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Old 10-21-2009, 08:16 PM   #1
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Default Coolant reroute questions 93' 1.6

Been exploring this the last few days as the large hammer approach to solving a long running cooling issue.

1. I've seen where you can mount a thermostat at the back of the block, on the block, underneath where the current water outlet fitting resides? Is this true?

2. Why the need for a spacer on the back when using the thermostat housing? Hose too close to the block otherwise?

3. I saw a very simple reroute where the back water outlet replaced the top thermostat housing in front, a long hose fed the heater core, and the sensors run from this position. I'm guessing this might mess a bit with the ECU since you'd be reading lower water temps than at the back of the block. Correct? How much?

4. Are the 1.6 and 1.8 thermostat covers the same other than the fan thermosensor?

Thanks in advance.

Cheers, Jon
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Old 10-21-2009, 08:21 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by jonljacobi View Post
Been exploring this the last few days as the large hammer approach to solving a long running cooling issue.

1. I've seen where you can mount a thermostat at the back of the block, on the block, underneath where the current water outlet fitting resides? Is this true?
You mean a spacerless re-route?
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2. Why the need for a spacer on the back when using the thermostat housing? Hose too close to the block otherwise?
Because if you want to route it using the intake side using a protege or similar outlet it will not clear the line coming out of the head going to the oil cooler. At least on my 00 that's the way it is. Also some are uncomfortable drilling into the head if going spacerless yet keeping the sensor and heater feed at the back like its supposed to be.
Quote:
3. I saw a very simple reroute where the back water outlet replaced the top thermostat housing in front, a long hose fed the heater core, and the sensors run from this position. I'm guessing this might mess a bit with the ECU since you'd be reading lower water temps than at the back of the block. Correct? How much?
Nothing wrong with this except now you have to run another long *** hose to the back from the front neck to feed the heater core. And extend the sensor wiring all the way to the front where the sensor is now. Pain in the mess and too much **** to extend. Clutters up the bay.
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4. Are the 1.6 and 1.8 thermostat covers the same other than the fan thermosensor?

Thanks in advance.

Cheers, Jon
No idea, but I don't see why not.
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Old 10-21-2009, 11:34 PM   #3
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Quote:
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1. I've seen where you can mount a thermostat at the back of the block, on the block, underneath where the current water outlet fitting resides? Is this true?
Yes you could, but then you won't get coolant flow through the head (very bad) until the thermostat opens.

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2. Why the need for a spacer on the back when using the thermostat housing? Hose too close to the block otherwise
Again, to get coolant flow through the block.

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Originally Posted by jonljacobi View Post
3. I saw a very simple reroute where the back water outlet replaced the top thermostat housing in front, a long hose fed the heater core, and the sensors run from this position. I'm guessing this might mess a bit with the ECU since you'd be reading lower water temps than at the back of the block. Correct? How much?
Sounds simple, although I'm not sure if it's correct or not. "Simplest" reroute is using the stock water neck with a spacer underneath that has the coolant sensor and fan sensor sticking out of it. This goes on the back of the block, then the thermostat, then the stock thermostat cover, pointing left or right, (to go under the intake or exhaust), and that gets connected to the radiator return. You can then unbolt the front thermostat housing and use a freeze plug, or simply put a plate over the top. This plate can be drilled and tapped for the fan sensor as well, instead of the spacer.

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4. Are the 1.6 and 1.8 thermostat covers the same other than the fan thermosensor?
No, the orientation is slightly different I believe. I think that's NA and NB though, not 1.6 and 1.8. NA's hold the thermostat horizontally, while NB's hold it vertically.


Edit: I had some stupid sales call in the middle of writing this post, which broke my train of thought, but I'm fairly certain everything's correct.
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Old 10-22-2009, 03:08 PM   #4
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Curly, why do you need coolant flow through the block until the engine reaches operating temperature? Also, with an after market thermostat, you can get the little flowthrough opening or simply drill a small hole to allow some flow.

I'm pretty sure I'll opt for the spacer, but just trying to think it through.

I was looking at the pic below and wondering if that front thermostat cover wouldn't clear whatever it needs to. I guess I need to really take a good look back there to see what I'm dealing with.

As to long hose runs mucking up my engine bay. That's not something I particularly care about. Besides, they make for good conversation...

Cheers, Jon
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Old 10-22-2009, 03:46 PM   #5
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Lolz, don't touch your engine.

Seriously though, you want coolant low through an
engine, otherwise they over heat. Granted you'll be fine once the thermostat opens, but you'll have an instant warm up and not have any coolant flow during that <3 minute time.

There is a reason all reroute products include a spacer, you can diy without, but I wouldn't suggest it. Please buy one of these aforementioned products (m-tuned or begi) and for the sake of your engine have a mechanic type friend help you install it.
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Old 10-22-2009, 04:02 PM   #6
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Do my eyes fool me? Is this another coolant reroute thread?! :wtf:
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Old 10-22-2009, 04:03 PM   #7
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I've done a lot of work on the buggy. Including the water pump, suspension, turbo, etc. I'm mechanically competent--and more importantly, know when to park the car when I've screwed something up.

Unfortunately, the spacer seems to have problems with the EGR tube and I don't really want to get rid of the EGR. I'm not entirely sure why someone can't fab a spacer that accommodates the EGR tube.

The 949 would be fine, but it's $300. Not that I can't afford it, but it just seems a little steep for what it is.
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Old 10-22-2009, 04:08 PM   #8
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Do my eyes fool me? Is this another coolant reroute thread?! :wtf:
The Catch 22 of forums--the more threads there are on a subject, the harder it is to find them. Seriously dude, I looked and looked for answers to these basic questions. All the threads assume baseline knowledge.
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Old 10-22-2009, 04:24 PM   #9
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IUnfortunately, the spacer seems to have problems with the EGR tube and I don't really want to get rid of the EGR. I'm not entirely sure why someone can't fab a spacer that accommodates the EGR tube.
1.6L cars do not have EGR. So no problems there!
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Old 10-22-2009, 04:46 PM   #10
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Stephanie, you're a gem.

I just took off the coils and I'm looking around, and round, and round... I was just about to ask. Another point in favor of the early NA.

My only question for you is what do I do for the thermo sending switch for the fans with the BEGI reroute?
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Old 10-22-2009, 05:06 PM   #11
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Look at this: Coolant Reroute

and then this: Coolant Reroute
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Old 10-22-2009, 05:30 PM   #12
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Thanks..I was looking for this information myself!! Ive also got a 1.6 and was wondering the same questions..
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Old 10-22-2009, 05:52 PM   #13
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I just had a thread about this **** like a week ago
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Old 10-22-2009, 07:22 PM   #14
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Eh...with three of us about to do one it doesn't hurt...we're also all 1.6Ls which mean a little different approach for sensors and such.



I'm about to do mine the spacer way...but haven't decided which and how many sensors/feeds I want to machine it for, or if I want to completely get rid of the front water neck.

I may even do it without the spacer...but am concerned about clearance for the sensor which is upright on the front therm housing when you switch it to the rear.


This brings up a point I wanted to make to the OP. On the housing swap option the sensor threads are different, so you can't just put the ECU sensor (on rear) into the front housing as you bolt it onto the back, or vice versa. You have to run wires for the front sensor to the rear, and extend the rear sensor wires to the front. Remember that you shouldn't solder these connections since it's a thermocouple and will alter their resistance.

Also, and I won't know til Sat, if the front gauge sensor doesn't clear the firewall on the back you will HAVE to use a spacer and tap it for that sensor regardless. If so, you might as well tap it for the ECU sensor and the heater core feed to cut down on hosing and wiring clutter. At this point you should source a Kia housing which is bare, so you wont have to plug any holes.


This is my take on it...but I've yet to put it into practice. Maybe I'll get ahead on homework tomorrow and do it all this weekend.
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Old 10-22-2009, 10:10 PM   #15
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you can search for my coolant reroute thread in the diy section and see what I did on my 1.6 car with a 1.8 motor.
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Old 10-23-2009, 01:08 PM   #16
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Well now that I know there's no EGR tube to deal with, I think I'm just going to go the BEGI route. $239 for that looks a lot better than $300 for the 949 M-tuned and I don't have anyone to do the machining. I think by the time I add it all up, it's going to come close anyway.

The real reason is that I park on the street and it will take long enough as it is. You should have seen the looks I got when I pulled the dashboard and was walking back to the apartment with it!

Cheers, Jon
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