Rebuild Bp or go FE3? - Page 2 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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View Poll Results: Which motor to go with now for 350-400whp
Rebuild bp with built bottom end and 99 head 18 31.58%
Stock FE3.. 39 68.42%
Voters: 57. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 02-20-2010, 02:37 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeepster118 View Post
damn. the F3 came in the kia sportage then? going to def look into one of those. the custom intake is understandable from its FWD origin but for the exhuast i heard some people can make a bp 1.8 manifold fit? what is required?
Look into the gen1 sportage more, it has an inline mounted engine so the IM will work as long as it clears the hood.
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Old 02-20-2010, 02:45 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inferno94 View Post
Look into the gen1 sportage more, it has an inline mounted engine so the IM will work as long as it clears the hood.
It goes over the top of the valve cover, does not work.

It takes some cutting of the valve cover and subframe shimming to fit under the hood as-is.

If it did work though it would be nice (for WI) since it's a center-feed design.
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Old 02-20-2010, 02:57 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by gospeed81 View Post
It goes over the top of the valve cover, does not work.

It takes some cutting of the valve cover and subframe shimming to fit under the hood as-is.

If it did work though it would be nice (for WI) since it's a center-feed design.
Thanks, I wasn't sure how that would work in a miata as I know it was a tight fit in a b2200.
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Old 02-20-2010, 04:07 PM   #24
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FE3. If you only hit the track once in awhile a inch or so of COG difference and maybe another 50 Lbs of weight (most of which is going to be behind the front axle-line. is not going to matter as much as cheap reliability.

Beyond the inherent DIY nature of this that will require a small amount of trailblazing, I dont see a real downside. I know I will be watching carefully.
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Old 02-20-2010, 04:48 PM   #25
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You'll run into input shaft length issues if you use the adapter plate. That means you'll need a custom PP that regains your tolerance lost to the plate thickness. And your shifter will sit back that much further. The TII trans has a much shallower bell than the miata 5 spd so the adapter plate works fine.

I don't think there's much trailblazing to do at this point as far as the engine swap goes.
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Old 02-20-2010, 05:38 PM   #26
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^ The way it looked on the webpage posted earlier (Solomiata : Interchange : FE3 motor) an adapter plate is not needed at all if its done that way.

Not much in the way of unknown stuff at all. Fabbing mounts looks like a PITA, but then too I wonder if someone has some templates that would save time
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Old 02-20-2010, 05:54 PM   #27
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i feel somehow compelled to comment on this.

i've run 7psi on a stock kia fe3 with stock engine management (the kia bosch stuff, not miata). engine lasted 150,000km. so did the trans. whatswrong with using a sportage trans? its a getrag unit from what i recall...
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Old 02-20-2010, 06:25 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m2cupcar View Post
You'll run into input shaft length issues if you use the adapter plate. That means you'll need a custom PP that regains your tolerance lost to the plate thickness. And your shifter will sit back that much further. The TII trans has a much shallower bell than the miata 5 spd so the adapter plate works fine.

I don't think there's much trailblazing to do at this point as far as the engine swap goes.
Why not just use an adapter plate and a flywheel spacer? Run my miata 6 speed, ok the shifter will sit 1/2" back thats **** all. Then I can retain the miata clutch aswell.

I agree, there isnt much for trailblazing, custom motor mounts, oil pan, intake manifold, trans plate..Easy stuff.

What is a common replacement injector when going bigger?

Last edited by dc2696; 02-20-2010 at 06:42 PM.
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Old 02-20-2010, 06:42 PM   #29
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Based on the site mentioned the injectors we tend to be familiar with will probably have sealing issues on the Kia intake mani, and he was simply going to machine in some bosses. The pics I am seeing of the FE head show the same shape that you see on the 1.6 heads which allow the injectors to basically be mounted right at the intake mani flange.

I think the same work being done with the Honda based intakes welded to the BP flange would be awesome in this case, especially considering that the FE from a Kia likely has a much more low-end focused intake anyway.
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Old 02-20-2010, 09:02 PM   #30
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One day if one of these motors falls in my lap, this swap will be done. Ever since i saw m2cupcars car years ago ive had a hard on for it.
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Old 02-21-2010, 12:54 AM   #31
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The custom flywheel solution was following the application set forth by Mazda- same thickness and hardware. I don't know anything about using a spacer, but I do know that I don't want any flywheel bolts sheering in my car. Any examples of flywheel spacers elsewhere? I know the F8 I have came with a flexplate that had a 1/8" spacer on it- but that's totally different than clutch.

I'm using some aluminum bosses set into the kia manifold to use Rx7 injectors. But the OE mazda FE3 manifold has standard injector bosses.

Sportage- the biggest issue with the getrag are the ratios, especially using them in a 2200# car. Mazda's b2600 R trans will bolt up to FE but it's got "truck" ratios too. It is a solution, but you'll be swapping gears for something usable.
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Old 02-21-2010, 04:36 AM   #32
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Tons of cars use flywheel spacers and adapter plates, H2b kits do, domestic kits I've seen them, it's nothin new and it's cheap and effective.

I've never made an adapter plate but I think if I make a dummy copy in wood then get a aluminum one water cut I'll be able to make it and not **** it up too badly
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Old 02-21-2010, 11:02 AM   #33
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Cool- I never looked into it, but that will make things simpler for me. With the bongo van bell housing I only need 10mm max spacer.
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Old 02-21-2010, 11:11 AM   #34
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do an FE3 and show us all that we should do it.

if you run a spacer though, would the oil pan hit the subframe? or would you have to move the trans back that amount on the PPF and remove that from the driveshaft?
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Old 02-21-2010, 01:39 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shlammed View Post
do an FE3 and show us all that we should do it.

if you run a spacer though, would the oil pan hit the subframe? or would you have to move the trans back that amount on the PPF and remove that from the driveshaft?
Since the motor mounts are custom I'll just make them to tailor fit so the driveshaft fits. I hear swaybar clearance is tight though already too.

All right Im gonna do the swap, just have to make sure my old pistons and rods are ok and sell that ****
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Old 02-21-2010, 02:04 PM   #36
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I'll tell ya, after thinking more about this, one downside I see would be the aftermarket / enthusiast support. Sure there have been a few people that have done the swap but other than that you'd pretty much be on your own. Right now with a 1.8 or 1.6, you can easily buy any aftermarket part you need and not have to worry about fitment or compatability issues (Driveline parts, bracing, etc) , people like TurboTim and ARTech make killer parts for people and can do so since they have the abilities to mock everything up on their own cars, and setups are more proven which makes it easier for one to achieve the results they are after. I know the FE3 has loads of benifits, but the more I think about it, 250whp on a stock 1.6 or 1.8 really is a headache free bargin. Sure I'd love to have more power either by a FE3, LS1, or a built BP, but its nice not having to worry too much about blowing motors, replacing parts, and all the other unknowns.
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Old 02-22-2010, 01:14 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cspence View Post
I'll tell ya, after thinking more about this, one downside I see would be the aftermarket / enthusiast support. Sure there have been a few people that have done the swap but other than that you'd pretty much be on your own. Right now with a 1.8 or 1.6, you can easily buy any aftermarket part you need and not have to worry about fitment or compatability issues (Driveline parts, bracing, etc) , people like TurboTim and ARTech make killer parts for people and can do so since they have the abilities to mock everything up on their own cars, and setups are more proven which makes it easier for one to achieve the results they are after. I know the FE3 has loads of benifits, but the more I think about it, 250whp on a stock 1.6 or 1.8 really is a headache free bargin. Sure I'd love to have more power either by a FE3, LS1, or a built BP, but its nice not having to worry too much about blowing motors, replacing parts, and all the other unknowns.
Meh all my **** is custom made anyways, I dont think I have one ots part in my car.

Ok I'm going to do it,

Step 1: sell old parts
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Old 02-22-2010, 02:10 AM   #38
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Coulda had a V8.
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Old 02-22-2010, 02:26 AM   #39
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Go FE3. I have a genuine mazda block/head in my mx6 that I rebuilt with stock KIA parts. As of now its been sub 300hp and holding up pretty well. For a 400hp goal the only thing I can recommend is to upgrade the pistons to forged units and maintain the stock compression ratio.

I do feel very tempted to put the FE3 in my miata, but I dont want to deal with the custom stuff, just yet.
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Old 02-22-2010, 02:40 AM   #40
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m2cupcar, where is your build thread? I remember seeing it maybe a month ago.. now im going crazy trying to find it. Linkie pls!
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