TF2 Thread
09-06-2012, 12:01 PM
#402
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Airblast is a little tougher in the MvM rounds, I think. It seems as though robots are heavier than their meat-based counterparts insofar as the airblaster's effect is concerned, thus the need for the airblaster upgrades.
As for backburner- it is amazing. 100% crits from behind with no ammo penalty (well, airblast costs a lot more ammo, but it's worth it.) This is why, in the MvM rounds, I always start out right at the jumping-off point, so than when the bots enter the arena I'm already behind them. I just wish that the crits were also effective against tanks, which they don't seem to be.
As for backburner- it is amazing. 100% crits from behind with no ammo penalty (well, airblast costs a lot more ammo, but it's worth it.) This is why, in the MvM rounds, I always start out right at the jumping-off point, so than when the bots enter the arena I'm already behind them. I just wish that the crits were also effective against tanks, which they don't seem to be.
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09-06-2012, 12:07 PM
#403
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Airblast is a little tougher in the MvM rounds, I think. It seems as though robots are heavier than their meat-based counterparts insofar as the airblaster's effect is concerned, thus the need for the airblaster upgrades.
As for backburner- it is amazing. 100% crits from behind with no ammo penalty (well, airblast costs a lot more ammo, but it's worth it.) This is why, in the MvM rounds, I always start out right at the jumping-off point, so than when the bots enter the arena I'm already behind them. I just wish that the crits were also effective against tanks, which they don't seem to be.
As for backburner- it is amazing. 100% crits from behind with no ammo penalty (well, airblast costs a lot more ammo, but it's worth it.) This is why, in the MvM rounds, I always start out right at the jumping-off point, so than when the bots enter the arena I'm already behind them. I just wish that the crits were also effective against tanks, which they don't seem to be.
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09-06-2012, 12:39 PM
#404
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Pyro has two big advantages. With Backburner, he can crit normal bots at will. And in waves where you have large numbers of relatively weak bots swarming the battlefield, Pyro can just run around like a madman setting everybody on fire, and provided that he's upgraded his burn time and damage, many of them will die from just the afterburn alone. Those who don't will be sufficiently softened up that the second-wave defenders (heavies, engies, etc) will have a much easier time picking them off, and will be able to spread their bullets around much more effectively.
That said, I did play as engie a bit the night before last, and his wrangled sentry sure is a thing of beauty against massive, slow moving opponents such as the tank and the "large" bots.
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09-06-2012, 12:49 PM
#405
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There are two types of damage to choose from under the flamethrower tab, "damage" and underneath that "burn damage". Which is the one I should concentrate on and what is the difference?
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09-06-2012, 12:54 PM
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There are two types of damage to choose from under the flamethrower tab, "damage" and underneath that "burn damage". Which is the one I should concentrate on and what is the difference?
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09-06-2012, 01:01 PM
#408
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And "damage" is the immediate damage caused to someone while you are actively standing there firing at them.
Both are important, but which one is more important depends somewhat on your style of play.
If you tend to simply "fire and forget", lighting up large numbers of enemy and letting them scatter, then you will want to increase both Burn Time and Burn Damage, so that they stay on fire longer, and take more damage in the process.
On the other hand, fur the purpose of making a sustained assault on a single enemy, such as going nose-to-nose with a tank or circling around a Giant Heavy and hitting him continuously, this where where regular Damage comes into play.
Both are important, but which one is more important depends somewhat on your style of play.
If you tend to simply "fire and forget", lighting up large numbers of enemy and letting them scatter, then you will want to increase both Burn Time and Burn Damage, so that they stay on fire longer, and take more damage in the process.
On the other hand, fur the purpose of making a sustained assault on a single enemy, such as going nose-to-nose with a tank or circling around a Giant Heavy and hitting him continuously, this where where regular Damage comes into play.
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09-06-2012, 01:59 PM
#409
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And "damage" is the immediate damage caused to someone while you are actively standing there firing at them.
Both are important, but which one is more important depends somewhat on your style of play.
If you tend to simply "fire and forget", lighting up large numbers of enemy and letting them scatter, then you will want to increase both Burn Time and Burn Damage, so that they stay on fire longer, and take more damage in the process.
On the other hand, fur the purpose of making a sustained assault on a single enemy, such as going nose-to-nose with a tank or circling around a Giant Heavy and hitting him continuously, this where where regular Damage comes into play.
Both are important, but which one is more important depends somewhat on your style of play.
If you tend to simply "fire and forget", lighting up large numbers of enemy and letting them scatter, then you will want to increase both Burn Time and Burn Damage, so that they stay on fire longer, and take more damage in the process.
On the other hand, fur the purpose of making a sustained assault on a single enemy, such as going nose-to-nose with a tank or circling around a Giant Heavy and hitting him continuously, this where where regular Damage comes into play.
I hope we start earlier next time because getting finished at 12:30am and waking up at 5:30 for work is kicking my *** today. Let's just say that my mental acuity is a bit weak today.
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09-06-2012, 02:06 PM
#410
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I don't think tanks are necessarily a good reason to go for pyro over heavy. I may bitch about it, but a heavy with brass beast, even on a tank, is still good damage.
If you hit something from behind, it auto-crits 100%. It can't crit otherwise though.
If you hit something from behind, it auto-crits 100%. It can't crit otherwise though.
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09-06-2012, 02:22 PM
#411
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I may be on tonight. It depends if coworkers try to get me to play sc2 or not and how late I want to stay up.
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09-06-2012, 02:29 PM
#412
I also gave up the sandvich for family business to handle enemies after ammo runs out and its great against spies and snipers. I also carry warriors spirit gloves for a lot more melee against tanks. With the warriors spirit the third punch crit is 253 damage. Yea I lose the run speed from the gloves of urgency but the extra damage is nice.
Though yesterday we had a nice time with the medic before I crashed out, a part of me almost wants to give it a try and see how it lends itself.
Anyone wanna trade me a direct hit?
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09-06-2012, 04:00 PM
#413
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At lest, for me it is. I grant you that I've seen some players who can use the Heavy very effectively in close-quarters combat. I'm just not at that skill level.
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09-06-2012, 04:07 PM
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Yeah, a Heavy is definately the best class (after the Wrangler Engineer) for going face-to-face with a tank. However the Pyro is a more well-rounded class than the Heavy when you consider all of the non-Tank enemies, especially given the fact that you can't really upgrade two different characters effectively in a single round.
At lest, for me it is. I grant you that I've seen some players who can use the Heavy very effectively in close-quarters combat. I'm just not at that skill level.
At lest, for me it is. I grant you that I've seen some players who can use the Heavy very effectively in close-quarters combat. I'm just not at that skill level.
The best team we've had (IMO at least) was 2x engi, 2x heavy, pyro, and something else.
If you asked me to swap a pyro for a heavy, I'd go **** no. A heavy for a pyro? **** no again. An engi for a pyro or a heavy, or vice versa? **** no.
The reality is you can't have everyone, or even 3 people be the same class, or it seriously penalizes you. I'm slightly confused as to an argument relating to "which is better?" when the argument should be (at least IMO) "which class composition is best?"
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09-06-2012, 04:27 PM
#415
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That's a fair assessment, and I'm largely biased by which classes I'm most skilled at.
I like playing Heavy as offense in payload maps, or in payload races. It's an easy class to play, since you have essentially infinite health and ammo. You just stay behind the cart and kill anything that moves.
By contrast, I'm not very good with Heavy in maps like CTF. I don't know why, I've just not developed the skill for it. I'm much better as Engineer in those.
In some maps, I love Pyro. Special Delivery is a good example here. That game mode tends to attract a lot of snipers who hang back and pick off the opposing team on the elevator, so I can have a ball spending the whole game just ambushing snipers and eliminating them.
Some classes I've never found a use for. Demo, for instance. He's a valuable character in the right hands, but I just seem to suck at playing him. Same goes for Scout.
I like playing Heavy as offense in payload maps, or in payload races. It's an easy class to play, since you have essentially infinite health and ammo. You just stay behind the cart and kill anything that moves.
By contrast, I'm not very good with Heavy in maps like CTF. I don't know why, I've just not developed the skill for it. I'm much better as Engineer in those.
In some maps, I love Pyro. Special Delivery is a good example here. That game mode tends to attract a lot of snipers who hang back and pick off the opposing team on the elevator, so I can have a ball spending the whole game just ambushing snipers and eliminating them.
Some classes I've never found a use for. Demo, for instance. He's a valuable character in the right hands, but I just seem to suck at playing him. Same goes for Scout.
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09-06-2012, 04:33 PM
#416
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Oh man, I love demo. I ******* love demo.
I can play every class to a certain extent of skill, but Demo and Soldier are my standout favorites. But I never play soldier in MVM typically, and only play Demo rarely.
Demo is incredibly useful in certain situations in MVM, but it's also incredibly dependant on overall class balance on whether it's even worth it to have the demo or not. That's kind of the issue with class balance in MVM - at least 4 classes are totally worthless (Spy, soldier, sniper, medic), and 2 are only situationally useful (Demo, Scout). A soldier can be played in place of a scout if necessary, but a properly equipped scout blows a soldier out of the water.
I can play every class to a certain extent of skill, but Demo and Soldier are my standout favorites. But I never play soldier in MVM typically, and only play Demo rarely.
Demo is incredibly useful in certain situations in MVM, but it's also incredibly dependant on overall class balance on whether it's even worth it to have the demo or not. That's kind of the issue with class balance in MVM - at least 4 classes are totally worthless (Spy, soldier, sniper, medic), and 2 are only situationally useful (Demo, Scout). A soldier can be played in place of a scout if necessary, but a properly equipped scout blows a soldier out of the water.
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