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Love to see it man! You're not joking about the noise, sounds like quite a bit of turbo-ness even blipping the throttle in neutral. The youngsters are gonna love it even more than before haha.
Scratching my head on the firing order issue with the injectors. Wonder if your MS harness has two of the injector outputs wired in reverse maybe? But that seems unlikely..
You can typically fire injectors off sync, if the valves are closed it'll allow it in at the correct time. This is why randomly spraying starter fluid in a vacuum line starts an engine with no other fuel. As long as it's timed correctly and sparks, it'll run. It's not good, but it works. Why yours is wired backwards from factory is weird. Either the harness plug was swapped or ECU was at one point?
Thanks for the input guys! I agree with Curly, which is the part that was throwing me for a loop so hard. I know how batch works, but this isn't that, it's completely out of cycle injector timing (in batch), which sounds wild to me. I actually didn't even realize that would work, but conceptualizing what Curly and Ricardo have told me, it makes sense. It really threw me for a loop because I thought the wiring would be like my coils were, in that I'd just split one wire from each pair and re-wire that. But with this, none of them matched up so I had to re-wire all 4 to get it correct.
It's an old trubokitty ms3x that I bought used for $400 7 years ago, so who knows. I am looking forward to firing it up with the new seq wiring though! Seems like there might be more gains to this than I had previously thought even. We'll see!
More to come this week, hoping to get this thing fired up either today or tomorrow.
The car is back together. Fired right up. The idle and throttle response is night and day different, idk how this comes through on video but it feels like a goddamn crotch rocket compared to before. Wtf.
I suspect this isn't your normal change going from batch to sequential, its a world different, going from out of cycle batch to sequential. I should have done this 10 years ago. Thanks @redursidae for the push. I'm excited.
At least I'm not on an MS1 anymore! It feels like yesterday that you were all grilling me in this very thread that I needed to get rid of my MS1 and CAS trigger setup. Though that was more like 10 years ago
I'm not surprised you noticed a difference going to sequential fueling. I had to run batch for a minute due to trigger wheel issues and man... the light throttle performance was atrocious. IIRC I also had to idle pretty rich to get the car to not stumble around.
Glad the 2860 is treating you well. I keep telling myself to address other issues on the car before grabbing one
Nice work man! I find fixing little stuff (like redoing coolant lines/maintenance stuff/etc) quite cathartic and it makes me feel better and less worried when beating things on track (or even putzing around) that things are done correctly and won't fall apart.
What's the big advantage of sequential vs batch fuel injection? Can anyone 'splain it to me? Is that awesome throttle response largely due to the light flywheel (not sure what you were running before)? Either way always great to see a well running and sorted car! I'm not familiar w/ the MS but with the BMM switching to a higher res crank trigger wheel made a noticeable improvement as the ECU sees a much higher resolution of the crank position.
I'm not surprised you noticed a difference going to sequential fueling. I had to run batch for a minute due to trigger wheel issues and man... the light throttle performance was atrocious. IIRC I also had to idle pretty rich to get the car to not stumble around.
Glad the 2860 is treating you well. I keep telling myself to address other issues on the car before grabbing one
I'll keep you posted on the PTX2860! We're retuning the car this weekend and should let it eat a bit, so I'll have a better impression then. At this time I've only driven it once on 8psi wastegate and I'm already impressed and excited to ramp it up!
Originally Posted by SlowTeg
Nice work man! I find fixing little stuff (like redoing coolant lines/maintenance stuff/etc) quite cathartic and it makes me feel better and less worried when beating things on track (or even putzing around) that things are done correctly and won't fall apart.
What's the big advantage of sequential vs batch fuel injection? Can anyone 'splain it to me? Is that awesome throttle response largely due to the light flywheel (not sure what you were running before)? Either way always great to see a well running and sorted car! I'm not familiar w/ the MS but with the BMM switching to a higher res crank trigger wheel made a noticeable improvement as the ECU sees a much higher resolution of the crank position.
I agree on the cathartic point. Usually if I do something like this, I spend the extra time to make it as nice as I can at the time. This harness being an example, instead of throwing a few extra wires at it real quick I took the time to deloom all of it, make some nice solders and heat shrink the connectors, add a new OEM plug for the harness, etc. Really feels good to know that it's sorted under there and I won't have to go back in anytime soon.
As for the improvements, first I wanna make it clear that my batch firing was mis-wired (or rather my batch wiring was stock, but the ECU somehow had the injector circuits inverted), so I was firing in batch off cycle from my coils. At least that's how I understand it, based on the wiring, unless the ECU was doing something to compensate for that when in batch mode. Anyways, as the others stated it will work but it's far from ideal. I'm guessing even properly re-wiring my batch injection would have been a pretty big upgrade/change. In this case I went from incorrectly timed batch to correctly timed full sequential which was a night and day difference, not just in how quick it revs, but just how "crispy" it feels when you touch the throttle. Hard to show on video but it feels like a different car just revving it.
The big benefits to sequential as I understand it are having individually timed injectors to each cylinder, specifically the timing of when the fuel is squirted vs the intake valves opening. Basically the fuel is squirted as the intake valves open resulting in way better atomization/swirl/etc for more complete combustion. Or something to that extent. I never bothered with it because this change only affects part throttle, idle, low RPM kinda stuff. Once the RPMs get higher the timing is somewhat irrelevant, as the injectors have to be opened longer, so they start opening before the valves open anyways.
And yeah, that lightweight flywheel is really coming alive now. When i put it in and was running on the untimed batch, it was definitely quicker to rev, but really didn't have that snappy feel. The car was always a bit sluggish to rev, for instance my stock nb1 had way better throttle response. Now it feels like the turbo car surpasses that, which is something I thought I had given up with the turbo setup.
Still to-do this week:
Wire in CAN wire to the ECU in preparation for Ricardo to bring me a Spartan CAN Wbo2 controller.
Wire in knock sensor, as I have the bosch sensor on the way with Chuckieho's adapter stud waiting to go in.
If the performance wasn't so good, I'd call the sound rice. I'll try and get some more videos, but this things screams at part throttle. Like 10% throttle and you hear the turbo over anything else. At first I thought something was wrong.
I'm growing to like it now, just because the performance it comes with. But yeah it was a shocker for me. Getting amped to see how it sounds TURNED UP.
As for the improvements, first I wanna make it clear that my batch firing was mis-wired (or rather my batch wiring was stock, but the ECU somehow had the injector circuits inverted), so I was firing in batch off cycle from my coils. At least that's how I understand it, based on the wiring, unless the ECU was doing something to compensate for that when in batch mode. Anyways, as the others stated it will work but it's far from ideal. I'm guessing even properly re-wiring my batch injection would have been a pretty big upgrade/change. In this case I went from incorrectly timed batch to correctly timed full sequential which was a night and day difference, not just in how quick it revs, but just how "crispy" it feels when you touch the throttle. Hard to show on video but it feels like a different car just revving it.
The big benefits to sequential as I understand it are having individually timed injectors to each cylinder, specifically the timing of when the fuel is squirted vs the intake valves opening. Basically the fuel is squirted as the intake valves open resulting in way better atomization/swirl/etc for more complete combustion. Or something to that extent. I never bothered with it because this change only affects part throttle, idle, low RPM kinda stuff. Once the RPMs get higher the timing is somewhat irrelevant, as the injectors have to be opened longer, so they start opening before the valves open anyways.
Nice! I was confusing wasted spark w/ batch/sequential injection for a minute there.. my bad. I thought my NB had batch injection for a minute but looked it up and it's sequential.. Yes I would definitely expect that sequential fuel injection would make a noticeable difference if the fuel isn't injected at precisely the right time. That's a nice upgrade! I guess the jump from wasted spark to non-wasted spark is a much smaller/non consequential "upgrade" compared to batch/sequential fuel injection.
Lotsa miata related stuff lately, so just dumping.
My buddies miata and my DD 10ae at work. Our other friend/co-worker also wants one now, which would be hilarious. Also got my chromies back on the 10ae and those with the blue top is just perfect to me. My old man spec car.
After discussion with Ricardo decided to buy his Spartan CAN controller, apparently it works great with MS.. if your MS supports it. Turns out my brain ms3x doesn't have native support, but can be added. A few hours later I had CAN wires jumpered as needed:
Actually pretty psyched with these solders, super clean, almost like I know what I'm doing (I don't). A little flux and a temp controllable iron really help here. Id id this years ago on my MS1 and it was a massacre, terrible work, but still worked fine!
ECU got put back in the car and ready for Ricardo to come tune it! Another silly shot at work with co-workers new 00SE. This is the very same one we butchered and I took its drivetrain parts for the supersmurf.
More miata junk. This is my buddies car, he bought my old 2860rs and just got it on his car. I tuned his car on the old t25 setup. It ran great, ended up doing a 13.8 on that setup, peppy little car probably cracking 215whp. He's into drag racing, it's a stock block car so the idea is that the older slow spooling 2860 would be gentle on the motor for him. We'll see soon!
The car was finally buttoned up ready for the retune. Really digging the miata miata roadster shifter. Currently drivetrain is SM hybrid poly mount setup > Whiteline poly diff bushings. Better than it has ever felt. The trans feels great though I need a lot more practice with it. Ironically my DD has the same 6 speed, but my drive to work is like 5 minutes and I live in a small town so it never sees that 6th gear shift really. That ones tricky for me, and back down to 5th once in 6th. Just not as intuitive as the 5 speed. That trans feels great though and I'm psyched on the whole thing. 6 speed + 3.9 gears are kinda short/busy, but honestly feels so good and I love it.
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