setup - 600/350, but with 6" springs and helpers + ISC tophats and the circlip down an inch. Will prob re-valve them at some point, but they're good enough that other mods take a higher priority for now over changing them.

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Old 05-25-2016, 10:24 PM   #763
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Originally Posted by Leafy View Post
Speaking of lengths, can any of you who have these apart measure from the middle of the eyelet to the top of the snap ring?
Rear - 141mm
Front - 225mm

That's on MSMs for the factory/stock snap ring location.
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Old 05-25-2016, 10:26 PM   #764
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Originally Posted by Junkwhale View Post
Rear - 141mm
Front - 225mm

That's on MSMs for the factory/stock snap ring location.
Thanks awesome, I wonder if the hard-s are different.
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Old 05-25-2016, 10:28 PM   #765
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Thanks awesome, I wonder if the hard-s are different.
I'll be taking some off a car in a few weeks - will measure then if noone else posts before then.
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Old 05-25-2016, 10:30 PM   #766
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They look pretty damn close in pdexter's side-by-side pic on the previous page FWIW.
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Old 06-03-2016, 10:27 AM   #767
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I will have a set of Hard-S next week as well. I can measure them and report back. I have been building an excel calculator to determine some of these metrics based on a few inputs (estimated corner weight, spring rates, lengths, desired ride height, sleeve adjustment range, etc) that I hope to share with the community if it actually works out.

I plan to run either Advanced Autosports or Allstar sleeves, 400f/250r summit springs, Honda Bumpstops, and NB tophats, Poly isolators, and maybe Delrin thrust washers. I am reading more of this thread every day and will decide on if I need extended top hats (NA) after I make some measurements. Will also determine spring length from my calculator (measurements and desired height), though it looks like 7"/7" or 7"/8" should do the job at those rates.

Quick question: I got a killer deal on a partial set of 10AE Bilsteins (2 rear, 1 front, shocks only). Therefore, I am hunting for one good front Hard-S shock, but may have found a set of MSM fronts for another great deal. Would anyone foresee an issue with running the Hard-S at rear and the MSM billies in front? Such as, will I be able to tell the difference in ride comfort? This is a daily. Thanks!
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Old 06-06-2016, 09:00 PM   #768
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Those honda bump stops are really really hard. Moveable for a little bit, and then as hard as NA rubber, not even close to the bump stops that came on the xidas. I'm questioning even installing them in the ES car and just ordering resuspension ones instead, but a bump stop change isnt too hard.
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Old 06-08-2016, 02:05 AM   #769
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These speedthane ones are a better option: Integra Speedthane Shock Bumpers 310 3019-50 - Free Shipping on Orders Over $99 at Summit Racing

They're 3" long so you only need two and cut them in half (or even shorter depending on bump travel requirements). IIRC the FCM ones are just speedthane ones anyway...
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Old 06-08-2016, 10:35 AM   #770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkwhale View Post
These speedthane ones are a better option: Integra Speedthane Shock Bumpers 310 3019-50 - Free Shipping on Orders Over $99 at Summit Racing

They're 3" long so you only need two and cut them in half (or even shorter depending on bump travel requirements). IIRC the FCM ones are just speedthane ones anyway...
Has anyone looked into part number 31336756663?

They are 54mm long off the front of a supercharged 2002 Mini. They are around $5 each on rock auto. My friend ordered a set so we will be trying them when hebis finished moving and we have time to get his set together.
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Old 06-08-2016, 01:39 PM   #771
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Mini coopers have larger than 3/4" diameter strut shaft, no way it's fitting snug on any miata shock. I think it's 20 or 22mm IIRC, same thing for r53 or r56.
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Old 06-08-2016, 03:43 PM   #772
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Originally Posted by deezums View Post
Mini coopers have larger than 3/4" diameter strut shaft, no way it's fitting snug on any miata shock. I think it's 20 or 22mm IIRC, same thing for r53 or r56.
A snug fit on the shaft is a definite must, regardless of length.

Anyhow...here is a snapshot of the calculator I am working on.





1. I still need to fill most of the common shock data and verify the circlip location off my hard-s bilsteins (for now I copied the msm info found in this thread.

2. I have developed a pretty broad table database of spring parameters from Eibach (off summitracing.com) and PAC springs (racingsprings.com) to get started.

3. The spring selection and shock selection are just drop-down lists in those 2 top fields.

4. I need to verify each equation and actually measure a few items on my NA. And plan to add some side note or simple figures/depictions to clarify what I mean by certain fields.

5. Corner weights are estimates for now, along with top hat bushing thickness.

6. There is a provision for adding helper springs and their overall effect on available coil compression before binding...slider thickness would need to be included.

7. This can easily include spring isolator and torrington bearing thicknesses as well.

8. I hope to correlate total shock assembly length/compression to ride height (hub to fender). It should be approximately linear, even though the suspension travels through an arc, but I will measure on my '94. Some minimum "lockout" heights could be referenced to flag when suspension travel will allow for control arm impacts or wheel/fender contact (with tire selection for diameter calcs, though camber and offset will affect this as well).

If anyone has suggestions or could measure some set-ups and get back to me, that'd be great.
Attached Thumbnails
The Better Bilstein Ebay Coilover Thread-80-spring_calcs_13066d9d881e6347bc520ef5f28cfdc51bc2266a.jpg  

Last edited by JoeTheZoe; 06-08-2016 at 07:27 PM. Reason: Updated attachment, let me know if you cannot see.
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Old 06-08-2016, 07:35 PM   #773
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Originally Posted by JoeTheZoe View Post
Anyhow...here is a snapshot of the calculator I am working on.
That's awesome. Have a cat.

Would be great if someone could provide measurements for XIDAs or FMs Fox shocks - any of the carefully designed for max bump travel aftermarket setups.
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Old 06-08-2016, 07:37 PM   #774
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Originally Posted by JoeTheZoe View Post
A snug fit on the shaft is a definite must, regardless of length.
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Old 06-08-2016, 07:41 PM   #775
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Also, I see you've got stroke length of 5" for both front and rear (oh man, phrasing!).

Are sure those are correct? IIRC the MSM/Hard-s front is actually shorter than the rear by a good bit.
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Old 06-08-2016, 09:04 PM   #776
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkwhale View Post
Also, I see you've got stroke length of 5" for both front and rear (oh man, phrasing!).

Are sure those are correct? IIRC the MSM/Hard-s front is actually shorter than the rear by a good bit.
It was a quick glance comparison this morning. I will measure and verify.

Edit: Front hard-s has 4.5" of exposed chrome shaft, rear has 5". I will actually compress them and compare as well.

Last edited by JoeTheZoe; 06-08-2016 at 09:37 PM. Reason: Added measures.
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Old 06-10-2016, 10:06 AM   #777
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I've been tinkering on my setup for the last couple months.

Initially installed with 700/400 and helper springs. Couldn't get low enough and the 700 fronts rode like ****. So I pulled all the helpers and threw in some 550 7" fronts.

Current setup that I'm 95% happy with is:
QA1/Eibach 7" 550/400
MSM Bilsteins
5xRacing sleeves cut down to 4"
NB Mounts
Integra Speedthane DiY bumpstops/top bushings
Energy upper spring isolators

v2 left VS v1 right:


Max Low:
Attached Thumbnails
The Better Bilstein Ebay Coilover Thread-dcf94947-f4c8-48d8-a6ab-5ade364a4da9_zpslrlq0v5w.jpg   The Better Bilstein Ebay Coilover Thread-98f8d84c-7ccf-48c9-98e7-5aa23e0610c7_zpsy19ar4s9.jpg  
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Old 06-10-2016, 10:12 AM   #778
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Is the picture showing new ride height or your old ride height?
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Old 06-10-2016, 10:48 AM   #779
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Originally Posted by Swanpuppy View Post
Is the picture showing new ride height or your old ride height?
Currently bottom-of-the-sleeve, max low ride height.
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Old 06-10-2016, 01:05 PM   #780
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Have you measured your ride height, wheel center to fender? And a guess at the front/rear weight of your car? It will help me start to classify some parameters of the NB. Another tease of how that calculator has come along...


Just by intuition and looks, your settings confirm that I should be able to easily hit my desired height with those sleeves and 7" 450/300.
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The Better Bilstein Ebay Coilover Thread-80-spring_calcs_2_c57b0afae859d09380b1088a32d9f3afb56be2d2.jpg  
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