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I race a formula car, so I can't drive it around the neighborhood to seat the rings, short of renting a practice day at a track, for big $$, and a long tow each way.. My #1 rule is to fire it up at home, so I know it will run, etc. and do not let it idle: as soon as she fires, I run the revs up and down, keep it above 2K revs., and shut it off as soon as I know it's going to run. When I hit the track for the first race of the season, I'll fire it up, drive around the paddock in 1st gear, accelerate hard to 3-4K, then lift off for engine braking, and repeat for 5-10 min. That's it; she's done. Make sure she's warmed up, and has correct oil temp before going on track, then start going full tilt. 25 season's of this, with a lot (too many $$) of new engines, and I have never had ring seating issues. Same procedure for a new cam: never let it idle till after all surfaces are broken in/ seated.
Has anyone done full engine break in on a load bearing dyno? I was thinking about doing that with my build if my plates are expired (and not replace in time).
Thanks for all the break in tips every one. I haven't updated progress because there has been none. I swapped in a "was running when parked" fuel pump from a previous part out and it didn't even start the car. Waiting on a new DW200 that should come today!
Has anyone done full engine break in on a load bearing dyno? I was thinking about doing that with my build if my plates are expired (and not replace in time).
Yes, but it's not ideal. I have done new motor + full tune at the same time. I focus on the 70-100kpa cells up to 5000rpm first, even while the car is still warming up. Then start doing low-boost full pulls up to 5000rpm. At this point most of the break-in is done. Then go back and touch up the 40-70kpa cells and do 8-10psi pulls to redline last. You can do these at the same time, do the vac cell tuning while the motor is cooling down after 2-3 WOT pulls.
It's the same theory as doing it on the street or track - focus on 2000-5000rpm and high cylinder pressures, then slowly add RPM and boost.
The best way is to break the motor in on track. 5000rpm and 100kpa for the first session. 6000rpm and wastegate boost 2nd session. 7000rpm and wastegate boost for the rest of the weekend.
Yes, but it's not ideal. I have done new motor + full tune at the same time. I focus on the 70-100kpa cells up to 5000rpm first, even while the car is still warming up.
How does this square with burping the coolant? Let motor warm up burping coolant, and then immediately break in? I am puzzling over how this should be done as this is my first time with a fresh motor. Or, do best at filling coolant system, and warm up the car even with air bubbles. Burp later?
How does this square with burping the coolant? Let motor warm up burping coolant, and then immediately break in? I am puzzling over how this should be done as this is my first time with a fresh motor. Or, do best at filling coolant system, and warm up the car even with air bubbles. Burp later?
I'm always surprised when people bring this up, since I'm assuming a lot of people on here have access to a compressor.
Hmmm. Interesting. I had thought dyno break in was best though the most expensive way to break in as you can precisely control load. Learned something new!
If I did my break in wrong, would it be too late to try to break it in more after 20-30 street miles and a dozen ax runs ? Debating switching back to break in oil just in case since even if the fuel pump solves my stuttering issue, the dry compression vs wet compression number ( 160 vs 200+ ) is a bit worrying.
Hmmm. Interesting. I had thought dyno break in was best though the most expensive way to break in as you can precisely control load. Learned something new!
If I did my break in wrong, would it be too late to try to break it in more after 20-30 street miles and a dozen ax runs ? Debating switching back to break in oil just in case since even if the fuel pump solves my stuttering issue, the dry compression vs wet compression number ( 160 vs 200+ ) is a bit worrying.
From what I have gathered, if the rings don't bite into the cyl. wall in the first few minutes, it usually means a glazed wall. Basically just like a new cam/buckets, where as soon as it starts, it goes up above 2K for 20 min. before you let it idle. I remember being told about pulling the plugs, squirting solvent, or alcohol in to wash the oil off the walls, then trying one more time to seat them, with the idea that the motor is probably coming apart for a hone-re-ring anyway , so there isn't much to lose in trying. Reading about motorcycle engine builders, who really know their ****, as they have only one or two cylinders to work with, will assemble the engine, fire it up, and immediately do some full rev runs. The guy told me the seating had to happen in the first few minutes of running, or it was not going to happen. I don't think we need to be that extreme, but agree with others who keep dyno oil in for 500 or so miles before going synthetic. I hope you have some other issue, and not the rings, as it's a heartbreaker to have to pull a fresh engine apart! It would be a last resort for me.
Unfortunately the new DW fuel pump didn't fix the problem. When key on ( no start ), it is very evident the new pump is louder than stock. My FP went from 0 .. and climbed slowly 1 psi at a time until it reached 79 psi on the gauge ( installed on the input rail ).
On start / idle, pressure drops to about 60 and climbs back up to 63.
I tried to play with the throttle and the motor died. :( Wasn't able to see fuel pressure when I was playing with the motor. I think I need to start logging this data now.
But from what I'm reading 60-70 at idle is pretty high for an NA6 fuel system with a return line. With the old FP, I recall my idle pressure was around mid 40s.
Does this seem like it could be issues with the regulator ? Or clogged injector ?
Unfortunately the new DW fuel pump didn't fix the problem. When key on ( no start ), it is very evident the new pump is louder than stock. My FP went from 0 .. and climbed slowly 1 psi at a time until it reached 79 psi on the gauge ( installed on the input rail ).
On start / idle, pressure drops to about 60 and climbs back up to 63.
I tried to play with the throttle and the motor died. :( Wasn't able to see fuel pressure when I was playing with the motor. I think I need to start logging this data now.
But from what I'm reading 60-70 at idle is pretty high for an NA6 fuel system with a return line. With the old FP, I recall my idle pressure was around mid 40s.
Does this seem like it could be issues with the regulator ? Or clogged injector ?
If it's an NA fuel system it should have 45psi at idle. If you are getting 60-70 that would be way too much fuel. Maybe the regulator is bad. Are you using the stock regulator on the rail?
Andyfloyd, its a VVT swap so it is pretty close to stock but not exactly stock. I'm using a 99 fuel rail with an 1.6 FPR mounted upside down ( as per the VVT swap guide thread by Savington ). I'm going to rent an analog gauge tomorrow to confirm it is indeed at 79 PSI and inspect the return line to see if something pinched. Though when it was having issues, it was still running mid 40s on my gauge. Hmmm.
I guess it is possible that first the FP was having problem, then the newly installed and much stronger DW200 put too much pressure on the line and 'killed' the FPR. Not sure how likely that scenario is.
Also, mechanical timing should be correct. Pulled the front end apart and verified that again today. Also oil is again clear of any chunk / debris. So that's some good news at least.
Late to the party, but don't run around with the charge piping off of the turbo. Without the load of compressing air the turbo will overspeed pretty easily. Wire the wastegate open next time.
Hmm .. I thought the white on plug #4 meant it was leaning out / running too hot. I could definitely be wrong though.
I was able to get my leak down done today. On cold motor .. result seems "too good". Around 1-3% loss on a cold engine ? Could definitely hear the air escaping from the oil fill cap area as well as dip stick though.
As far as fueling pressure goes .. I have had a Fuelab 515 regulator as well as a 818 filter and a radium fuel rail on the shelf for a while now. Figure might as well install it now since the regulator has a spot for a secondary fuel pressure gauge ( to confirm my cheapie digital gauge is working okay ). So I bought
03-29-2019, 11:34 AM
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