05 MSM -> NA swap - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


General Miata Chat A place to talk about anything Miata

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 03-11-2008, 02:49 AM   #1
Junior Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Florida
Posts: 70
Total Cats: 0
Default 05 MSM -> NA swap

Here's the Idea, guys.

My rings are starting to go out on my motor. Went through 1.5 quarts of oil after 16 autocross runs, and I'm getting the nice little "blue puff of doom" out the tail pipe.

I'm trying to figure out what I want to swap my motor with. I want to keep it a BP block.

I'm thinking of swapping in a '05 MSM motor. I figure if I pull the intake manifold off, take the turbo stuff off, and just basically get it down to the bare block, and put my intake (BRP Cold Side) and headers (RB) and then add the NA sensors and ignition system to it, *basically* it should be the same, right? No VVT to worry about, as the MSM motors did not come with it.

I dont want/need the turbo stuff, so I shouldn't have to try and wire in knock sensors to my ecu ect, the wiring harness should pretty much be the same if I just put the NA sensors where they need to go, right?

Thoughts, Idea's?

-meaty
deadmeat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 03:23 AM   #2
Senior Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Outside of the Loop-ATL
Posts: 754
Total Cats: 0
Default

I don't believe the internals of a MSM is anything special. So on here could correct me.

If you not going to run the turbo you may as well just get a stand 94-98 block if you want the 9.5:1 comp . Cause otherwise your going to pay an arm and leg for a MSM motor.
wildfire0310 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 03:26 AM   #3
Elite Member
iTrader: (13)
 
cjernigan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 8,147
Total Cats: 6
Default

Just get anything you can. You have to use a 99-00 intake manifold with the 99-00 head which is what the MSM has in it.
cjernigan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 08:29 AM   #4
Elite Member
iTrader: (21)
 
paul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Point Pleasant, NJ
Posts: 2,957
Total Cats: 2
Default

-if your gonna throw a lot of boost at it i'd say get a 94 motor. at least the bottom end. i believe the CR is 9.0:1 till middle of 95. then 9.5:1 after that. the oil feed is much easier with the 94/95 block over the 96-00. by a lot of boost i mean 15+. i run 14 to my 99 motor with no problems yet.

-no matter what bottom you go with i'd throw a 99/00 head/intake on top of it.
paul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 08:40 AM   #5
Ben
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (33)
 
Ben's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: atlanta-ish
Posts: 12,689
Total Cats: 99
Default

If you want a 99/00 BP4W, then why not just get a 99/00 BP4W? Would cost a lot less.
Ben is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 11:44 AM   #6
y8s
2 Props,3 Dildos,& 1 Cat
iTrader: (8)
 
y8s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Fake Virginia
Posts: 19,038
Total Cats: 407
Default

use your head and get an 01 block. more compression.
y8s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 12:06 PM   #7
Junior Member
iTrader: (12)
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Central, NJ
Posts: 487
Total Cats: 1
Default

How much boost have you been running on your turbo? Did you ever do a compression or leak down test? I thought my rings where fried in my old 240 and it only turned out to be a bad oil seal on the turbo. How many miles on the motor?
MikeRiv87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 02:11 PM   #8
Senior Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Outside of the Loop-ATL
Posts: 754
Total Cats: 0
Default

people he not going to run a turbo, he going to run a cold side supercharger.
wildfire0310 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 02:34 PM   #9
I'm Miserable!
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 589
Total Cats: 0
Default

the MSM engine has some things over the 99-00 engine.

MSM engine has the MBSP
MSM engine has no worries about the thrust bearing.
MSM Engine is more than likely going to have less miles on it.
MSM might have better cams for FI.
MX5-4me is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 02:58 PM   #10
Senior Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Trenton, NJ
Posts: 1,125
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wildfire0310 View Post
people he not going to run a turbo, he going to run a cold side supercharger.
supercharger or turbo..... both mean Forced Injection with boost.
ArtieParty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 03:06 PM   #11
I'm Miserable!
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 589
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtieParty View Post
supercharger or turbo..... both mean Forced Injection with boost.
Um.. Forced Injection? Are you sure about that?
MX5-4me is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 03:11 PM   #12
Senior Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Trenton, NJ
Posts: 1,125
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MX5-4me View Post
Um.. Forced Injection? Are you sure about that?
more air being pushed into the intake? once you go over atmospheric pressure ur forcing it in. so yes. i am sure.
ArtieParty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 03:14 PM   #13
I'm Miserable!
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 589
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtieParty View Post
more air being pushed into the intake? once you go over atmospheric pressure ur forcing it in. so yes. i am sure.
What you are talking about is Forced Induction ..

I'm pretty sure Forced Injection is another term for rape.
MX5-4me is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 03:17 PM   #14
Senior Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Trenton, NJ
Posts: 1,125
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MX5-4me View Post
What you are talking about is Forced Induction ..

I'm pretty sure Forced Injection is another term for rape.
im in bed dying of a cold. typed the wrong word. my bad.

that and i was talking about injectors all morning long with one of my friends. looking for some 550s.
ArtieParty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 04:02 PM   #15
Elite Member
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Overland Park, Kansas
Posts: 5,382
Total Cats: 43
Default

I wouldn't waste the money on an MSM motor. People seem to think they're ******* solid platinum and worth 5000$ for a long block with no turbo. Just grab a 94 block and 99-00 head.

While you're at it, forged pistons and you're > msm shortblock.
elesjuan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 04:06 PM   #16
I'm Miserable!
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 589
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by elesjuan View Post
I wouldn't waste the money on an MSM motor. People seem to think they're ******* solid platinum and worth 5000$ for a long block with no turbo. Just grab a 94 block and 99-00 head.

While you're at it, forged pistons and you're > msm shortblock.
if you are going to replace the pistons why not get a 01+ and a 99-00 head?
MX5-4me is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 04:34 PM   #17
Elite Member
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Overland Park, Kansas
Posts: 5,382
Total Cats: 43
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MX5-4me View Post
if you are going to replace the pistons why not get a 01+ and a 99-00 head?
Cost, and I understand the 96+ blocks are more difficult to source oil from. However since I understand hes supercharged, that doesn't matter for him about the oil.

For that matter, you could just grab an escort GT short block from a junk yard (50$ around here), 500 for forged pistons, 100 for machine work, new bearings and you've got a forged motor to throw that 99-00 head on for likely less than you'd spend on a stock longblock from 01+.

Salvage yards around here seem to think that miata motors are made of gold no matter what they're from. Most want 800$ for a 94 long block w/out sensors.
elesjuan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 04:41 PM   #18
I'm Miserable!
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 589
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by elesjuan View Post
Cost, and I understand the 96+ blocks are more difficult to source oil from. However since I understand hes supercharged, that doesn't matter for him about the oil.

For that matter, you could just grab an escort GT short block from a junk yard (50$ around here), 500 for forged pistons, 100 for machine work, new bearings and you've got a forged motor to throw that 99-00 head on for likely less than you'd spend on a stock longblock from 01+.

Salvage yards around here seem to think that miata motors are made of gold no matter what they're from. Most want 800$ for a 94 long block w/out sensors.
He is using it for a coldside SC so the oil ports are not an issue.
MX5-4me is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 04:53 PM   #19
Elite Member
iTrader: (12)
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 6,868
Total Cats: 66
Default

If you have good engine management, i'd get a 01-05 non MSM block.... you get all the goodies and a .5 bump in compression. It would be more then safe to run 10-12psi on it too. If you can find a good deal on a 99-00 head, then grab it. But running the 94-97 head isn't going to kill you or anything.
Doppelgänger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2008, 11:11 PM   #20
Elite Member
iTrader: (11)
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Overland Park, Kansas
Posts: 5,382
Total Cats: 43
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by elesjuan
Cost, and I understand the 96+ blocks are more difficult to source oil from. However since I understand hes supercharged, that doesn't matter for him about the oil.

For that matter, you could just grab an escort GT short block from a junk yard (50$ around here), 500 for forged pistons, 100 for machine work, new bearings and you've got a forged motor to throw that 99-00 head on for likely less than you'd spend on a stock longblock from 01+.

Salvage yards around here seem to think that miata motors are made of gold no matter what they're from. Most want 800$ for a 94 long block w/out sensors.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MX5-4me

He is using it for a coldside SC so the oil ports are not an issue.

Oh, I must've missed that part.
elesjuan is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Garrett Turbo, 1.8 Oil Pan, & Misc. Stuff nbdooey Miata parts for sale/trade 9 08-30-2017 10:50 PM
Expected intake temps on the track? tazswing Race Prep 20 10-03-2015 12:04 PM
Noob to Miataturbo from MA JxPhan Meet and Greet 3 10-02-2015 03:17 AM
Low oil pressure after 1.8 swap and new turbo setup JesseTheNoob DIY Turbo Discussion 15 09-30-2015 03:44 PM
Are my coils failing? viriiguy General Miata Chat 5 09-28-2015 08:39 PM


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:03 AM.