so hydra charges for firmware? - Page 3 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 06-19-2008, 06:50 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by Rafa View Post
To me as a customer, this doesn't make sense. Y8s mentioned a guy who'd bought his 1 month before. I surely wouldn't like to be in his shoes.
The new version costs $100 more than the old version. The upgrade fee is $100. The dude has 0 room to bitch.
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Old 06-19-2008, 07:27 PM   #42
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FWIW, I don't think anyone believes the Hydra to be inferior to the MS, but it is a drastic difference in price, coupled with the nickel-n-dime stuff that is irritating.
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Old 06-19-2008, 07:28 PM   #43
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Jerry showed me a picture today of a 1,600 hp camaro, that runs a megasquirt. If it can run a MS, I sure as hell will never need a $2k ecu.
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Old 06-19-2008, 07:36 PM   #44
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There is enough of a fear factor (in Dallas at least) that MSpnp is a big bird nest of black boxes and mystery inside the case, which supposedly will never work right and somehow blows up engine unsuspectingly. Someone asked me last night, "are you comfortable putting 'gray market, fly by night' engine management on such a nice engine and turbo system?" People still think the more money you spend, the more you get. People in Dallas still think PC-Pro is superior to MS for reliability. I don't get it. Last night I also hear that my turbo car is going to overheat on the track, break studs, and I won't be able to get it tuned and blow it up. "You should have gone with an M62 and pcpro because all these people have it and it works." People act like its a miaracle that I've been driving a car on MS for 6-months.



I thought about buying Hydra long and hard before I made my decision to get MS because I was worried about efficacy, which I now understand was not a concern.
For alot of those guys it comes down to tuning. They can get it street tuned very quick and never have to worry about it. They don't wanna hassle with it, or with squeaking out a couple more ponies.

There's alot more local support for those guys for running M62/superchargers. They don't have to blaze any trails and there's more security in that.

Chris
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Old 06-19-2008, 07:52 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Stealth97 View Post
Jerry showed me a picture today of a 1,600 hp camaro, that runs a megasquirt. If it can run a MS, I sure as hell will never need a $2k ecu.
x2 Megasquirt is a pretty powerful device. From just some quick reading(and I mean really quick) about the hydra, vs. my more extensive reading about the MS, they look like they pretty much offer the same stuff. So I'll just ask it, what does the hydra offer that the MS doesn't, specifically though, id it enough to justify almost $1300?
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Old 06-19-2008, 09:38 PM   #46
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The new version costs $100 more than the old version. The upgrade fee is $100. The dude has 0 room to bitch.
I'm the dude, so here's my stance on it. It's not about the money at all. This is the engine management I want to run on my 01 and my build will be complete around the end of July. I have been slowly acquiring pieces over the past 6 months or so and this was one of them. When I made the purchase I stated to them that my build wouldn't be finished for another couple of months. This was told to FM specifically so I could avoid something like this. So, when the customer is told by the vendor specifically there's no reason to wait a couple months, I expect it to be the truth. I'm pissed that I wasn't told and I have to go through the hassle of sending it back to them just so they can send it to someone different to get the update done. It's a stupid gripe to have, but oh well.
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Old 06-19-2008, 09:45 PM   #47
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I wonder if the new version works well with Vista..... if so that would be worth my hundred bucks.

Perhaps a map switching function that's easy to use?

I'll have to wait and see what the advantages are to the new box before I go plunking down a hundred or more dollars for an update, not to mention the downtime for the car.
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Old 06-19-2008, 10:49 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by Pitlab77 View Post
sounds like the hydra is pretty sh#$y if they have to keep fixing it like this
not fixing, improving.

perhaps you've heard of widows xp service pack 3
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Old 06-19-2008, 11:09 PM   #49
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I'm the dude, so here's my stance on it. It's not about the money at all. This is the engine management I want to run on my 01 and my build will be complete around the end of July. I have been slowly acquiring pieces over the past 6 months or so and this was one of them. When I made the purchase I stated to them that my build wouldn't be finished for another couple of months. This was told to FM specifically so I could avoid something like this. So, when the customer is told by the vendor specifically there's no reason to wait a couple months, I expect it to be the truth. I'm pissed that I wasn't told and I have to go through the hassle of sending it back to them just so they can send it to someone different to get the update done. It's a stupid gripe to have, but oh well.
I think you're absolutely right in your position. I personally like FM even though I've only purchased their springs I have nothing but praise for how they treated me but I went through the EMS decision a long time ago and I think it's one of the toughest calls anyone building a turbo kit for their cars has to make. In my case, the EMS ended up being the most expensive single investment I made.

I'd be pissed too.
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Old 06-19-2008, 11:16 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by J.T. View Post
x2 Megasquirt is a pretty powerful device. From just some quick reading(and I mean really quick) about the hydra, vs. my more extensive reading about the MS, they look like they pretty much offer the same stuff. So I'll just ask it, what does the hydra offer that the MS doesn't, specifically though, id it enough to justify almost $1300?
What does a Mac offer over a PC?

Youre gonna have two camps arguing and no one will ever budge.
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Old 06-19-2008, 11:21 PM   #51
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another nguyen for MS.
Lol.
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Old 06-20-2008, 12:23 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayMX5 View Post
I'm the dude, so here's my stance on it. It's not about the money at all. This is the engine management I want to run on my 01 and my build will be complete around the end of July. I have been slowly acquiring pieces over the past 6 months or so and this was one of them. When I made the purchase I stated to them that my build wouldn't be finished for another couple of months. This was told to FM specifically so I could avoid something like this. So, when the customer is told by the vendor specifically there's no reason to wait a couple months, I expect it to be the truth. I'm pissed that I wasn't told and I have to go through the hassle of sending it back to them just so they can send it to someone different to get the update done. It's a stupid gripe to have, but oh well.
Hey I agree with you. It would have been nice if the salesman was a bit more forthcoming in letting you know a new version was coming out soon, instead of unloading the old stuff off on you. Probably the right thing to do was for the vendor to let you know that there was a newer, more expensive, and more feature rich product coming soon, then given you the option of getting the less expensive or more expensive product.
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Old 06-20-2008, 12:27 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by J.T. View Post
x2 Megasquirt is a pretty powerful device. From just some quick reading(and I mean really quick) about the hydra, vs. my more extensive reading about the MS, they look like they pretty much offer the same stuff. So I'll just ask it, what does the hydra offer that the MS doesn't, specifically though, id it enough to justify almost $1300?
The Hydra does tons of things the MS doesn't. Do a little research and you'll quickly see how the Hydra has pretty much unlimited I/O where the MS is basically tapped out.

Full sequential fuel, full sequntial ignition, 3D VVT control, super huge resolution tables. Is this describing MS or Hydra?
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Old 06-20-2008, 01:53 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayMX5 View Post
I'm the dude, so here's my stance on it. It's not about the money at all. This is the engine management I want to run on my 01 and my build will be complete around the end of July. I have been slowly acquiring pieces over the past 6 months or so and this was one of them. When I made the purchase I stated to them that my build wouldn't be finished for another couple of months. This was told to FM specifically so I could avoid something like this. So, when the customer is told by the vendor specifically there's no reason to wait a couple months, I expect it to be the truth. I'm pissed that I wasn't told and I have to go through the hassle of sending it back to them just so they can send it to someone different to get the update done. It's a stupid gripe to have, but oh well.
I feel you man. Its going to cost $100 to do the mod, probably $75 to ship both ways with insurance, and its certain to take at least 2 weeks in transport alone.
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Old 06-20-2008, 02:02 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by Miatamaniac92 View Post
For alot of those guys it comes down to tuning. They can get it street tuned very quick and never have to worry about it. They don't wanna hassle with it, or with squeaking out a couple more ponies.

There's alot more local support for those guys for running M62/superchargers. They don't have to blaze any trails and there's more security in that.

Chris
yeah, they all tune the pc-pro to 11.5:1 on cars that make 180whp and call it a day...lol.
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Old 06-20-2008, 10:57 AM   #56
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Originally Posted by Ben View Post
The Hydra does tons of things the MS doesn't. Do a little research and you'll quickly see how the Hydra has pretty much unlimited I/O where the MS is basically tapped out.

Full sequential fuel, full sequntial ignition, 3D VVT control, super huge resolution tables. Is this describing MS or Hydra?
I'm gonna side with ben on the hydra vs. ms debate. the ms can't even do sequential injection.

and most of my complaints about the hydra (UI and logging) have been very nicely dealt with. and it's STILL dirt cheap compared to a MoTeC.
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Old 06-20-2008, 11:30 AM   #57
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and most of my complaints about the hydra (UI and logging) have been very nicely dealt with. and it's STILL dirt cheap compared to a MoTeC.
my dad put an m400 on the turbo car and I just about **** when I saw the retail price of that ****. However, it can actually map a genome within the 7.10 second pass.
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Old 06-20-2008, 02:53 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by y8s View Post
I'm gonna side with ben on the hydra vs. ms debate. the ms can't even do sequential injection.

and most of my complaints about the hydra (UI and logging) have been very nicely dealt with. and it's STILL dirt cheap compared to a MoTeC.
If I had an NB I'd probably want the Hydra for the VVT stuff, but sequential injection is meh.
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Old 06-20-2008, 02:57 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by y8s View Post
not fixing, improving.

perhaps you've heard of widows xp service pack 3
yes but I didnt have to pay for SP3

and vista sucks
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Old 06-20-2008, 04:10 PM   #60
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The new software is miles ahead of the 2.5. From what I recall, there is actually hardware modification that goes into the 2.6 box, not just a software update.

You guys can bitch and bitch and bitch.. but if you weren't ever going to buy one, where does all that bitching get you?
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