VICS/VCTS/VTCS/VCT/VVT The East Coast Family
8 Attachment(s)
Hey,
I would like to get it right. All NB: VICS = Varible Intake control system BP-4W 99-00 https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...1&d=1430726230 VTCS = Variable Tumble Control System 01-05 (VVT+VTCS) https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...1&d=1430726861 VCT = VVT = Variable Valve Timing BP-Z3 01-05 (VVT+VTCS) https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...1&d=1430726111 |
I believe VICS was 1999-2000.
VTCS 2001-2005. I feel like there are is a second set of butterflys in the 2001-2005 VTCS manifolds as well, but they don't operate the same way. I would have to look again though. |
99-00 VICS
01-05 VVT + VTCS this could be found on wikipedia. although the way they describe VICS is incorrect. I'm not sure what the 04-05 MSM came with, I don't believe those had VVT, but they still had the VTCS IM. If you own a 01-05, you should make the efforts in fitting a 99-00 VICS IM. |
VICS = NB1, butterflies sandwiched between the two pieces of the manifold
VTCS = NB2, butterflies at the intake runner that mate to the motor There's another OE intake, but it was EU and Japanese domestic markets only; referred to as EUDM/JDM Squaretops. For relative performance, here's how they stack up: VICS = best all around intake, makes decent amount of torque VTCS = used for emissions purposes, no real performance to speak of Squaretop = higher peak HP at the expense of mid-range torque |
Originally Posted by Braineack
(Post 1228488)
99-00 VICS
01-05 VVT + VTCS this could be found on wikipedia. although the way they describe VICS is incorrect. I'm not sure what the 04-05 MSM came with, I don't believe those had VVT, but they still had the VTCS IM. If you own a 01-05, you should make the efforts in fitting a 99-00 VICS IM. |
according to haltech msm base maps, it is VICS on msm...
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Originally Posted by elior77
(Post 1228517)
according to haltech msm base maps, it is VICS on msm...
Souce: Had an MSM. Running Haltech. |
Originally Posted by elior77
(Post 1228517)
according to haltech msm base maps, it is VICS on msm...
It's what Concealer has said. MSM = 99-00 head with an 01-05 VTSC IM. If I were to build a miata it would be with a 01-05 VVT head and a 99-00 VICS IM. |
base map is wrong ?
DPO17 is configured for "Dual intake valve" On its settings you configure: On value: Off Value: Pre configured to 5250rpm on, 5150 off On the 01-05 base maps I find only VCT on DPO17 and no VTCS output... What do you make of it ? Even MS control VTCS... weird... |
Originally Posted by elior77
(Post 1228523)
base map is wrong ?
DPO17 is configured for "Dual intake valve" On its settings you configure: On value: Off Value: Pre configured to 5250rpm on, 5150 off On the 01-05 base maps I find only VCT on DPO17 and no VTCS output... What do you make of it ? Even MS control VTCS... weird... I don't understand what you're trying to figure out. Tune your car. |
There are mistakes everywhere. What these guys are saying is true. MSM - vtcs. And vtcs control is just powering a solenoid to open/close, any EMS can likely do it.
I'm also trying to figure out what your question is or where you're going with this thread. |
Originally Posted by concealer404
(Post 1228506)
MSM is VTCS on 4w head and 01+ coil mounts.
The real difference is in the dyno graphs. I tuned a VVT with VTCS intake manifold that consistently had 5 extra hp and 5 extra ft/lbs than another VVT engine with a VICS manifold. But the VTCS started dropping off at 6200rpm, and the VICS engine pulled out a 8hp and 6ft/lb lead by 7000rpm. I'll post the graph soon. |
Originally Posted by curly
(Post 1228566)
FTFY.
The real difference is in the dyno graphs. I tuned a VVT with VTCS intake manifold that consistently had 5 extra hp and 5 extra ft/lbs than another VVT engine with a VICS manifold. But the VTCS started dropping off at 6200rpm, and the VICS engine pulled out a 8hp and 6ft/lb lead by 7000rpm. I'll post the graph soon. I got a spare, free VTCS manifold for my 01. I've seen 100 different threads say 100 different things, so i figure whats one more in deciding if its worth porting, or just holding out for a VICS / square top. The car is a street car now, so i like having the torque, but it'll be a full time track rat come fall. |
I'm still waiting to get dyno files from the VICs enabled car. Unless you'd like me to compare a VTCS manifold to a MSM.
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That'd be fun. Too bad they're the same manifold. :giggle:
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...with a turbo though. Not a great comparison.
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1 Attachment(s)
Ok, here ya go. STD correction took out some of the advantage the VTCS motor had when I last looked at the graph, but you can still see the green line's fairly significant jump in power above ~6400rpm. To the tune of 13hp and 10ft/lbs by red line.
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1431043547 |
I stated what I want in my first post:
"I would like to get it right." That is all. |
From what I understand, you're suppose to have the VICS's butterfly valves switch open @ 2000 revs when used on a VVT engine. Instead of 5400 RPM like on a non-VVT engine.
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Two dyno tests have show a 99 Vics and VVT VIC needing the same setting, open around 3500, then closed again at 5500. Or vice versa I forget. But they both needed to open/close in the midrange, not just one rpm for the best dyno graph.
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