R-compounds on the street?
 

Is it worth it to have r-compound tires for street use? Just wanted everyone's opinion on this. :)

if you're baller enough to keep replacing them, why not?

I'd say no.
1. Cost is prohibitive (even if you are loaded... its silly waste)
2. No warning noise when u are pushing them... which you shouldn't be on the street
3. Water performance issues... majority of Rcomps are not fun in the wet.

Just run a nice summer performance tire.

you'll make bricks out of R-comps on the street faster than you'd wear through them I'd bet. They don't like to be heat cycled as often as a street tire can withstand.

I second everything Splitime said and will add:
4: When they do break away, you had better be on guard to catch them quick, they don't have that same gradual break-away that they do on the track running them at sane pressures on the street.
5: The ride just plain sucks.

On the street, you're better off sticking to a high performance summer tire and leaving the r-comps for track work.

also: the sound of gravel being slung into your wheelwells will get annoying after awhile.

Why? Any benifit to blowing money?

I drive on the street with r-comps, but my car only sees about 50-100 street miles a year and I don't own street tires for it.

You're an exception to the rule fourwhls.

Azenis are cheap, offer good traction, last around 10k miles with normal use and RS2s offer about the same or better especially if you plan to track the car. All for less money than a set of R comps.

Been there done that with RA-1s, for about 4 months. They beat the shit out of the car and I have missing paint to show for it. A near slick RA-1 will pick up a very supstantial rock and hammer it into your fender. Scared the crap out of me.

If you MUST do it, get mud flaps. It'll help with the paint a little.

i wonder how long roadkill would stick....

arent azenis r-comp?

Nope! Close, but no. They are 200 treadwear.

ah... i always thought they were some kind of stiffer r-compounds. great tires by the way. i went through a set of rear ones within 2k miles though... gonna try RS2 next

I beat my azenis' into the ground, I think I need a more aggressive alignment. I guess I'll have to upsize the wheels if I want more grip on the street. I'll wait for the new Toyo
R1-R's to come out and I'll purchase some 6UL's. Can't get the action without the traction.

I'm looking forward to seeing the R1-Rs as well as Kuhmo's new Ecsta XS. These guys are really pushing the limits of the "street tire" classification. I like it.

Wait and get the 15x9s and run 275s, if they'll fit.

R1-R in 225/45-15 = :bowdown:

I know what my next tire will be.

I'd like a set of them. Do they run wide like the azenis, i'm still on 205/50s rt615s.

You guys are not inspiring confidence in me here. I'm about to ditch the nearly-gone R-S2s for a set of NT-01s. I'm hoping to get 6000 miles out of them, basically through the end of summer 08.

I'd run street tires on the street and R-comps on the track, but I need R-comps for the track and it's either my 6ULs or some daisies, and the NT-01s are going on the 6ULs. :(

Plausible street tire options for your daisies:

http://edgeracing.com/tire/1513/

http://edgeracing.com/tire/1531/

http://edgeracing.com/tire/2545/

I run a set of V700 Victoracers in the summer time and they only cost me $50 each used. Would I used them as the only set of tires? No. But, even with them lasting about 4000 miles on the street, they are more fun.

I'll take the longest lasting r-comp available. I'm cheap.

rock city. Bye bye paint with r-comps. Hell I have thrown rocks into my car,and my eye (thank God my face shield was down) while driving in parking lots with V710's

A048R H (H for hard)
A032R H (ditto)
Toyo Proxes RA1

Anything else you are pretty much wasting a huge amount of money for the street.

I am gonna buck the trend... R-comps on the street are FUN.

Nothing like adhering the passenger up against the window in a corner.

1. Cost isn't that prohibitive with the right R-Comps.
2. A032R's aren't that bad in the wet... ok they are a little dicey but when I lived in Lancaster, CA rain wasn't much of a concern.
3. No Warning noise when they are gonna break away (is this really how you drive?!?)

I will grant people the complaint that they are noisy and you don't want to commute 2 hours each way on them... although me and the wife did run BFG/R1's back in the day as commuting tires. The cost when all was said and done about the same as the goodyear eagles that came on the T/A and a good set of tires on the Miata.

It is a shame that Yokohama no longer makes the RE92, that was a badass tire. It did everything well. A032R's are a great street tire, but just a little noisy. Azenis are a great compromise tire though.

Mark

The answer is NO for two reasons.

1. Rain, bad roads, etc... your traction will be severely limited, to a dangerous extent

2. Rt-615's, RE-01R, MX, and some others are all street tires with tread patterns and they are all capable of 1g or more. Do you need to pull more than 1g on the street? The answer is absolutely not, and if you are, you're driving extremely recklessly.

the longest lasting r-compounds are marginally more grippy than say a bridgestone re-01r street tire, with the added issue of needing more heat in the r-compound for it to grip 100%

Yes they run wide, the RE-01r in 195/50/15 is still a faster tire (and just about as wide) than the 205/50/15 azenis.

Personally I'd wait for kumho's new tire since it will be cheaper than the bridgestone and probably just as good.

sorry for noob question, but which new kumho
name? pic? anyhting...id like to know more
thanks

The recently announced Ecsta XS. There is presently some confusion as to whether it will be made available in any 15" sizes.

Of course, this is the same company that makes a lavendar-scented tire and a tire that produces colored smoke when spun, so who knows what to expect. :D

I have high expectations for the XS mostly because I like the MX so much. We can hope that they will have scented smoke and sweet tread colors too :bowdown: ;)

From what I have read (No personal experience)

The MX is inferior to the RT-615 / RE-01R / RS2 , STS autox results seem to reflect this, but top STS guys are running shaved street tires, so who knows.

It's not like it comes in 225/45/15 anyways. Just the RS2 and the new toyo that should be here soon.

Who knows what the XS and R1R will be like.

Based on personal and observed experience, the MX is a better tire than the azenis and RS2. The RS2 isn't too great of a tire IMO, unlike the MX even (there were still national level STS cars that placed with MX, although they are probably not as fast as they would be with azenis), cars with them don't tend to place well. The azenis is a faster tire than the MX on an autocross course, but it's more heat sensitive and (having raced on both) isn't as progressive or easy to drive on. I haven't used them, but from what I've read the RE-01R is like an MX on crack, where it acts like the MX but has much more grip. Also, the MX does better in standing water than the azenis, and they also tend to not suck up as many nails and road debris.

That's my 2 cents

I use Avon Tech RA on the street. Love'em. I used RA-1s before that. Loved them to.

http://www.hoppertech.com/miata/inde...s/image001.jpg

You might want to head back over to Miata.net. Where do you get this asinine and arbitrary number that more than 1g on the street is reckless driving? So someone driving an FD RX-7 at 1g with good tires is driving recklessly and the guy in the festiva who manages to pull .85g on crappy tires is not driving recklessly?

I'm sorry, that's bullshit. You can drive at over 1g on the street without being reckless. There are plenty of roads where it's not just possible, it's a lot of fun. Driving recklessly implies a loss of control, so just picking a number, like 1g doesn't mean shit. If my car were capable of 1.25g and I drive it up to 1g, I have a HUGE safety margin. If my car is capable of .9g and I drive at .8g, who has the lower safety margin. Your argument is moronic.

Mark

The reason I picked 1g as an "arbitrary" number, is because that's pretty close to the limit of a good street tire in a mildly modified car with a half decent alignment. Also:

:bowrofl: do you even realize how hard you're cornering at 1 g-force? To actually hit that number on the street it's safe to say that you'd need to be going well over double the speed limit or double the rated speed on a corner. At these speeds you can run into several problems including but not limited to:

1. Being unable to react fast enough to sudden issues with other drivers. What if someone veers into your lane in the middle of your 1g corner?

2. The car not having any capability left to do anything when you need to react to an obstacle such as other cars, sudden changes in road conditions, etc...

3. If you're seen by a cop doing this you'll get a massive ticket and possibly arrested.

The list goes on. You say reckless implies a loss of control. On the street you are automatically at a loss of control in many factors that don't normally come into play on a race track, and these risks are greatly magnified by speeding to the extent that you're reaching your tire's limit.

And no. If your car is capable of 1.25g's (which is dubious on street tires) and you're cornering at 1g, that is a very small margin.

You're the one that's pulling numbers out of their ass. Go ride in a fully prepped STS car at an autocross and tell me it would be safe to sustain cornering forces like that on the street.

You are a noob.

from what i've read the xs might be only 17" and up. I may try the r1r though.

I'm not trying to start shit here but come on people, seriously

Yes, I have driven on skidpads, I have done HPDE (Bondurant, Fastlane, etc), I have driven a number of vehicles from Shifter Karts and Formula Fords to Geo Metro's. And finally I have owned street cars that were capable of cornering in excess of 1g. So yes, You might say that I am familiar with cornering forces. And not always do you have to be so excessive in exceeding speed limits to generate these forces. Take a 50 MPH road with a 90 degree right turn onto another 50 MPH, I promise you that you can break 1g without exceeding the speed limit.

Hard to do, Sparky, on a one lane entrance ramp. But pulling 1g on a cloverleaf, easy.

Read the example above. A car capable of 1.25g has more capability left in it at 1g than a "regular" car capable of .9g does at .8g's cornering force.

Somehow in my 40 years I have avoided getting arrested. Soon to be 41 years. Maybe you are older than me, maybe not, but the fact remains that I have yet to be arrested behind the wheel... tickets, ya, I've had a few. It's not a big deal and won't stop me from speeding anytime soon.

Physics doesn't take a vacation at the racetrack. You go off in the sand at willow springs and you'll learn that lesson rather well as your car flips over and over. You're not "safer" on a racetrack unless you consider the fact that you have additional safety equipment on or that the meat wagon is close by.

LMAO, I am the noob. Oh, that's really good. I have built cars that have placed nationally in SM2. You might want to consider the fact that I have a lot more experience than you might think. I never said my car was capable of 1.25g's on street tires, on race rubber it probably is. My "street" car has 700 lb springs on the front, 450 lb springs in the back, and a ride height adjustable set of mazdaspeed coilovers.

Mark

PS - I'm the autocross champion in my apartment complex.

Yes, I have driven on skidpads, I have done HPDE (Bondurant, Fastlane, etc), I have driven a number of vehicles from Shifter Karts and Formula Fords to Geo Metro's. And finally I have owned street cars that were capable of cornering in excess of 1g. So yes, You might say that I am familiar with cornering forces. And not always do you have to be so excessive in exceeding speed limits to generate these forces. Take a 50 MPH road with a 90 degree right turn onto another 50 MPH, I promise you that you can break 1g without exceeding the speed limit.

So by your argument, it would make sense to have r-compounds on the street in order to pull an extra 1/4 g force on one or two out of the thousands of corners you come across?

Read the example above. A car capable of 1.25g has more capability left in it at 1g than a "regular" car capable of .9g does at .8g's cornering force.

What does this have to do with anything? There are virtually no street driven miatas on street tires that can pull that many g's to begin with, your point is moot


Somehow in my 40 years I have avoided getting arrested. Soon to be 41 years. Maybe you are older than me, maybe not, but the fact remains that I have yet to be arrested behind the wheel... tickets, ya, I've had a few. It's not a big deal and won't stop me from speeding anytime soon.

:ugh2:

Physics doesn't take a vacation at the racetrack. You go off in the sand at willow springs and you'll learn that lesson rather well as your car flips over and over. You're not "safer" on a racetrack unless you consider the fact that you have additional safety equipment on or that the meat wagon is close by.

This is one of the stupidest comments I've ever heard on the internet. Congratulations for being oblivious to all factors other than your own driving.

LMAO, I am the noob. Oh, that's really good. I have built cars that have placed nationally in SM2. You might want to consider the fact that I have a lot more experience than you might think. I never said my car was capable of 1.25g's on street tires, on race rubber it probably is. My "street" car has 700 lb springs on the front, 450 lb springs in the back, and a ride height adjustable set of mazdaspeed coilovers.

You definitely don't come across as someone with racing experience. And if your car can't pull 1g on street tires, where the hell did you come up with your "1.25g" number that has nothing to do with anything? And congrats on having stiff springs and coilovers, I'm really happy for you. It also has nothing to do with what we're talking about.

Let's recap my original point since it seems to be lost on you.

1. R-compounds on the street are pointless because there is no need to be able to exceed the limits of a good street tire outside of competition. There aren't any places on the street where it is called for to be driving like that. There are too many factors that are out of your control on the street to justify needing your car to be able to triple a given speed limit.

Right, and maybe I should pull the turbo off too, because my car is too fast to drive on the street.

Mark

Maybe you should, because it sounds like you drive like an irresponsible jackass and you don't even care or realize it.

Since I street race my R compounds are OK :bigtu:

Ya, well, I think you'll really blend in nicely with the Miata.net crowd and that fancy ass STS Escort "Race" car of yours. After all, you are the auto-x champion, on your block, or in your club... or whatever.

Like I said, build a car for nationals, then go talk smack. I have built more cars for competition than you have driven in. I have wins in NASA for endurance racing, SCCA Regional classes, and IDRC. So if you want to keep talking smack, why don't you throw out some of your impressive victories out there. Have you even driven a race car (no, not your mom's busted ass escort.)

Mark

I can't tell whether you're serious or not :confused:

Already resorting to insulting my driving and car huh? These things both have absolutely nothing to do with this thread so I'm not going to respond to them and get drug down into your pointless argument.

You think it's OK to drive recklessly on the street. I don't. You're wrong, I'm right. Have a nice day.

man... if Philip were still running the show you would probably be banned for attempting to e-thug The Don MarkP.

How am I e-thugging him? I wasn't the one that initially resorted to insults. If anyone should be banned it's him for advocating reckless driving. It's one thing to speed sometimes, but something else entirely for someone with supposed racing experience to suggest that it's safe to drive at 10/10 on the street.

I never said it was safe to drive 10/10ths on the street. I was suggesting 8/10ths. Look, I don't expect you to know this, but I didn't just fall off the turnip truck. I have been around for a while.

I am actually a pretty nice guy, I'd still buy you a beer (and I would still think you are wrong about R-compounds on the street.)

Mark

That's too fuckin' priceless... The Don... LMAO, come on now, I am just another guy with a Miata and a HP addiction.

Mark

Cutlass, this is not miata.net. You won't get banned for posting or talking about street racing, reckless driving, and whatever other dangerous stuff you wanna talk about so chill out. To each their own opinion. :)

You're telling me to chill out? lol

Meh, I don't mean to say that, just that Mark is allowed to talk about, even encourage reckless driving.

If that's what you were suggesting then your argument was totally lost on me :confused:

Anyway this is obviously going nowhere, I'm finished with this argument.

We can do the agree to disagree thing now ;)

Agreed:bigtu:

i say go with some r-compounds if you want. i have never drove a car with r-compunds. but i have track tires on my bike (pirelli super corsa pros) and the difference between street tires is amazing. i will NEVER go back to a standard street tire now

LOL, sometimes I even drive recklessly... but usually not on the street, even with R-Compounds on the car.

Mark

Bryantaylor, with R-compounds on a bike, wouldn't you have to worry about flattening them out if you do more highway miles than actual curvy roads?

I said ATTEMPTING TO, you weren't being very successful. ;)

Let me put it this way... when I mention your username to any of my miata owning friends they recognize it. I can't say the same about folks with 10X as many posts as you.