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Old 03-22-2008, 03:35 PM   #1
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Question EMU + COPs on NB - difficult startup

Hi,

as mentioned in another thread I got my EMU with the COPs on my (1,6) NB running. Without EMU car starts immediatly, with EMU and COPs car starts only if I crank for a long time. (Mostly it starts only in the moment I stop cranking.)

Any suggestions? Injector lag times setting at the EMU? (What would I put in there for 305 supra injectors?)

Thanks
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Old 03-24-2008, 10:36 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaphod View Post
Hi,

as mentioned in another thread I got my EMU with the COPs on my (1,6) NB running. Without EMU car starts immediatly, with EMU and COPs car starts only if I crank for a long time. (Mostly it starts only in the moment I stop cranking.)

Any suggestions? Injector lag times setting at the EMU? (What would I put in there for 305 supra injectors?)

Thanks
hmmmmm
not sure how much the injector lag time has to do with cops it is basically just for the injectors as far as i know. keep us updated i would like to hear you succeed.
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Old 03-25-2008, 06:04 AM   #3
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I will keep you updated. Have to swap the valve cover (made an extra one with brackets for the COPs and painted it.) Will then really fix the COPs onto the valve cover and have another go.

Greets
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Old 03-26-2008, 05:26 AM   #4
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O.K. got my new vlave cover installed -

Car is starting - still a little strange though

Starting process goes like this -

Ignition on - Pushing my Starter button - cranking (no ignition) - letting go the button - pop (misfiring) --> same procedure 2 times --> third time the car starts when I let go the starter button.

Anyone got a idea what could cause this behaviour? Maybe I should try some bigger wires feeding the +12V to the COPs?

Thanks for your help!
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Old 03-28-2008, 09:41 AM   #5
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There's good and bad news from my COP+EMU setup.

Good news - I sourced the problem down to be within the EMU, because if I bridge the Ch 1 and Ch 2 ignition pins at the EMU end of the boomslang - the car starts immediatly. (Just like at Sams video, but I#m not giggling so much... )

Bad news - I have no clue why this would be. That's where I hope to get some input from you.

Thanks guys!

Greets
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Old 03-29-2008, 01:37 PM   #6
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Is there really nobody running the EMU+COPs combination?
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Old 03-29-2008, 04:35 PM   #7
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I am bidding on a toyota cop set right now on ebay (and i have a emu on my 99)
What's your jumper setup on emu? +5v o +12v output to coils?
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Old 03-30-2008, 02:44 AM   #8
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The jumper 8 is set to +12V, because the Toyota coils are running on a 12v system

Greets
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Old 03-30-2008, 10:20 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaphod View Post
The jumper 8 is set to +12V, because the Toyota coils are running on a 12v system
Are the coils fired by 12v?? I know someone running the EMU on the Mazda system and he had to set it to 5v since the coils trigger on 5 volts.
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Old 03-30-2008, 02:24 PM   #10
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As I wrote I have the problem running the Toyota Coil on Plug system, not the OEM Mazda system. (The OEM Mazda system is running flawless with the EMU - as the COP system is without the EMU...)

So 12V is O.K.

Greets
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Old 03-31-2008, 09:51 PM   #11
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Ok, so I'm trying to understand the problem here. I've measured the voltage through my COPS wiring harness and all four COPS are seeing 12v at the 12v pin. The tach connections are only seeing 11.2v. So is the EMB piggy just drawing too much voltage from the triggers?

I wired my EMB years ago so I don't have a Boomslang. I'm not excited about clipping the EMB wiring to check my COPs firing. Can I just have to cut the 12v power to to the EMB to check?
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Old 04-01-2008, 01:06 AM   #12
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No, you just have to reconnect the two OEM ignition channels ECU to ignition. and take the EMB out there - everything else makes no difference.

Greets
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Old 04-01-2008, 12:13 PM   #13
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If you see the thread that OG just posted .... it has a picture of how to make a jumper basically to pull the EM out of the ignition wiring......

Uses a mazda radio harness connector to go over the stock EM plug.

Dave,
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Old 04-01-2008, 11:27 PM   #14
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I'm still trying to understand what the issue is.

So you can set the jumpers to run 12v to the ignition like the Toyota instead of the 5v for the stock Miata.

You can set the rotary switches to run 4 coils instead of 2 (don't know what the rotary setting is though). Has anybody tried this?

Is the problem that you still have to fire two COPs at a time (wasted spark?) with the Miata.
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Old 04-02-2008, 01:18 AM   #15
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The problem is, that the voltages for the coils drop just enough inside the EMB to keep the coils from firing.

Plug the ignition Connector out of the EMB and bridge the in and out lines with a little wire or paper clip. I dont recall anymore what the settings for 12V at the EMB were.

Greets
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Old 04-02-2008, 02:14 AM   #16
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Quote:
The problem is, that the voltages for the coils drop just enough inside the EMB to keep the coils from firing.
Why does that have to happen though? The EMB has settings for the stock Toyota 4 COP set-up. I guess I'm asking why those settings can't be used to run the same 4 COPs retrofitted to a Miata.

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Plug the ignition Connector out of the EMB and bridge the in and out lines with a little wire or paper clip. I dont recall anymore what the settings for 12V at the EMB were.
I do understand that you can get the Miata to start if you run the Toyota COPs through the Miata's stock ECU. I snipped the connections to my ECU but I installed plugs so bridging the connection will not be a problem. Doesn't that take the EMB timing control offline though?

So where are we in this discussion thread Sven? There's no way to run COPs AND the EMB ignition control?
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Old 04-02-2008, 03:48 AM   #17
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Why does that have to happen though? The EMB has settings for the stock Toyota 4 COP set-up. I guess I'm asking why those settings can't be used to run the same 4 COPs retrofitted to a Miata.
Well the OEM Toyotas are made to fire 4 COPs - the Miata is made to fire 2 coil. Why the EMB/EMU lowers the voltage - I don't know - I'm a engineer but not an electrical. I emailed Greddy but got no reply until now.

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I do understand that you can get the Miata to start if you run the Toyota COPs through the Miata's stock ECU. I snipped the connections to my ECU but I installed plugs so bridging the connection will not be a problem. Doesn't that take the EMB timing control offline though?
Yes it will take the EMB timing controll out - but will show you if the EMB is your problem. (I myself didn't try this with the EMB but with the EMU - when I had my EMB it didn't get into my mind that this could be my problem)

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So where are we in this discussion thread Sven? There's no way to run COPs AND the EMB ignition control?
Well there maybe - over at the (here not very popular) Mnet is a guy who is trying to make a device which changes the signal to a perfect signal to the COPs. There is a thread called "COP? Coil on plug?" at the naturally aspirated section of the power mods forum. Go have a look. Maybe this is worth a shot.

Greets
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Old 04-02-2008, 03:54 PM   #18
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Yup, confirmed Sven. Reconnected 1G and 1H and it started right up, smooth as butter.
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Old 04-02-2008, 07:58 PM   #19
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FHS, did changing the switch from 5v to 12v fix the ignition issue with the EMB?
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Old 04-02-2008, 08:44 PM   #20
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Haven't tried it yet. I just wanted to confirm that it's the EMB and not the Cali ECU. Sven said he tried it with the EMU and got it to start but not easily. I don't want to damage anything so I'm holding back to see if that circuit board solution will work.

It's just one jumper so I'll let you know if i grow some bolas.
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