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Old 10-11-2006, 04:21 PM   #1
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Default 16g 1.6 ebay kits? Any opinions/comments?

I'm new to the forum, but I've read through most of the information that I could find about DIY kits with the 16G EVOIII turbos. I've seen several kits on ebay, offering most of the hardware, if not the software to get going and what seem to be ridiculously low prices. Has anyone looked into these kits? I'm really interested to get started on my setup..... I'm looking to be in the 180-200hp range. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. DJ

The descprition/link/pics from the ebay listing:

DESCRIPTION: MIATA 1.6 STAINLESS STEEL MANIFOLD+ 16G TURBO WITH INTERNAL WASTEGATE ( 90 DAYS WARRANTY )+ J PIPE +STAINLESS TURBO DOWNPIPE+ TYPE -M GODSPEED INTERCOOLER

comes with following item
-16g turbo
-1.6 turbo FULL STAINLESS STEEL manifold
-3 inch STAINLESS STEEL downpipe ( inner diameter 2.5")
- j pipe.
-oil fittings
-GODSPEED TYPE M INTERCOOLER ( CORE SIZE 20X6X2.75)


http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Miata...QQcmdZViewItem
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16g 1.6 ebay kits?  Any opinions/comments?-manifold_miata_1_6_1.jpg   16g 1.6 ebay kits?  Any opinions/comments?-manifold_miata_1_6_2.jpg   16g 1.6 ebay kits?  Any opinions/comments?-manifold_miata_1_6_3.jpg  
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Old 10-11-2006, 04:27 PM   #2
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in for answer. I've been considering that base kit too.
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Old 10-11-2006, 04:28 PM   #3
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This "kit" has been discussed in depth here and at M.net, here is wrote I wrote about it over there:

Technically you could easily get that kit to work. But is it worth the trouble to use a low quality DP, Manifold and Turbo?
You'll have to clock the turbo you use the outlet (as it's pointed back towards the block). It might work as is, as the adater points it back towards the radiator, however if you have P/S that will not fly. If clocking the turbo is a must for fitamet issues, then you'd have to fab a new wastegate bracket.

Piping the intake could be done with a 2.5" bend. But still technically required. $20-40

Piping the intercooler will require extra work and materials. $100-200

Oil Feed and Return lines & fittings are needed. Adapaters for the turbo look somewhat useless. $40-80

Manifold/DP are both made from thin SS and are prone to cracking. Other members who have used these ebay parts have had to modify the DP to fit.

BOV required. $50-200

Chinese turbos are known for lack of quality and have mechnical flaws (bad castings, cheap blades, incorrect compressor/turbine styles, poor bearings)

FMU required for boost. $100-250

Fitting required off the turbo for boost signal to wastegate. $1

How can a 3" Downpipe be 2.5" I.D.?

Hardware? is it grade 8? Nuts for turbo to manifold look copper? $10

Intercooler may be a tad large don't you think? Will not work on a A/C car.
Do you really wan't to do all that? Or would you like to spend a tad more and at least get a GReddy kit with a large user base and easy upgrades?
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Old 10-11-2006, 05:03 PM   #4
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meh, I just want a cheap manifold and downpipe. I can figuire out the rest.
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Old 10-11-2006, 05:16 PM   #5
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dont cheap out youll regret itt in the [email protected]#
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Old 10-11-2006, 05:19 PM   #6
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i dont think that kit is worth it. I have heard those cheap chinese turbos dont last too long. but if you could get it without the turbo and get your own dsm turbo it might be worth it if you are good at fabbing stuff.
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Old 10-11-2006, 05:50 PM   #7
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I was curious about your setup before starting the thread. Looking back on your current setup and how you got there, would you use the setup that you have now? Your output is right where I'm looking to be.

I've also looked at your dyno sheet and am wondering about the dip in the power curve....Have you figured that out?

If you were advising someone to get it right the first time, what would you advise them to do (parts/software/etc.)? I'm trying to avoid as many beginner mistakes as possible. Is the Greddy kit really that great? Everyone seems to upgrade immediately, which seems like a waste of money and time to me. Thanks for the advice, DJ

Quote:
Originally Posted by braineack View Post
This "kit" has been discussed in depth here and at M.net, here is wrote I wrote about it over there:

Technically you could easily get that kit to work. But is it worth the trouble to use a low quality DP, Manifold and Turbo?
You'll have to clock the turbo you use the outlet (as it's pointed back towards the block). It might work as is, as the adater points it back towards the radiator, however if you have P/S that will not fly. If clocking the turbo is a must for fitamet issues, then you'd have to fab a new wastegate bracket.

Piping the intake could be done with a 2.5" bend. But still technically required. $20-40

Piping the intercooler will require extra work and materials. $100-200

Oil Feed and Return lines & fittings are needed. Adapaters for the turbo look somewhat useless. $40-80

Manifold/DP are both made from thin SS and are prone to cracking. Other members who have used these ebay parts have had to modify the DP to fit.

BOV required. $50-200

Chinese turbos are known for lack of quality and have mechnical flaws (bad castings, cheap blades, incorrect compressor/turbine styles, poor bearings)

FMU required for boost. $100-250

Fitting required off the turbo for boost signal to wastegate. $1

How can a 3" Downpipe be 2.5" I.D.?

Hardware? is it grade 8? Nuts for turbo to manifold look copper? $10

Intercooler may be a tad large don't you think? Will not work on a A/C car.
Do you really wan't to do all that? Or would you like to spend a tad more and at least get a GReddy kit with a large user base and easy upgrades?
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Old 10-11-2006, 05:54 PM   #8
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Is there intrest in a T3 kit? Manifold, turbo, downpipe, intake tube, oil lines? Leave the fueling and intercooling up to the user. Maybe just a new crossovertube Good hardware, braided lines, Tbolt clamps. Possible intercooler upgrade in the works down the road?
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Old 10-11-2006, 06:11 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hustler View Post
meh, I just want a cheap manifold and downpipe. I can figuire out the rest.
Remember - there is cheap - and there is cheap.

If you can get a good quality bit of kit secondhand at a good price thats a good purchase. If you get a cheap bit of kit that falls apart - even if the $$ were few then its not cheap whatever way you look at it.

I ordered a eBay manifold and downpipe a while back - then sold it unfitted simply because I knew that it would not last that long.

I recommend keeping an eye on the for sale forums here. I managed to get a fantastic setup for a reasonable price (it arrives today - YAY) - there seems to be stuff coming up all the time.

good luck


C
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Old 10-11-2006, 07:01 PM   #10
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That kit is $925 after shipping. I don't know anything about the 16g turbo, but I do know this:

Blown GARRETT SR20det T25= $50
T25 Rebuild kit= $75
pick your eBay intercooler: $100
Begi divorced wasegate DP= $310
Begi Mani: $450
Total: $985


All those prices include shipping for brand new parts except the turbo. Buy a used mani/dp for even less. Bottom line, for $70 more than the cheap-**** 16g kit, you get all top quality stuff that you know will last you forever. A T25 will probably max out on a 1.6 at about 15psi efficiently and get you in the 240hp range (provided good fueling and spark) . If you're looking for more than that for a few hundred more you could buy a used T28 w/more than enough flow than a 1.6 can handle.

Welcome to the forum, look what I found:
Definition: Kaizan >>> the founder of the temple (who made it a temple)
Don't forget to create a vBgarage so we can all see where you're at in the mod/build process.
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Old 10-12-2006, 03:43 AM   #11
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those manifold sell for 200 together i should know i run them but hte fitment of the dp is abit off others have reported cracking but mine is working so far. i would be ont hte look out for the manifold dp combo on ebay it hsould come up rather cheap hopefully no thta people arent buying them to try to use on there td04s wich will absolutly not work. get the manifolds and a good small 16g or real evo 3 stay away from the big 16g it sucks
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Old 10-12-2006, 09:49 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djskaizan View Post
I've also looked at your dyno sheet and am wondering about the dip in the power curve....Have you figured that out?
The dip has been explained like ten times, read my newest plot thread, or my dyno day pics thread for explaination.

Click my vBGarage page for my current build.
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Old 10-12-2006, 01:04 PM   #13
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I'd already seen your current build. I'm asking if you view your current setup as the optimal one. Assuming that your setup was not done all at once (i.e. no upgrades over time), you may have parts that are not the the "best part", but you have decided to keep it because it's already on the car or because the incentive of upgrading isn't justified by the cost (time/money).

If you're saying that your system is perfect, then my question has been answered. Thanks for the time and response, DJ

Quote:
Originally Posted by braineack View Post
The dip has been explained like ten times, read my newest plot thread, or my dyno day pics thread for explaination.

Click my vBGarage page for my current build.
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Old 10-12-2006, 01:37 PM   #14
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his build workd my build works, the best kit is a matter of preferance, good performance numbers are acheivable with either. it is all a matter of preference.
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Old 10-12-2006, 01:54 PM   #15
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Where can I see the specifics of your build? I'm trying to figure out the best option for me. Thanks, DJ

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Originally Posted by magnamx-5 View Post
his build workd my build works, the best kit is a matter of preferance, good performance numbers are acheivable with either. it is all a matter of preference.
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Old 10-12-2006, 02:15 PM   #16
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vb garage search function or i could sum it all up for ya. I am running the aforementioned manifolds wich where made by megan racing with a small 16g turbo. Along with a rx7 afm, walboro 255 hp fuel pump, 87 supra NA injectors 310cc, manual fuelpressure regulator, b rising rate fuel pressure regulator 12-1, water methanol injection, and some custom crossover and intake piping along with a gutted cat, and a cheapo ebay mbc. i am hoping for around 250 or so whp this saturday on a dynojet at 8 psi on completely stock 1.6 fuel system with WI i made about 200 dynojet whp, with just the fpr and Watet injection. my setup is cheaper than braineacks but it what i didn't pay in parts i payed in time to tune. none of it was very hard but it did take abit of patience. The most important thing to do on a turbo build is to figure out what kind of manifolds you will use and then what kind of turbos the manifold will allow you to use. with my manifolds i can run any standard dsm turbo, with braineacks he can run just baout any standard t3 turbo. i have no timming control, he does. he runs an Intercooler i run WI. we both run high fuel pressure to compensate for our stock ecus. buthe runs a peiburg inline whereas i opted to tune the 255 with a non standard base fp regulator. there is a ton of stuff to go around here. just take a look and keep asking questions eventualy you will get a feel for what you like. and go with that. most importantly dont rush just be patient and do some research it pays off.
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Old 10-12-2006, 02:24 PM   #17
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Thanks a lot! That helps. Trying to be patient and get it right. DJ

Quote:
Originally Posted by magnamx-5 View Post
vb garage search function or i could sum it all up for ya. I am running the aforementioned manifolds wich where made by megan racing with a small 16g turbo. Along with a rx7 afm, walboro 255 hp fuel pump, 87 supra NA injectors 310cc, manual fuelpressure regulator, b rising rate fuel pressure regulator 12-1, water methanol injection, and some custom crossover and intake piping along with a gutted cat, and a cheapo ebay mbc. i am hoping for around 250 or so whp this saturday on a dynojet at 8 psi on completely stock 1.6 fuel system with WI i made about 200 dynojet whp, with just the fpr and Watet injection. my setup is cheaper than braineacks but it what i didn't pay in parts i payed in time to tune. none of it was very hard but it did take abit of patience. The most important thing to do on a turbo build is to figure out what kind of manifolds you will use and then what kind of turbos the manifold will allow you to use. with my manifolds i can run any standard dsm turbo, with braineacks he can run just baout any standard t3 turbo. i have no timming control, he does. he runs an Intercooler i run WI. we both run high fuel pressure to compensate for our stock ecus. buthe runs a peiburg inline whereas i opted to tune the 255 with a non standard base fp regulator. there is a ton of stuff to go around here. just take a look and keep asking questions eventualy you will get a feel for what you like. and go with that. most importantly dont rush just be patient and do some research it pays off.
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Old 10-12-2006, 03:35 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djskaizan View Post
I'm new to the forum
Hey

Quote:
Originally Posted by djskaizan View Post
I've seen several kits on ebay, ......... Any advice would be greatly appreciated. DJ
Heres a thread on the subject:

https://www.miataturbo.net/forums/showthread.php?t=4854

The kit is a bad joke, good job asking here before buying
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Old 10-12-2006, 05:49 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djskaizan View Post
I'd already seen your current build. I'm asking if you view your current setup as the optimal one. Assuming that your setup was not done all at once (i.e. no upgrades over time), you may have parts that are not the the "best part", but you have decided to keep it because it's already on the car or because the incentive of upgrading isn't justified by the cost (time/money).

If you're saying that your system is perfect, then my question has been answered. Thanks for the time and response, DJ

Not optimal, but damn effective. I'd seriously consider engine management as part of the build. Definatly on the list.

If I could do it again, I'd make sure I'd do everything right the first time and not do a patch job to what the PO built.

Before my fuel upgrade I was running 1.8 injectors, 12:1 rise, and OEM FP @ 165rwhp. It was quite nice, but I was limited by fuel and I didn't feel safe pushing the AFR. Now at 190rwhp and safer fueling, it's quite nicer. Drop a 1.8 rear in and I'll be very happy. Drop an ECU and tune the fuel perfectly and I'll be done for the most part.
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Old 10-13-2006, 01:18 AM   #20
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done are we ever done. it seems to just keep on going forever.
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