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DIY Turbo Discussion greddy on a 1.8? homebrew kit?

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Old 06-18-2006, 10:38 AM   #1
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Ever since I put the exhaust on the car is burning a ton of oil (yes, a TON). My guess is that I have too much play in the DP and it broke the turbo oil seals somehow (just a guess). My manifold is cracked again too. I had written myself a note and put it on my desk that says "Will only having one exhaust hanger cause my manifold to break". I think I know the answer to that one now.

So, how easy is it to replace the oil seals in a turbo?

If you were really pouring smoke out the tailpipe would you be expecting the oil seals in the turbo? Would looking in the IC piping for oil prove that the turbo is where it came from?

I was thinking that my oil drain hose might have crimped up or something with all the work I just did around it but I looked at it today (actually cut an inch off of it to make it a little more vertical) and it looks fine.

This is something that happened all of the sudden. When I took the car down for the exhaust/WBO2 work everything was fine. When I put it back together and fired her up she is smoking like crazy (at idle and when stomping on it).
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Old 06-18-2006, 10:59 AM   #2
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do you have a ballbearing turbo or journal bearings? the journal bearing-type is cheaper to repair. do you have a flex pipe on the DP? i can't back this up, but i belive the flex pipe reduces the stress on the turbo and manifold.

look around on the web for the seal replacement proceedure. i think there was a good pictoral and step by step explaination on a grand national site. there is also a place in texas(?) that remans them and turns them around in about a day.
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Old 06-18-2006, 06:18 PM   #3
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I don't see how there's any way that stresses on the turbine/manifold/dp section of the turbine would cause the problems you're describing. If the compressor housing was rigidly mounted to another part of car, maybe, as both sides would be putting stresses on the CHRA. Even then, I'd find it hard to believe.
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Old 06-18-2006, 06:26 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kung fu jesus
do you have a ballbearing turbo or journal bearings? the journal bearing-type is cheaper to repair. do you have a flex pipe on the DP? i can't back this up, but i belive the flex pipe reduces the stress on the turbo and manifold.

look around on the web for the seal replacement proceedure. i think there was a good pictoral and step by step explaination on a grand national site. there is also a place in texas(?) that remans them and turns them around in about a day.
No idea. It is a T25 off a DSM (that is all I know about the turbo).

Yes, there is a flex pipe (braided hose) built into the dp but I have it pretty tight right now. The horrible alignment of the dp forces me to push the end of it upward to get the muffler aligned correctly.
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Old 06-18-2006, 06:27 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bripab007
I don't see how there's any way that stresses on the turbine/manifold/dp section of the turbine would cause the problems you're describing. If the compressor housing was rigidly mounted to another part of car, maybe, as both sides would be putting stresses on the CHRA. Even then, I'd find it hard to believe.
Thanks. It was just strange that it started all the sudden. It has never smoked at idle like this before except the first day that it was installed where I had a flat spot on my oil return.
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Old 06-19-2006, 05:32 AM   #6
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Head gasket or rings
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Old 06-19-2006, 12:14 PM   #7
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Maybe u just blew the seal, and its just a coencidence that it happened when you were working on that area of the car....possible yes, probable..not really.
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Old 06-19-2006, 12:46 PM   #8
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When you blew the seals you'll usually see oil burning out of the bearing housing, not just the exhaust. In fact I wasn't getting any smoke out of the exhaust before I rebuilt my blow turbo and only in the engine bay.

Is there smoke comming out of the oil cap once you turn off the engine?
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Old 06-19-2006, 05:26 PM   #9
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A few comments.

Some oil in the intercooler is expected and normal ... even a bit more if the emission system is not modified. I pull mine every couple of years and slosh it out with some lacquor thinner to restore the efficiency.

One way to check the seals is after a drive, pull the intake to expose the front turbo blades. Let it set for an hour or two and check for a fresh oil dribble. Only way it will get there is thru the seals.

Don't see how the downpipe could cause the turbo failure but probably a good suspect for the cracked manifold problems.
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Old 06-19-2006, 10:59 PM   #10
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If the smoke is plentiful, and especially if NOT sensitive to rpm, then its the turbo. I've heard of ill fitting downpipes jacking bearings before. Also, too much oil pressure will blow the seals out. I had the latter problem on a car once, and now will not run a turbo without the restrictor in the oil feed.
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Old 06-22-2006, 11:35 PM   #11
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I took a look at something tonight but I am not sure what it means.

I disconnected the oil supply to my turbo. There was no oil restrictor in there (not sure if I need one or not).
I then let the car idle until warm and with the car running I disconnected the oil drain line. There was not a huge amount of oil built up in the return line so I don't think oil is backing up into the turbo. There was definitely positive pressure at the oil pan coming from the turbo drain fitting(I guess this is normal). So, I guess the problem is not that oil is backing up, it is more of a seal problem. I did have a very large exhaust leak at the manifold and you could see that liquid oil (I think) had come out of the crack. I don't think that an exhaust leak can cause an oil problem but I wanted to make sure that I let everyone know. Any ideas?
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Old 06-23-2006, 12:57 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rmcelwee
There was definitely positive pressure at the oil pan coming from the turbo drain fitting(I guess this is normal).
I don't think this sounds right. Do you have your crankcase vent plumbed into the turbo inlet?

You are saying there's positive pressure coming out of the crankcase/pan, right?
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Old 06-23-2006, 02:09 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bripab007
I don't think this sounds right. Do you have your crankcase vent plumbed into the turbo inlet?

You are saying there's positive pressure coming out of the crankcase/pan, right?
I have the normal pvc to intake manifold on one side and a small K&N filter on the other side of the cam cover. I'm not sure if pressure is blowing out of the K&K filter or not. I did look at my pvc tonight and it is working fine (can blow in it one way but not the other).
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Old 06-23-2006, 09:28 AM   #14
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You'll want to remove the little filter and run that into the intake path. It will really help with oil drainage. I had to do the same thing.
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Old 06-23-2006, 09:53 AM   #15
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Yes, if you've been running the K&N filter like that since the turbo was installed, it's possible that you messed up the seals on the cartridge by not allowing the oil to drain fast enough. I'm not saying it'll definitely fix your problem at this point, but you should plumb the driver's-side cam crankcase vent to the turbo's intake tract and drive it like that for a day or two. You might get lucky!

Regardless of whether or not that fixes the problem at this stage in the game, you should be running it like that for future turbos anyway.
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Old 06-23-2006, 10:41 AM   #16
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For those not running the maf and associated intake track length- I question the amount of vacuum pre compressor. I've set up my breather tube as such and I'm still getting significant crankcase pressure (new motor, good compression). The honda camp actually runs the breather tube to the exhaust with an intermediate catch can for fluids. This apparently provides the necessary vacuum needed with a turbo set up (for them). - rob
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Old 06-23-2006, 11:59 AM   #17
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So what're you questioning, exactly, in regards the crankcase breather vacuum?

I've also seen the breather plumbed into the exhaust tract, but I would think you'd pull a better vacuum from the turbo inlet than you would from scavenging exhaust pulses.
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Old 06-23-2006, 12:46 PM   #18
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Would a 3-1/2" dia. x 5" long intake tract, with the vent hose placed in the middle (2-1/2" from the turbo inlet) pull the same vacuum as an 18" tract (given everything else is the same)? I haven't put a gauge on mine to see what it's pulling. I did make a slash cut on the vent pipe in the intake to enhance the vacuum effect. Never added a catch can, but I'm considering it in "MSM" fashion with a dump to the turbo drain tube. It looks to me as though that would also improve crankcase ventilation.
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Old 06-23-2006, 01:20 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m2cupcar
Would a 3-1/2" dia. x 5" long intake tract, with the vent hose placed in the middle (2-1/2" from the turbo inlet) pull the same vacuum as an 18" tract (given everything else is the same)?
I think so, otherwise airflow meters wouldn't work, right?

What do you mean by a "slash cut on the vent pipe?"
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Old 06-23-2006, 02:02 PM   #20
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I can't find the exact reference. But it's something like this- by cutting the tube that enters the airflow at an angle, facing the opening towards the inlet (with the flow), the incoming air passes over the tube at different rates. This results in a faster flow of air at the base of the cut (since it has a larger obstruction to travel around) and creates (or in this case enhances) the vacuum at the opening of the vent tube.
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