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Old 03-12-2013, 11:31 AM   #1
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Default Your dream ECU

So hypothetically, you have the means and knowledge to produce an ecu and have a design team working with you. As the boss you give the design team some deliverables (assume we ain't some new age brainstorming company). Whats this list look like.

Required
-Able to tune with VE on speed density with an accurate commanded AFR table.
-Able to tune with Alpha-n, either complete or blending with SD.
-Able to use and scale for all common pressure, temp (thermistor, thermocouple, RDT), air flow(Maf), position(potentiometer), speed (hall, VR), fuel ratio sensors (narrow and wide band), knock.
-Dedicated MAP, IAT, ECT, TPS, CAM, CRANK, knock, and VSS input.
-4 Dedicated coil outputs, and 4 Dedicated High z injector outputs (able to be setup sequential and non).
-10 General purpose I/Os
-IAT, ECT, and time after start based fuel and spark scaling.
-Closed loop idle control using either iac, spark, or both.
-Able to use PWM IACVs
-Closed loop fueling using either type of o2 sensor with adjust ability for entry and exit based on time after start, map, ect, tps.
-Ability to set bounds on all inputs and outputs which will allow user configurable response including error codes and a limp home mode.
-A limp home fuel and spark modifier value.
-Ability to configure timing of events based on cam/crank position is user configurable (even and odd fire engines possible).
-Ability to use up to 58 timing events per revolution for position, and not just by faking 58 events into 12 events.
-Tuning software should be not hateful, and should be able to display 3d tables in rotatable 3d images and flat tables.
-Single step Fuel and/or spark revlimiter.
-Open and closed loop electronic boost control.
-Boost control targets able to be set based on TPS as well as VSS.
-Individual cylinder fuel trimming, both manual and EGT based.
-Serial based communication.
-Ability to data log any inputs or outputs 8Mb onboard or direct to lap top.
-Ability for user defined input functions (IE make the ecu do whatever math you want).
-Tip in and Tip out fueling based on TPS or MAP (support asynchronous pulses).
-User adjustable DFCO based on VSS, TPS, and MAP
-Data log software capable of making histograms
-16x16 tables support, up to 6 user defined tables.
-OEM style sealed connectors.
-50Mhz 8bit processor.
-Timescale resolution to 0.01ms
-OEM style knock control.
-Ability to control dual VVT, and variable intake manifolds (and anything else you can think of because all GPIOs should be configurable into 3d table controls, like if I wanted I could put knock retard on the x-axis, tps on the y, and control the iac with it as an example of something extreme).
-Real Time Tuning.
-Fuel injector settings and other things I found too basic, obvious, or basically required for other required things to work and I didnt feel like writing.
-Able to set long term fuel trim to carry into open loop areas.
-Tuning software should allow you to be able to click into a specific cell in a table with a standard pointing device (**** you hydra 2.6).


Optional but very nice

-Ability to tune with MAF.
-4 Built in thermocouple drivers.
-16 General purpose I/Os.
-Limp home fuel and spark tables, ability to switch to alternate fueling modes (IE able to switch to TPS fueling in the event of MAP failure).
-Dual switchable AFR target and spark table (IE for use with e85, meth, N2O).
-User adjustable blending between tables based on variable input.
-Ability to use GM and Ford flex fuel senders.
-Logic for driving multiple staged fuel pumps or multi speed pumps.
-2 step rev limiter and anti-lag launch.
-"rally style" anti-lag.
-Individual cylinder spark trimming, both manual and EGT based.
-Auto tune style system for fuel.
-Tuning software and data logging software should be user friendly.
-32x32 fuel and spark tables up to 12 user defined tables.
-Native true USB support.
-Support for staged injection and N2O injection control.
-Ability to take 4 separate MAP inputs using GPIOs.
-Water resistant
-Mil Spec Connectors
-Serial com inputs (IE for wideband for instance)
-Closed loop fuel control able to transition between use of narrow and wideband.
-Any feature the unit is capable of doing without much effort even if I don't see enough point to it to mention (when companies leave things like this out it infuriates me).
-Ability to use SD card for on board logging.
-Able to fully integrate with common data logging systems.
-Drive by wire throttle support.
-100Mhz 16bit processor
-Timescale resolution to 0.001ms
-No lift shift, for H pattern and sequential shifters
-Ability to skew fuel based on MAP (aka fuel pressure compensation for cars where fuel pressure is not MAP referenced).
-Catalog of known sensor, injector, and coil settings built into tuning software.
-"valet mode"
-Tip in knock retard.
-Hardware dividers.
-CLT based injector dead-time table.

Optional but not as important
-Ability to re-configure general I/O's as fuel injector drivers or spark drivers.
-5 dedicated VSS inputs.
-Individual wheel speed based traction control, external input adjustable slip %.
-20 general I/Os.
-External input adjustable 2 step launch control RPM.
-4 dedicated MAP sensor inputs.
-Ability to use CAN bus units in daisy chain, compatible.
-Able to use requested torque based logic, even when not using DBW.
-250Mhz 32bit processor, with failsafe back up 50Mhz 8bit processor.
-User programmable SD logic (do you know the math better than we do?).
-Low z injector drivers.
-Support 4 and 5 dimensional tables for use with VVT among other things. (yes they make my brain hurt too, but are awesome for vvt cars)
-2 Dedicated knock inputs.
-Blue Tooth support.
-Android based tuning and logging software.

Shoot for the Moon
-Programmable motorsports ABS support, able to use common 3 and 4 channel ABS pumps.
-Compatible with Delphi spark transducer.
-64x64 tables (because I want to see someone try to use that much)
-Support for function based tuning and an easy converter between functions and 2,3,4,5 dimensional tables.

I think that covers what I can think of off the top of my head.

Last edited by Leafy; 03-12-2013 at 12:11 PM.
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Old 03-12-2013, 11:36 AM   #2
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I think you just described ms3x.
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Old 03-12-2013, 11:37 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdgen View Post
I think you just described ms3x.
Besides some of the crazy things and the native USB support, pretty much. Oh and the lack of real connectors. I think its more of the MS3 Pro.
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Old 03-12-2013, 11:44 AM   #4
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I just scanned through that.

Built in bluetooth? Did i miss it? Screw having a cord, i hate that.
Also, valet mode. Not sure how that would be done, but a physical button. Or maybe something in your mobile software, connected via bluetooth.

A lot of that stuff, i don't even know what it is. But i think ABS support would be awesome, a lot of the guys running these new cars on tracks are having huge problems with ABS coming on and they overshoot a turn.
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Old 03-12-2013, 11:48 AM   #5
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Hardware divide and other math functions. PLEASE.
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Old 03-12-2013, 11:49 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erat View Post
Also, valet mode. Not sure how that would be done, but a physical button. Or maybe something in your mobile software, connected via bluetooth.
Will be available in the next version of the Enhanced MS2.
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Old 03-12-2013, 11:51 AM   #7
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Quote:
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Hardware divide and other math functions. PLEASE.
For those of us who arent ECEs what exactly does this get you?
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Old 03-12-2013, 11:54 AM   #8
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Can divide in 1-4 clock cycles, instead of 20-50?
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Old 03-12-2013, 11:56 AM   #9
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Adaptive control wizard that learns idle and boost control feedback loop settings.
Wizard that figures out throttle enrichment settings.
Wizard that figures out injector dead-time.

CLT based injector dead-time table.

Has separate low and high load long-term fuel trim, and low, mid, high RPM long-term fuel trim.

Has a separate 2D table of VE vs. MAP, as well as VE vs. RPM.

Has a checkbox to select atmo-referenced or manifold-referenced FPR which will automatically change injector on-times as MAP increases.

Has a wizard for entering injector test pressure (i.e. flow rate is spec'd at *this* pressure)

Fuel pressure input for adjusting injector on-times dynamically

Has an internal variable = airflow aka power which can be used for things like triggering a fuel pump voltage booster

Adaptive, dynamic TPS-closed value, so that even if it drifts slightly it can figure out where to set decel fuel cutoff TPS threshold.

Has MAP sensor input for pre-throttle-body to do pre-throttle body boost targeting.
Can do pre-throttle-body fuel trim as a facsimile of turbine inlet pressure fuel trimming.
Can do turbine inlet pressure fuel trimming.

Asynchronous fuel injection for throttle enrichment.

Has tip-in driveline windup oscillation killer (common on OEMs). You do this by retarding timing briefly during tip-in, for a fixed period. (Must be disabled if clutch in or car in neutral to not dull rev-matching blips)

Soft decel fuel cutoff function - kills injectors progressively instead of all at once to prevent windup oscillation on abrupt throttle lift (common too on OE's)


Boost control:
(a) targeting based on TPS and RPM
(b) boost sol'd duty table based on boost target and RPM
(c) and a closed feedback loop around it, *with a learning algorithm that slowly and dynamically corrects table (b) above*, and a trim vs. IAT to prevent overshoots when it's cold out
(d) and an adaptive system that figures out the closed loop gain settings to prevent overshoot
(e) persistent knock reduces max boost


FAST datalogging i.e. >50 Hz with user-selectable variables including ALL internal ones. This is of utmost importance for troubleshooting.

Last edited by JasonC SBB; 03-12-2013 at 12:22 PM.
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:00 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafy View Post
-64x64 tables (because I want to see someone try to use that much)
Far better off adding trim inputs such as actual VVT angle, and turbine inlet pressure.
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:01 PM   #11
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Jason, some of those are already included in the, you can use whatever the hell you want to make a table. Aka the knock retard vs vvt position iac control table.

And that VVT trimming would be handled in a 4 dimensional table if that made the cut, which I figure it would before the 64x64 tables.
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:13 PM   #12
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Honda on their K20 has 6 VE and spark tables (each is RPM vs MAP), the 6 representing different cam phase positions. ECU then interpolates between them. There's your 4D. LOL @ tuning time.
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:15 PM   #13
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Kind of what GM does, but their 4d "tables" are actually defined as functions and you have to use a nifty program someone wrote in c++ to go between the two.
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:16 PM   #14
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IMO the most important features are for *ease of tuning*, followed by street manners and driveability. Most people will NOT pay for dyno time required for tuning multiple advanced tables.

See stuff I put in about wizards, adaptive automatic control loops, and injector and VE setups.
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:17 PM   #15
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Which is why that stuff is in the less and less important section of features.
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:28 PM   #16
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Spark autotune?

Though I don't know if knock sensing has come far enough to really make this safe. And if the ground is flat enough, you could probably use rpm/time to judge back to back pulls. How do you tell if the ground is flat enough for that?

That's my other idea. Put a 10k GPS and accelerometers in there, so it can double as a DA unit. It already has most of the sensors you would want for DA. I know DIY Autotune has said they have been playing with the idea of making a DA unit. Why not combine them into 1 box?
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:37 PM   #17
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Spark autotune is kind of scary. If you added the accelerometers I think you could make it work but let the user limit loads that it works in. Although, the logic for it in higher load would be how I normally tune spark on a knock limited engine.
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:45 PM   #18
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Even if you never have it tune high load/boosted cells, you might be able to program it for fuel efficiency like Joe Perez has been doing manually with his DD. Or maybe autotune with an additional EGT input for safety/better tuning.
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Old 03-12-2013, 12:47 PM   #19
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Thats what I was thinking. With the accelerometer and combine with map/tps you could have it keep adding advance until it noticed a drop you needing more tps to maintain the same speed or acceleration rate.
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Old 03-12-2013, 06:21 PM   #20
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Adaptronic tried a spark autotune algorithm. Do a search.

It worked but was surprisingly not popular.
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