Shane is a douche-bag made of cheesecloth. Buy from someone who gives a shit about the community and is doing actual research about the correct shape/ placement etc.

Then you need a product with R&D; not something that came out in 6 hrs. and looks "sharp".

I am not currently making a purchase from either party but let us be honest here. The R&D has already been done by FM, Hustler, 949, and Trackspeed. It's not fucking rocket science. Make a louver that sits on the hood in a low pressure zone behind the radiator to extract air from underneath the hood. If you don't want to buy from Shane because you think he is a douche, that's fine. If you think ThePass' louvers are going to be significantly more effective with essentially the exact same design and hood placement as he previously laid out in this thread you are just kidding yourself.

Well I mean, we're not even sure if shane's louvers fit or if he just eyeballed them to show off how big his nuts are.

Oath
 

All of you swore an oath to always support site sponsors!

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1406815656

I'll let you know when I install them

:bowrofl:

Haha, I have never had my commands come true so quickly. Goes right along with their motto "You dream it, we build it"

:idea: Since I may be on a roll: Emilio, you should send me a free set of Xidas so I can enjoy them. :party:

In all honesty, I don't think I would buy a product that was: 1)Developed just to show some big huevos and send a giant F*** you, 2)Being sold before it was even installed on a car, 3)Actually had less than a day of development time, 4)Put up for sale with only haphazard cell phone pics taken.

I know ThePass will put more thought and testing into them than this, so guess what I will be waiting for. For about $100, guess which product will be better.

I would guess that a vent that is placed with emphasis on it location relative to the rad and low pressure regions would work measurably better than one that was placed with convenience and hood supports in mind.

It cracks me up a little.. setting a part intended for an s2000 on a different car, snapping a pic of it roughly in the position others said it should go, and then typing up a blerb on the webpage for the 'new' product does not a 'new developed' product make.

We spent yesterday doing pressure testing of many of the various hood vent solutions out there, and the data has given me some good direction - reinforced some things I had already known, but also shown where to focus efforts and where to trim the fat..

Our nearly stock test car, hooked up with magnehelic gauges, with one of several hoods we tested (my beat up old hood off the time attack car)- zip-tied on in all it's glory since it doesn't have a latch hook on it hahaha

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1406823711

We also tested most of the hood venting options commonly used, except for the really custom one-off stuff.

Nice. Ryan please have a set going for the nb. My body/paint guy is waiting on me. It would nice to include these into the batch waiting for paint. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions. Just buy from who you want.

Except when you have 10 years experience making 50 different styles of louvers for cars with major engine bay heat issues....... and you can go from a mid-engine car that you can barely open the rear hatch without burning your fingers.....to the exact same car that you can lay your hand on the hatch and not tell whether the engine has even been running or not, as the hatch is at ambient temp.....even after you've driven the car 30 miles with a 700+hp V8 with long tube headers sitting back there, churning out heat.

Not sure what other sophisticated "testing" is required? Either the louvers work to lower underhood temps, or they don't. Blisters on my fingers vs ambient temp hatch surface. These are not the first louvers I've ever developed from scratch, nor will they be the last. No, those are not S2000 louvers on the hood of that Miata.....those are louvers specifically designed to fit that hood.

You can have all of the fancy sensors and data you want, but the bottom line is that all those pressures and measurements and data points you spent hours or days logging on a virgin hood all go away as soon as you cut a hole in it. As soon as you cut the hole, the surface that created the low pressure area in the first place is no longer there, and therefore, all of the data for that area is useless. I don't worry about what exists for a low pressure area....I focus on what I can create for a low pressure area. When you don't start your project with a false sense of what your imaginary data is telling you, you can focus on actually building something that works to do the job intended.

noob :jerkit:

Oh my word, go live your life and do what you do and move on. Each individual has the freedom to buy whatever product they want. Despite having my own opinions, I won't stoop to picking apart details of what I don't like about a competitor's product to boost the appeal of my own.

This thread's purpose is to get feedback as I develop my design. I can't do that because if I say "I'm thinking about doing X or Y, what would you guys prefer" the vultures will go and add it to their product.

So, thread has no purpose as of right now. But, I am working on details for the NB version today :)

As a data guy, I'll throw my $ at The Pass' NA offering, when it's fully backed and ready.

Either pay for a vendor spot on this forum or stfu and go away. I think I speak for most when I say I'd prefer the latter, but for the love of god do one or the other. :loser: :fawk:

^ Hahaha that gave me a good laugh

Yes please continue. The support is here for you Ryan. Ryan is not twisting anyone's arm so if someone feels the need to vent go start your own thread.. otherwise just keep on moving. I'll be peeking in and out on progress...

Ps... Ryan please make a set for the nb but bottom mount.. please

There was a funny response to one of the tech posts on here, something like "You're doing it wrong. You're supposed to come in here, make outrageous claims with shaky science and wild conjecture, not provide verifiable information and test data..." and I was going to quote it here, if I could find it, because that's the first thing I thought of. Oh, and

Well then I sure am glad he's running test data on his now cut open hood. You know, in the picture he posted two posts above yours. :jerkit:

That's just one of four hoods we tested ;)

So where are the props? :hustler:

Haha I always forget about the props feature. You've been propped sir.

-Ryan

"It cracks me up a little.. setting a part intended for an s2000 on a different car, snapping a pic of it roughly in the position others said it should go, and then typing up a blerb on the webpage for the 'new' product does not a 'new developed' product make."

I was done with this thread until you guys continue on bashing me, long after I stopped posting. As long as you and your minions continue to bash someone they don't even know, who has 10 years more experience and 50 more proven products available than you have now, I will continue to post my views.

I find it humorous that there are folks here that would trust "your" product (which is a direct copy of MY product) to perform better than a product from the person who created the design in the first place. Kinda ironic......or something. ;)

I guess it must just be because I'm not into Miatas.....even though I own one somehow?

^^ This...

Sell your Miata, you whiny bitch.
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1406839499
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1406839499
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1406839222

Quite a collection of mature adults we have here. Is there a Big Boy section to this forum where adults can have a serious discussion?

Yeah. You're in it. The kid's table is the Meet and Great section. Might want to go introduce yourself.

You're asking if a forum with a pink theme, a cat's head in a turbo as the logged in icon and smilie's like this :brain::dealwithit::loser::party::pitlab: has a mature section?

I know... pay vendor fees to push your shit and find out. Otherwise GTFO!!! :giggle:

I'm in for a set for an NA. Can't wait

Imma market a set of louvers called zraptor styleworkz and sell them for $99. Universal custom fit.

I thought it was quite clever when I first saw vraptors shipped flat louvers I must say.

Hey, this guy copied your design too! https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1406862809
Oh wait, he's been dead for 100 fucking years.
Go away.

Why are you still posting here?:facepalm:

Lowering underhood temps is fine and all, but cooling off a hatch is NOT THE INTENDED purpose. :crx:

THE INTENDED PURPOSE IS TO CREATE A LARGER PRESSURE DIFFERENTIAL TO INCREASE FLOW THROUGH ALL OF THE FRIGGIN HEAT EXCHANGERS!!!

That includes the radiator, and possibly oil cooler and intercooler. Not many cars suffer catastrophic failure due to a hatch being too hot, or underhood temps being too high. Now a mechanical failure because of an oil cooler or radiator that wasn't doing its job...that actually happens.

You stand behind your products so hardcore, you actually install them for product photos. Wait...:bowrofl:

If the blue Miata is yours, the only thing you have shown is you won't install your product on your own car :rofl:

Earlier, I looked at my hood and thought "What makes you think I won't cut you?" :party:

I`m more irritated that a vendor that is not a sponsor has been posting links to their own site and product. Where are the mods to delete those posts and enforce the rules? Also has no intro thread and is thread crapping.

I don't care who stole what or all that other shit. Don't bring your shit covered shoes into my house when you were clearly asked to take your f`ing shoes off.

Let's steer things back on track here... :skid:

Can't wait to see the reaction when you start making vents for the GTM crowd!

All of his posts were deleted. He only linked to his own product once and it wasn't for a miata. A forum member is the one who linked to his miata specific louver.

I don't intend to install them in my own car because I don't race that car and have no intentions of doing so. I have no overheating issues with that car. It's bone stock, and I intend to keep it that way.

As for your twisted logic on engine bay heat.....I thought the purpose was to get HEAT away from where you don't want the HEAT to be? In the example I gave above, several people were having problems grenading their $10,000 transaxles. Why? Because the transaxle is air-cooled. If you have a transaxle processing 700+hp, it generates lots of heat. It's very tough to get that heat to transfer OUT of the transaxle case if the air surrounding the transaxle is 300 degrees....right? The only way the hatch can get so hot as to burn your fingers if if the inside of the engine bay is hot enough to heat the hatch to those temps, right? If you bring the temps in the engine bay down to closer to ambient temps, then the transaxle is surrounded by COOLER air than temp of the oil inside the transaxle, right? And if there is a temperature difference, then heat can transfer OUT of the transaxle....which resulted in a 120 degree DROP in transaxle oil temp......just by lowering the temperatures in the engine bay. And your transaxle lasts a heck of a lot longer when it's running at 180 degrees internally instead of 300.

I know this might all sound really complicated, but that is generally the purpose behind installing louvers......to reduce the temperature of something that is running too hot, right? To create a path for the heat to escape so you can allow cooler air to replace the hot air that previously occupied that same space? Maybe I'm all wrong here, but as long as I keep getting the results I wanted (significantly reduced temps of engine bay components) I guess I'll just keep doing things wrong. Why change what works?

I dont care how hot the air in the engine bay is, as long as its not hot enough to melt the electrical connectors and wiring. I care about increasing air flow through the heat ex-changers in the front of the car by increasing the delta P across them. If I just wanted to make it cooler in the engine bay I'd run turn signal intakes and hood risers.

Why are you wasting your time on this immature website forum? Don't you have Big Boy things to do? Like providing for your family? :loser:

Step away from the keyboard, start acting like a grownup, and get back to work. Leave all this tomfoolery to the rest of us 'mature adults'. :fawk:

Last I checked, heat exchangers exist to extract heat from the heat-generating components located under the hood. Maybe if your underhood temps weren't like a blast furnace, your heat exchanger would have less heat to try to extract? And isn't it logical that if you can effectively vent all of that heated air out of the engine bay, you've automatically created a path for more cool air to pass thru your heat exchanger?.....assuming your heat exchanger is located in front of the engine bay?

Focus all of your attention on getting heat out of an intercooler so that you can send that cooled air back into an intake that's heated to 250 degrees?

Focus on cooling your engine oil down at the oil cooler.....only to sent it back to an engine that's operating inside a furnace?

Yep, sounds like you have your priorities all straightened out. Good luck with that.

LOL.

Boy, you sure now Miatas, don't you? That made my day.



Well gents, i do believe that settles that, doesn't it? I'm sure glad that was quoted so it can stand forever in the history of MiataTurbo.net.

quoting this because LoL at understanding of pressure differential and how heat exchanges work. :loser:

What do you mean know miatas? I mean thats a failure of understanding basic thermodynamics from a guy who designs parts where knowledge of thermodynamics and thermofluids is paramount to achieving proper engineering design. There's more too louvers than just punching holes in shit.

indeed. If there was ever a case of just quitting while you were ahead (or behind) and sucking it up... this is it.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1406924097

Yes....Miatas are soooooo very much more difficult to understand than a twin-turbo V8 mid-engine car. None of the same concepts apply..........and the laws of thermodynamics are completely different. Lowering the oil temp of a transaxle by 120 degrees does not have anything at all to do with thermodynamics and everyone on this forum has a degree in that....right?

Got it.

Yep, we got our transaxles right in the engine bay heat, yup.

No you twit. The temperature in the engine bay's effect on engine temp is multiple orders of magnitude below the heat transfer through the heat exchangers in the front of the car. If you were to cool your engine bay to ambeint temps while maintaining the same front heat exchanger effectiveness the temperature in the fluids that have heat exchangers will change by such a marginally amount that you probably wont have accurate enough measurement devices to measure it.

And ah, lowering the temperature of your transaxle has everything to do with thermodynamics... because thats kind of how it happens. You know, heat transfer and stuff. And I'm sure in that case that having cooler engine by temperatures did actually effect the temperature of that fluid since it doesnt have its own external heat exchange and the bulk of its cooling is accomplished by convection directly off the casing and into the engine bay air.

You ninja posted me. It was directed to doofus over there, not you.

I was mostly taking delight in the whole thing where he pretty much said that hood risers are the shit.

I know it was, but this isnt a miata specific problem.

You're getting off topic. VR sucks, i just listen to you guys and learn that hood risers are bad and that louvers/vents should go in proper places, not in places that look cool.

:giggle:


And yes, this:

So you admit that the aluminum case of a transaxle can be effectively cooled by the air, which is the very mechanism by which it transfers it's heat.......but in the same breath, you say that the aluminum block and intake of an engine..... which has roughly the same surface area exposed to the air as the aluminum case of the transaxle mentioned above.......can not be affected one iota.....not to any measurable degree.....by the exact same mechanism? Interesting. So the law of thermodynamics only applies to the aluminum used in transaxle cases and not the aluminum used in engines or intakes?

Listen....I can already hear you come back and say that I'm now claiming you don't even need a radiator or intercooler or oil cooler. Nothing can be farther from the truth. What I am saying is that if you're pumping all of your heat "out" at the front of the car, only to blast that heat right back into the components that you just worked to extract the heat from......aren't you kind of defeating the purpose? What you're doing is the equivalent of putting the condensor coils of a refrigerator INSIDE the refrigerator....with the thinking that the refrigerator will cool off the condensor quicker and therefore the frig will work better......only to find that none of the stuff inside the frig gets cold anymore. The ice-box coils get cold, but all of the air inside the frig is heated by the condenser, and you've just turned your frig into an oven. Yes, it would actually get WARMER in there than the outside ambient temp.

I'm trying to help you guys out here....I really am. I'm not the enemy here, no matter how much you want to make me out to be. Mid-engine cars are a challenge to cool.....much more so than a front engine car. I've done it. Over and over and over again. I'm sure you'll ignore that fact and continue with your foot-stomping and name calling.

You don't even know enough about our cars to know that they come with iron blocks and not alum?

C'mon man, who are you kidding? You're not here to help, you're here to bicker because you're bitter because someone "stole" your non-patented idea.

With every post you're you're just coming accross more and more childish. Which in turn is making more and more people think less and less of you.

You're only hurting your own business by being so stubborn. I bet most here will buy from ThePass and not you simply because of how you come off with your posts.

Please go post somewhere else. Our Miata blocks aren't even aluminum! :facepalm:

Now that this thread is all crapped up, will you go elsewhere?

Better yet, go to ClubRoadster and start a thread, you would sell eleven billion of your untested product there.

And since the blocks are made from iron, everything I just said is false? Because iron is unable to transfer heat? I see.

I'm getting funny looks from people while driving around in my NB with no hood on it since it's in the garage :giggle:

Jesus fuck stay away from Clubroadster! Someday I'd like to be able to purchase a non molested NB hood.

So how different is the pressure map of the NB vs. NA? And what's the resolution on those maps (like 10 or 15 measurements?)