Trackspeed Stage 2 VVT shortblock, EFR6758, E85, 452whp/427wtq@26psi. I'm scared.
 

I'm scared of this one :party:

Motor:

• Trackspeed "Stage 2" shortblock
  • 83.5mm Supertech 8.6:1 piston w/ thermal coating
  • Manley H-beam rods
  • ACL Race bearings
  • ARP head/main studs
  • Boundary Stage 2 oil pump
• OEM untouched BP6D head
• OEM valves
• OEM solid lifters
• Supertech heavy double valvesprings
• OEM BP6D cams
• OEM EUDM Squaretop manifold

Turbo:

• Trackspeed Turbo Kit w/ BW EFR6758 0.64a/r
• Precision 350hp intercooler
• prototype Trackspeed IC pipes
• Enthuza 3" exhaust

EMS/Fuel/Ignition:

• MSLabs MS3 Basic w/ CAN Wideband
• Innovate LC-2
• Injector Dynamics ID1000 (96%DC max, lol)
• Walbro 455lph E85 fuel pump
• Rewired fuel pump (dedicated relay)
• OEM BP6D fuel rail, OEM returnless forward of FPR
• Fuelab 535 FPR (60psi w/ 1:1 boost reference)
• Fuelab 818 filter (6ppm Fiberglass media)
• E85 (80% actual content)
• prototype Trackspeed GM D585 coils

452whp, 427wtq. 292kpa peak at 4130rpm, bleeding off to ~278kpa by 4500 and staying around there (-/- 3kpa) to redline. 26psi of boost. Peak timing of 19.5deg at 6600rpm. Same exact mechanical setup that did 297/272 a couple of weeks ago on gas with the exception of the fuel pump (swapped DW300 for Walbro 455-E85). After steady-state tuning and taking an educated guess at fueling, it made ~330whp at 220kpa at the old timing numbers, then ~360whp at the same boost level with ~20deg of timing. From there, I just kept adding boost. Timing is conservative, I am a couple degrees back from MBT everywhere.

The lower lines are what I will drive it at, 415whp/386wtq and ~84% peak duty cycle. Peak of 265kpa, holding ~258kpa all the way through. ~23psi of boost. At that power level it wants to turn the tires in 4th gear at 90mph on dry pavement.

That's it. My goal was 400whp, anything beyond that was gravy. With a usable, safe (lol) 415whp and an Internet Hero-Pull(TM) map at 450whp+, I couldn't be happier. There's nothing further planned for the powerplant in this car.

Excuse me while I update my life insurance policy.

Attachment 229655

muwahhahahahahahaha

it seriously feels insane doesn't it? like "hold on let me make sure the road is empty and straight while I dip into the throttle in 6th or I might change lanes" insane

....mommy....

It burps and pops all the way through 3rd gear up to 80mph with the Racelogic. A soft 4th gear roll and it wants to spin the tires at 90mph. It's unusable :rofl:

It's so fast that it can't even be captured on film!


(Also: What trans?)

So nuts!

Keeping a spare 6-speed in the trunk?

Stock 6-speed reinforced with thoughts and prayers.

This is amazeballs.

What clutch are you running?

Very impressive results, I bet that is a riot to drive!

The pressure plate is an off-the-shelf ACT 1.8L XT. The disc is a custom piece with an organic/feramic friction surface (full-face organic on one side, pucked feramic on the other). The dual-friction setup is supposed to add ~20% or so to the standard ACT setup. At 23psi I am right at the theoretical limits of the clutch, at 26psi I'm past them. I have a new proto piece rated in the 450wtq range on the shelf that will go in soon.

:sigh: :(

If you can refrain from taking it to the track, a Quaife gearset will likely keep you off the guardrail and/or reduce the chance of a stunting ticket. While my car isn't quite as nutso as yours, it hooks up completely in 2nd. Alternatively, this might create the impetus for you to finish development of that T5 kit. Either way, very, very noice.

Ohhhhhmyyyy. 3-4 grand looks like a freaking riot.

Nice :likecat:

I'm scared too, that thing is gonna whip my arse.

I think whats most impressive is the spoolup of the turbo. It actually hits early enough in the rpms to make a insane amount of torque where the BP really likes it. Well done.

Congrats dude.

I think the Kmiata BMW trans swap will make infinitely more sense. They reliably hold 800+hp and have been used with not horrible results above 4 figure power numbers :eek3:

Yes, except that the gearing isn't much better than the stock 6-speed. The nice thing about the Quaife gears is that they're tall enough to enable you to put ludicrous amounts of power to the ground. The KMiata swap will require changing out the final drive (probably with a Getrag diff) to something lower than even the oft-anticipated 3.3 r&p.

The Quaife gears are beefy and will put up with tons of abuse (I autocrossed for years with my first set, with numerous smoky burnouts aimed at impressing the hoi polloi). It was only once I started tracking that they failed. My theory is that the 5-speed case can't handle the heat, starts expanding and the gears no longer mesh properly. A chipped tooth will inevitably result.

I'm considering the KMiata swap, but am reluctant to discard my really cool (and bulletproof) Guru billet differential. Besides, I retired my '93 from track duties and now have an MSM to fill that role.

The BMW 6sp swap is on the shortlist for trans options. The shorter 1-2 ratios are annoying but not a huge issue in a car that will spin 1st and 2nd anyway. I would only consider it if I can use an OEM rear diff, since I don't want to hassle with aftermarket parts or solid/poly mounts back there if I don't need to. For now, I am just being nice to the 6-speed - no more hard shifts, trying to limit WOT use in 3rd and 4th. It pulls hilariously hard in 5th anyway :)

If you are spinning in 6th, you have snow tires on.

I know of 5 500wtq v8 miatas that hook (2 on "street" tires), and 2 600+wtq turbo v8 miatas that hook, IN FIRST GEAR.

There is something wrong with your alignment, suspension, and tires if you are spinning that hard, when FAR faster vehicles have ZERO issues.

RIP

Temperature, summer tires, humidity all make a difference. I can spin 3rd on dry pavement depending on the temperature. Cars that hook, still get a bit loose sometimes, and it can be a little unnerving at speed. Enjoy that thing, sounds like fun to me.

While the Quaife gearset is a good option, it is still ultimately a band aid on a weak trans. I think case deflection (not thermal expansion) is the ultimate killer. Besides, autoX and hella sick burnouts will easily overwhelm tire traction, its 3rd-4th-5th WOT action where the motor can actually produce full power without losing traction that breaks things.

The e30 5-speeds are geared taller than the e46 5/6 speeds, might be a good option for you, especially if you're trying to retain that rear end.

Contrats, those are some really impressive numbers. I felt like your original goal of 400hp with this build was super conservative, glad to see you absolutely smash that.

Im in the middle of building my motor now with pretty much the same setup as you. Do you think id be fine with a DW300 or is the 455 necessary. Also is there any reason you didnt do oversize valves or are they just kind of un necessary on the BP6D head

TSE is working on their own T5 transmission swap project. I am sure when it is to Savington's liking he will swap it into this car if the 6 speed goes.

cool story bro. you ever driven one of these cars yourself? No?

It could be his alignment settings too. The alignment I found best to hook in a straight line is predictably a terrible alignment for hitting the turns. If his alignment is optimized for turning, then it's not optimized for straight line traction. A great tire that's not making good contact with the road is going to spin when you make a lot of power.

Yeah can't run maximum caster in the back if you wanna hook up.

That's fun that people think a T5 is going to hold this long term.

I have full confidence savington has no idea what he's doing. he's just a dyno queen builder.

I heard he flew Hyper out to tune his car

Hyper turned him down. Too busy sackriding 1.6-boosting child molesters.

DW300 would probably do it. They updated the 300 a couple of years ago and the flow is very close to the 400-E85 at high pressure. I swapped because my DW300 failed a couple of weeks ago (complete failure, just stopped turning on). I had no indication that the Walbro pump was anywhere near the limit - the VE table only rises 10% or so from 200kpa to 300kpa since I have a boost reference. Fuel pressure on the hero pass was 84-85psi.

Valves and headwork would be very beneficial at this power level. It won't make a big difference on torque, but it would probably have pushed this setup north of 500whp.

Sweet! You are now my most expensive friend:party:

Very nice, congrats. Glad it all came together so well. Hope to see it in action next fall.

Sav builds a swagger wagon. :party:

So Savington, given the nature of what I think this build is - mainly a road car that can be tracked with devastating results - what would be your ideal:
1. road wheel tyre combo, and
2. semi-slick wheel/tyre combo for the track?

This is strictly a road car. Full interior, all the trimmings, plus a few I've added (traction control and active suspension). In spite of the crazy dyno numbers, my well-developed road race car (Rover) is 5+ seconds per lap faster than Acamas is, owing entirely to lower weight, better aero development, and suspension that's optimized for road course performance. I did several track days in this car in 2016 and early 2017, but it's both slower and less fun than Rover is, so once Rover was up and running, I retired Acamas from track use.

To answer your question, the ideal road wheel/tire combo depends on your goals. I wanted maximum straight-line traction, reasonable longevity, and decent ride quality, so I have a 245/40 Hankook RS4 on a 15x9 6UL. If I wanted to trade ride quality for cornering grip, I would go up to a 15x10. If I wanted less longevity and more grip, I would go to a 245/40 Rival S.

For a track wheel/tire combo, it's the same answer - it depends on your goals. On Rover, I use a 245/40 Maxxis RC-1 most of the time, because it's inexpensive, long-lasting, and forgiving. If I want to maximize speed, I swap up to a 245/40 Hoosier R7. Both are on 15x10 6ULs.

Do you think the 6758 have enough air to reach 500hp?
One sick turbo if it does!

Head work would cause a big drop in the boost required at the same HP?
Any IAT drop is always nice at the track!
Would allow a big jump in the pump gas tune as well I would think?

Killer build Andrew!!

The 297/272 was weak. Like circa 2007/GT2560R/RX7 550's/MS1/no VVT weak. Good to see this same hardware being pushed proper. Exciting times! Paul recently acquired another miata, I have been pushing him your way.

Nice job Andrew.

RE: T5 trans: it would handle anything you can throw at it in a car as light as a miata. But with the bolt-in BMW trans option, why would you go with a T5?

The head is not ported in any way and has stock cams and still makes 10hp/psi?

Its extremely strong, in my opinion. The turbo must be extremely free flowing on the exhaust side.

Dann

Will it? I know a few guys that have broken them and gone to TKO500s with just bolt on 5.0s on factory 5 cobras that weight in the 2400lb neighborhood. I'm personally worried about mine, but it would get built into a dogbox is it blew. Also supposedly the T5s dont like shifting above 6500rpm. I havent run into that problem, might be because I have a twin disk or might be because I dont have a tach and I have no idea what rpm I shift at.

Hyper is tuning his NB...

:laugh:

Andrew, did you ever document your fuel system build? I am planning out my winter purchase and want to copy what you did (or maybe just buy it all from you?).

You kept it returnless correct? Did you put the e85 sensor in the engine bay or in the fuel filter location like the Flyin' Miata kit? Would you be able to talk me through it via email if not on MT.net?

its all in his thread

Ok, looking now. I must have missed it. Edit: crap, I found it, and I saw it back when it was posted and have been trying to find it ever since. Sorry for mudding up your thread. Feel free to delete both posts.

Fuel system starts at post #331 here: https://www.miataturbo.net/build-thr...t-84579/page6/

Cliffs notes: DW300 or Walbro 450-E85 in the tank, 10awg milspec wired to bypass the OEM connector with bulkhead isolators, dedicated 30A relay wired straight to the battery. Gates $20/ft submersible E85 hose inside the tank, Earl's Vaporguard everywhere else. Fuelab 818 filter replaces the stock unit. Fuelab 535 regulator at the back of the car, OEM lines forward of the rear bulkhead, OEM fuel rail, ID1000s. I sell all of it.

:rofl:

That's where I plan to get my fueling stuff.

fixed.
Carlos, hurry up and buy allofit to run allofit

I am driving for a minute, when it's dry out anyway

I cannot emphasize how dangerous this car would be in the wet without the Racelogic gods preventing me from doing stupid things :rofl:

Seriously, even my car must be driven like an elderly person in wet conditions. Any gear, super dangerous.

The racelogic is no longer available, correct?

It is NLA, sadly. For a race car it's not terribly useful since it's pretty intrusive while cornering, but for a street car it is pretty magical.

So what do us mere mortals do, ms3?

Not sure. I have never played with the MS3's traction control strategies. The RL actually intercepts the injector pulses, which is the right way to do it IMO (even better than DBW throttle management). I wish the MS3 would do the same - all it would need is the four wheel speed sensor inputs from the ABS system and some code (and maybe some licensing dollars to Racelogic).

You re-calibrate your right foot, or make a "rain" map