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Old 08-24-2010, 07:05 PM   #1
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Default 97Miata w/ 99head....trying to pass emissions

Hey guys,

I've got a 1997 Miata with a 1999 head. My mechanic was returning the 1997 intake manifold and throttle body, but found out it didn't mate up with the 1999 head.

Question:

We need to know if MY97 throttle body and EGR valve will fit on MY99 intake manifold. Will fuel rails clear, as well? If so, need to source MY99 intake manifold.


ARGH! I knew OBDII emissions would be a pain. Damn you state of Virginia!!!!

Any other thoughts? I was using a BEGI intake manifold w/ the 70mm throttle body. They are currently off.

<3 Ed
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Old 08-24-2010, 07:44 PM   #2
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whoops...didnt know you had a 99 head.
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Old 08-24-2010, 08:02 PM   #3
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Two things you can do.

1: You can actually redrill your 97 intake manifold to fit on the 99 head. I've seen it done. Didn't look too optimal, but it apparently can be made to seal and work. And that eliminates a whole lot of problems as far as the 97 OBDII computer goes.

And I speak from experience here. The 97 ECU can be bitchy about any tiny thing. Mine took ages to get to the ready state with the 99 manifold installed. I think for emissions, redrilling the 97's mounting holes and plopping it on the 99 head would be best.

2) You can choose to make the 97 stuff fit on your 99 manifold.

a) 97 throttle body on 99 manifold: fits fine. No adapter needed. I never even had a 99 TB on my 97 w/ 99 motor. The 97 bolted on fine.

b) 97 EGR on 99 manifold. It can be made to fit. The holes are exactly the same, it's just a matter of getting the BIG 97 EGR valve to fit on the side of the manifold. You can either grind down the side of the manifold or make a mounting plate out of about 1/8" steel. I made a mounting plate. Sealed fine.

c) The EGR pipe. This is a huge pain in the ***. You'll need your 94-97 pipe. And you'll get to bend it. It can be bent to fit pretty readily, but it will take multiple install/removals and walks back and forth between your bench vise and the engine bay. Even with the engine out of the car, this is a pain.


And that's about it. Obviously, the fuel rails are not compatible. 99 rail goes on 99 manifold. 97 rail goes on 97 manifold.
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Old 08-24-2010, 08:31 PM   #4
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Fuel rails are attached to the head, but other than that, what revlimiter said is spot on. I have seen the 94-97 intake manifold on a 99-00 head before as well.
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Old 08-24-2010, 08:35 PM   #5
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Even I can find someone who will pass my car for 100 bux if need be. Go use your people skills.


And as a side note: WOOT for NJ inspection. My car passed now with flying colors by running an "inspection" timing map Paul made. NJ dropped all safety inspection and now its just emissions. Paul's gutted machine even passed at the inspection. Or should I say: Paul's former car "the machine".
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Old 08-24-2010, 09:24 PM   #6
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Even I can find someone who will pass my car for 100 bux if need be.
You're OBDI - he's not.

C
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Old 08-25-2010, 12:31 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by revlimiter View Post
Two things you can do.

1: You can actually redrill your 97 intake manifold to fit on the 99 head. I've seen it done. Didn't look too optimal, but it apparently can be made to seal and work. And that eliminates a whole lot of problems as far as the 97 OBDII computer goes.

And I speak from experience here. The 97 ECU can be bitchy about any tiny thing. Mine took ages to get to the ready state with the 99 manifold installed. I think for emissions, redrilling the 97's mounting holes and plopping it on the 99 head would be best.

2) You can choose to make the 97 stuff fit on your 99 manifold.

a) 97 throttle body on 99 manifold: fits fine. No adapter needed. I never even had a 99 TB on my 97 w/ 99 motor. The 97 bolted on fine.

b) 97 EGR on 99 manifold. It can be made to fit. The holes are exactly the same, it's just a matter of getting the BIG 97 EGR valve to fit on the side of the manifold. You can either grind down the side of the manifold or make a mounting plate out of about 1/8" steel. I made a mounting plate. Sealed fine.

c) The EGR pipe. This is a huge pain in the ***. You'll need your 94-97 pipe. And you'll get to bend it. It can be bent to fit pretty readily, but it will take multiple install/removals and walks back and forth between your bench vise and the engine bay. Even with the engine out of the car, this is a pain.


And that's about it. Obviously, the fuel rails are not compatible. 99 rail goes on 99 manifold. 97 rail goes on 97 manifold.

Thanks a bunch! I'll get Dan (aka Rocker Dan, good friends with rappadan) to read this thread!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtieParty View Post
Even I can find someone who will pass my car for 100 bux if need be. Go use your people skills.


And as a side note: WOOT for NJ inspection. My car passed now with flying colors by running an "inspection" timing map Paul made. NJ dropped all safety inspection and now its just emissions. Paul's gutted machine even passed at the inspection. Or should I say: Paul's former car "the machine".
,

Unfortunately Northern VA + OBDII = good luck!

I have no problem attaching a $100 bill to a PostIt with my VIN. Unfortunately, the emissions guys have a LOT to lose.
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Old 08-25-2010, 12:38 AM   #8
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<3 Ed
wtf?
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Old 08-25-2010, 08:41 AM   #9
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wtf?
Showing a little ghey love for my fellow Miata owners. I figured it's better to charm the masses then do a Hustler move:

"Okay you pussies. You will now figure this out for me now or I will ban you. The first person to do this and pay me to fix my car will be free from punishment. I will spare you my big Texas hog-rapin' prison style."

or something like that.
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Old 08-25-2010, 09:08 AM   #10
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<3 Ed
<3 you too, Edfoo! That's all I got.
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Old 08-25-2010, 09:59 AM   #11
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WAIT you have a 99 head? FML, I would have totally done all the work converting you back to stock for the IM.

You need to find a 99 IM and fuel rail. When you put on the fuel rail install your FPR off your old fule rail onto the 99 fuel rail so that you can have a return system.

As said TB fits fine, I am running my 94 TB on my 99 IM with no problems.

I might have a spare EGR pipe I can send up if you want someone to practice bending.
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Old 08-25-2010, 10:46 AM   #12
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WAIT you have a 99 head? FML, I would have totally done all the work converting you back to stock for the IM.

You need to find a 99 IM and fuel rail. When you put on the fuel rail install your FPR off your old fule rail onto the 99 fuel rail so that you can have a return system.

As said TB fits fine, I am running my 94 TB on my 99 IM with no problems.

I might have a spare EGR pipe I can send up if you want someone to practice bending.


Cool, thx Lars! You can send it to Andrewtech:

8029 Cessna Ave, suite C
Gaithersburg, MD 20879
Attn: Ed's Miata

PM me how much I need to paypal you. I will get Brandon from TurboXS to bend/fab anything that needs some fenagling.


Webby - I <3 you too! When are you coming back down? Bring some A6s next time. 225s. Hehehe. I may actually tub the Miata if I have extra cash. I hate to carve it up, but I now have a spare car.
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Old 08-27-2010, 09:39 AM   #13
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Foofer, I hope you got your problem solved, I'm glad I have a 90 to get around the obd2 trouble. Sorry for polluting your thread, but...

I'm not going to be back again this year. But, there is impending trouble with at least one of the two really good Tour/Div/Pro-level sites for next year. Seneca Army Depot may be inaccessible to autocrossing next year, and that was the site of this year's National Tour up here in the N.E. So, I'd have an inkling that FedEx will be on next year's schedule at least once again for one of our big events in NEDiv. I'll get you back out to a big again next year!

I'm on 255/40-13 A6 now, no problem with fender clearance, but they definitely won't clear your brakes! My car is a mid-prep and mid-pack CSP car now.
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Old 08-30-2010, 05:57 PM   #14
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Foofer, I hope you got your problem solved, I'm glad I have a 90 to get around the obd2 trouble. Sorry for polluting your thread, but...

I'm not going to be back again this year. But, there is impending trouble with at least one of the two really good Tour/Div/Pro-level sites for next year. Seneca Army Depot may be inaccessible to autocrossing next year, and that was the site of this year's National Tour up here in the N.E. So, I'd have an inkling that FedEx will be on next year's schedule at least once again for one of our big events in NEDiv. I'll get you back out to a big again next year!

I'm on 255/40-13 A6 now, no problem with fender clearance, but they definitely won't clear your brakes! My car is a mid-prep and mid-pack CSP car now.


I'm currently waiting for Dan to work on my car in the next day or so. We got the 99 intake manifold from Panic Motorsports. Very quick turnaround, thx guys! I think it was considerably cheaper than Planet Miata, who I've had great experiences with in the past.

Will update later this week.
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Old 08-31-2010, 08:53 AM   #15
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shuiend mentioned that I should get Braineack to tackle the VICS. Sorry, I didn't know what that was (Variable Intake Control System, I believe). Sooo, is this something that we should look into making work? It appears to be something that opens/closes a resonance chamber in the manifold partway down the runners.

Looking for the easiest solution to get my car to pass emissions, make it easy to tune, etc. Something relatively low-maintenance and low chance of future failure.
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Old 08-31-2010, 09:31 AM   #16
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it's super easy to implement on the MS.
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Old 09-01-2010, 07:41 AM   #17
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it's super easy to implement on the MS.
AND you've been super hard to get ahold of!
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Old 09-01-2010, 09:55 AM   #18
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AND you've been super hard to get ahold of!
you'll find me at the gym...
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Old 09-01-2010, 10:14 AM   #19
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you'll find me at the gym...
Wat?!

First you lose that baby fat.

Now, the gym?!

What next, vegetarian? Then vegan? Then eco-friendly electric car? Then bike to work?

Then shave your head and join the Hare Krishnas?
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Old 09-01-2010, 10:24 AM   #20
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I just wanna get buff to attract more twinks.
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