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I gotcha. I'm just saying there are a lot of people with misconceptions about what the reroute actually does. It just evens out the coolant temps from front to back which is never a bad thing. It doesn't mean your car is going to overheat with a stock coolant system in place. I don't run one because I like simplicity and that's how my car is built. Stock coolant routing, stock IGN coils, etc. And it still makes 400.
I remember seeing a chart somewhere in this forum that said anywhere over 250hp you needed a different ignition setup. You can throw that out the window bc the stock stuff works.
Anecdotally* the stock stuff works. For every Andy, there are 20 people who struggled to keep their NB1 ignition happy over 200hp. Also bear in mind that over history, peoples' approaches to dwell on coils has changed quite a lot. Then you have differences in ignition maps, differences in different motors' MBT, different climates, different heat management, different gaps, different plugs outright, different cylinder pressures, blah blah blah.
The real takeaway with your scenario and sonofthehill's scenario is: Your cars work.
I remember seeing a chart somewhere in this forum that said anywhere over 250hp you needed a different ignition setup. You can throw that out the window bc the stock stuff works.
In my personal experience, a reroute was needed for my car and track abuse (in addition to oversized rad, proper ducting, etc), and my stock ignition system started experiencing major spark blowout over about 230whp.
My coolant temp gauge at the upper radiator hose showed a max of 193F at the end of this run, the coolant temp sensor at the back of the head was 95C, or 203 F. So thats a 10* delta which is pretty in line with what I typically see. Because my car is a street car the reroute although nice, doesnt really help me much. If I was building a track car, absolutely, I just think for street use the stock system works just fine.
You just don't drive hard enough, in a hot enough environment to need a reroute.
Hell I needed a reroute when I was N/A. And that's doing track sessions at 30c degrees and more than 60% humidity.
We see temps in the 90s here, but I dont track the car. I do drive it hard on the street but nothing like a track environment which would surely cause my car to overheat.
Anecdotally* the stock stuff works. For every Andy, there are 20 people who struggled to keep their NB1 ignition happy over 200hp. Also bear in mind that over history, peoples' approaches to dwell on coils has changed quite a lot. Then you have differences in ignition maps, differences in different motors' MBT, different climates, different heat management, different gaps, different plugs outright, different cylinder pressures, blah blah blah.
The real takeaway with your scenario and sonofthehill's scenario is: Your cars work.
You do make a lot of good points. My thought with the stock coils is I went and purchased a NGK set, and I use Ruthenium plugs which have a VERY fine ground and center electrode which needs less voltage to ignite. Then yea, my dwell settings are far more aggressive than what people used to run but the nb1 coils dont seem to mind.
I am extremely OCD with my car Im always out tinkering with it and messing with the map to perfect it, I bet SonoftheHill is the same.
hmmm this is different than what I get. I can see a 20-25 degree F increase by the end of a pull. It does drop back to t-stat temp in a second or so. Wonder if I have something going on.
I would probably run one of the nice Q Max reroutes if it didn't conflict with the overall agenda of my car to look as normal as possible for inspection. I was merely adding a data point for a Miata with a stock cooling system that is never on throttle for more than 12 seconds. I bet it almost takes that long for my thermostat to open fully. I too have struggled with ignition and run the IGN1A's when not faced with above mentioned "reasons."
I did not realize SOTH wasn't running a reroute. It makes sense that a non-reroute application wouldn't show much temp rise at the front or back... the CLT in the front isn't extracting the heat, and at the back the flow is too low to quickly extract the heat as well.
I looked at some data from similar setups (turbo only) in my area that I have provided consulting services on, those with re-routes look similar to mine.
For reference, this is mine, 3rd gear pull, 22psi, e85 at 84 degree F ambient, 82.5kpa ambient pressure
TSE crossflow with Skou adapter based re-route, 195 degree t-stat, ducted, undertray, 3x rtheory hood vents for NA
thats crazy how much the temps rise on just one pull like that. This does make me think about the stock system and how little heat its pulling out of the coolant.....
08-20-2021, 04:13 PM
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