9.0.1-9.5.1 gt2876r ar.63? - Page 2 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


DIY Turbo Discussion greddy on a 1.8? homebrew kit?

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 03-27-2011, 11:55 PM   #21
Elite Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 8,782
Total Cats: 119
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by livemind View Post
specific and honest headroom would be after final tuning just sub350whp. my last car i had set up to run 345whp on the street and 370whp at the track, my goal is to keep the same type of set up in a car that is smaller lighter and handles better, and also needs less power. my whp # goal is Street:290whp Track:sub350whp

This is great. Your power goals keep going up and up and up. I like this thread.

Buy my hotside. GT3071 .82 A/R w/ BEGI S5 manifold, tial wastegate and 3" stainless steel downpipe. 23psi in 5th gear by 3700RPM as of last night. My turbo has plenty of headroom still to make more power.

Oh and by the way I am running stock head gasket and have 9:1 pistons. 398hp.
Faeflora is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 01:31 AM   #22
Newb
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 23
Total Cats: 0
Default

Faeflora dual tuning is a pretty common thing, and gaining more power during the course of tuning is not uncommon, Nagase asked me to be honest and complete with my numbers, in my first post i wrote 300hp, my goal for my car is 290whp to drive on the street, sub350whp on the track, that in no way changes my power goals, it just further explained the setup i was aiming for. im not trying to start an argument, just defending that i may be dumb but im not a dumb kid that is coming on here to smoke pipe dreams of a fast turbo car at 30psi that "drives like a gokart". im sure that happens alot, it certainly does on ka-t.

that being said: i wasnt sure if bumping the comp. with a headgasket worked on the 1.8 or not, obviously the stock one can put some serious numbers down (398 8k rev thats hella impressive) but the gt30 is a little (lot) bigger than i want haha thanks though, how much monies are you selling it for?
livemind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 01:33 AM   #23
MT Pony Underground
iTrader: (6)
 
Nagase's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,811
Total Cats: 0
Default

You still need to do a LOT of research before you spend money on bumping compression or headgaskets. You're sounding really noobish.
Nagase is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 01:52 AM   #24
Newb
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 23
Total Cats: 0
Default

im not disputing the nubish comment at all, thanks again for the advice and info
livemind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 01:56 AM   #25
Elite Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 8,782
Total Cats: 119
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by livemind View Post
Faeflora dual tuning is a pretty common thing, and gaining more power during the course of tuning is not uncommon, Nagase asked me to be honest and complete with my numbers, in my first post i wrote 300hp, my goal for my car is 290whp to drive on the street, sub350whp on the track, that in no way changes my power goals, it just further explained the setup i was aiming for. im not trying to start an argument, just defending that i may be dumb but im not a dumb kid that is coming on here to smoke pipe dreams of a fast turbo car at 30psi that "drives like a gokart". im sure that happens alot, it certainly does on ka-t.

that being said: i wasnt sure if bumping the comp. with a headgasket worked on the 1.8 or not, obviously the stock one can put some serious numbers down (398 8k rev thats hella impressive) but the gt30 is a little (lot) bigger than i want haha thanks though, how much monies are you selling it for?
Actually I wasn't being sarcastic. My car is significantly more fun at 400hp than it was at 200hp. Much of the turbo miata community is afraid of over 300hp. More power is more fun.

I'd sell my hotside for $1900.
Faeflora is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 02:12 AM   #26
Newb
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 23
Total Cats: 0
Default

pm me some pics
livemind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 02:15 AM   #27
MT Pony Underground
iTrader: (6)
 
Nagase's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,811
Total Cats: 0
Default

You don't want this noob's chewed up turbo.

Trust me.

You really don't.

I'd recommend contacting Abe at ARTech or Tim at ABSURDflow, get a manifold, downpipe, exhaust, pick up a 2871 .86, get some Trackspeed inconel studs and be done with it. You'd have an optimal setup (as long as you didn't get a log manifold or something dumb) that would actually last in track conditions.

And you'd have a turbo that isn't chewed to hell.
Nagase is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 02:20 AM   #28
Tour de Franzia
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by livemind View Post
im sorry to sound really redundant, but i dont know how to read turbo maps, can you explain why getting the 71 with a bigger AR would be better than the 76 with a smaller AR? i am not totally knowledgeable on this by any means, but from what i gathered from reading getting the larger compressor with the smaller turbine would allow for decent spool time while leaving a little more head room for higher boost. maybe im backwards, please correct me if im wrong
Here is the one from my car, just for the sake of conversation, and to simplify all that **** in regards to our engines.
http://www.maptun.com/webshop/pics_f...548_comp_e.jpg
Today I ran the car at 14psi which is a "pressure ratio" of 2; it's making about 260whp which is about 23-25 "lb/min of air flow" (it's fast). That's right in the prime island, when I lower boost to 9psi, I'm way under and power falls off quickly. The closer you get to the prime island, the more efficient and better the turbo selection.

As for the turbine map, that's a little different. The pressure ratio and flow don't correspond with the compressor, think of the amount of pressure in the exhaust manifold. The bigger the turbine AR, the more it flows and less backpressure it makes. Lot's of people think a smaller turbine will make the turbo spool-up to target boost faster...my turbo is a perfect example where this is not true. The smaller turbine makes less power and spins up slower. A larger turbine means less bottle neck, more spark angle, and smoother "spool-up".
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 02:21 AM   #29
Elite Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 8,782
Total Cats: 119
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nagase View Post
You don't want this noob's chewed up turbo.

Trust me.

You really don't.

I'd recommend contacting Abe at ARTech or Tim at ABSURDflow, get a manifold, downpipe, exhaust, pick up a 2871 .86, get some Trackspeed inconel studs and be done with it. You'd have an optimal setup (as long as you didn't get a log manifold or something dumb) that would actually last in track conditions.

And you'd have a turbo that isn't chewed to hell.
This noob's setup will **** all over yours any day... call me back when you make some real power.

My 3071 is actually in perfect shape- I just was not used to what a turbo sounds like at 20psi.
Faeflora is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 02:23 AM   #30
Newb
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 23
Total Cats: 0
Default

hahaha yeah i just read up on Faeflora's build thread, pretty cool but definitely not my style or what im going for
livemind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 02:25 AM   #31
Tour de Franzia
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Faeflora View Post
My 3071 is actually in perfect shape- I just was not used to what a turbo sounds like at 20psi.
Remember back to 2008, back when I was building my car, and everyone told me the GT2860RS was too big, my turbine was too large, and that it would be tough to drive? I wanted 300whp then, got it, now I race it at 210 and 240whp, lol. Oh the times, how they change.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 02:27 AM   #32
Newb
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 23
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hustler View Post
The closer you get to the prime island, the more efficient and better the turbo selection.

As for the turbine map, that's a little different. The pressure ratio and flow don't correspond with the compressor, think of the amount of pressure in the exhaust manifold. The bigger the turbine AR, the more it flows and less backpressure it makes. Lot's of people think a smaller turbine will make the turbo spool-up to target boost faster...my turbo is a perfect example where this is not true. The smaller turbine makes less power and spins up slower. A larger turbine means less bottle neck, more spark angle, and smoother "spool-up".
yeah i definitely fell into the belief that smalled turbine was better, in a way it seems to make sense, but now im stuck looking like a retard, should have read more first before posting haha.
livemind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 07:52 AM   #33
MT Pony Underground
iTrader: (6)
 
Nagase's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,811
Total Cats: 0
Default

Just remember, this isn't a general rule. This is a situational rule.

The smaller A/R on gt28/30 turbos is a bottleneck. Getting rid of it is eliminating a choke point. This doesn't mean you should go to a GT45 with a 2.88 A/R.
Nagase is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 09:15 AM   #34
Murderator
iTrader: (76)
 
18psi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 36,185
Total Cats: 2,582
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Faeflora View Post
Actually I wasn't being sarcastic. My car is significantly more fun at 400hp than it was at 200hp. Much of the turbo miata community is afraid of over 300hp. More power is more fun.

I'd sell my hotside for $1900.
More power -> more broken parts and for what? It was really chilly saturday night and I spun 4th on the freeway. Stepped out pretty hard and scared the **** out of me. I'd say 300 is plenty fun
18psi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 10:51 AM   #35
Elite Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 8,782
Total Cats: 119
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 18psi View Post
More power -> more broken parts and for what? It was really chilly saturday night and I spun 4th on the freeway. Stepped out pretty hard and scared the **** out of me. I'd say 300 is plenty fun
More broken parts only if you drive like a drunk chimpanzee.

More power is more fun. Turn up the boost a little...
Faeflora is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 11:01 AM   #36
Boost Czar
iTrader: (61)
 
Braineack's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 72,860
Total Cats: 1,788
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nagase View Post
The 2560 is too small for that.

The next size up is the 2860... which isn't much different than the 2871.
the 2560 and 2860 share the same compressor wheel, you won't be gaining that much more power output potential with the 2860, only what the turbine efficiency nets you. the compressor will still tap out at ~300rwhp.

which makes the 2871 the next logical choice.
Braineack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2011, 05:23 PM   #37
MT Pony Underground
iTrader: (6)
 
Nagase's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,811
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
the 2560 and 2860 share the same compressor wheel, you won't be gaining that much more power output potential with the 2860, only what the turbine efficiency nets you. the compressor will still tap out at ~300rwhp.

which makes the 2871 the next logical choice.
That would only be true if the compressor is the limiting factor instead of the turbine (unsure), and they're not exactly the same in any case:

2560:
46.5mm 60.1mm 60 0.60 53.0mm 62 0.64

2860RS:
47.2mm 60.1mm 62 0.60 53.9mm 76 0.64

So it's not huge, .7mm more inducer, 2 more trim. But if the limiting factor was the compressor instead of the turbine, going to a .86 A/R turbine housing shouldn't gain power... but it does.
Nagase is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2011, 03:29 AM   #38
Newb
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 23
Total Cats: 0
Default

again i really appreciate the explanations, im also RE-opening my copy of Maximum Boost, one more question, is there alot to be gained from buying the MS3 diy kit or can i get bassically the features i need out of the Ms pnp which i believe is a ms1?
livemind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2011, 12:01 PM   #39
MT Pony Underground
iTrader: (6)
 
Nagase's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,811
Total Cats: 0
Default

Best answer:
http://www.msextra.com/feature-xref.html

Short answer:
MS1 won't let you do sequential fuel and spark. Other than that, I was really happy with my MSPNP until I needed to run an LS1 throttle body and GM idle valve. Not really applicable to you just yet.
Nagase is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
hks top mount gt2876r 1.8 locomonkeyboricua Miata parts for sale/trade 56 07-05-2014 02:32 PM
f/s Lightly used Gt2876r and HKS SSQV bov. Slidinmiata Miata parts for sale/trade 0 09-17-2013 06:01 PM
For Sale: GT2876R Almost New + Injectors (660cc) bcrx7 Miata parts for sale/trade 11 02-17-2012 02:29 PM
turbo confusion delcbr DIY Turbo Discussion 4 08-27-2010 12:01 PM
New Garrett GT2876R (Local CL ad) - $900 RotorNutFD3S Miata parts for sale/trade 3 02-12-2009 05:21 PM


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:59 PM.