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Old 12-29-2008, 08:01 PM   #1
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Default It's been a while since we've had a political thread...

Looks like the middle east is going to **** again. It's the same thing every time. Both sides are unwilling to make concessions or stick to any agreements. Of course our government unilaterally supports Israel and calls the Palestinians "terrorists" which is a nice way to end any discussion before it begins. I don't support either side in this conflict. I don't support any political movement that uses violence as a means to their ends.

I understand the anger of the Palestinians who had their land taken from them and have become second class citizens in their own country. I also find the treatment of them by the Israelis to be disgustingly hypocritical. You are subjugated and treated like animals by one government only to turn around and do the same thing to another people? On the other hand I understand that the Palestinians are not saints and are certainly breaking as many promises as the Israelis and doing their fair share in instigating violence.

Neither side really seems to want peace but are actually looking for opportunities for conflict. It seems like this is never going to end. Though I hae no personal stake in the situation it does make me sad to see the same situation occur over and over and it infuriates me to see our governments one sided and wholly unhelpful role in this conflict. What the hell happened to a two state solution?
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Old 12-29-2008, 08:20 PM   #2
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As long as the Israelis are occupying Palestinian lands there will not be peace there, period, and the Palestinians and other sympathetic Arab states will ensure that there is no peace.

One of my teachers is Palestinian and she jumps at the slightest thing from having grown up in Israel.

I read in the "USA Today" this morning (stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night) a sentence which actually got me a little heated: "Israel was born". Born??? If demanding a land be surrendered by its rightful owners to a new group simply because the British thought it was a good idea is birth then sure..
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Old 12-29-2008, 09:07 PM   #3
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Kotomile, care to explain your sig? Did i miss something?, lol.
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Old 12-29-2008, 09:10 PM   #4
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an idiot noob that got banned threatened to crash this site...he failed miserably, just as bad as he failed when making a thread about a rotary 600+ whp miata he was planning on building
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Old 12-29-2008, 11:03 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kotomile View Post
As long as the Israelis are occupying Palestinian lands there will not be peace there
You should probably get your history right. Just to make sure I understand your point, Palestine was a sovereign nation before Israel declared independence? You believe that Britain took land from a sovereign nation and created another nation within it lands?
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Old 12-30-2008, 01:10 AM   #6
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Yes. See - Balfour Declaration of 1917:



Winston Churchill, in 1922:

In both Houses of Parliament there is growing movement of hostility, against Zionist policy in Palestine, which will be stimulated by recent Northcliffe articles. I do not attach undue importance to this movement, but it is increasingly difficult to meet the argument that it is unfair to ask the British taxpayer, already overwhelmed with taxation, to bear the cost of imposing on Palestine an unpopular policy.

If you believe I need to get my history straight, please provide examples to back up your view.

Last edited by kotomile; 12-30-2008 at 01:45 AM.
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Old 12-30-2008, 01:39 AM   #7
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Yes. Judging by your avatar, I'm inclined to believe you have a bias..
Everyone has a bias, but you haven't clarified your statements. If 'yes' was your response please clarify and support it.
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Old 12-30-2008, 01:41 AM   #8
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Yes. See - Balfour Declaration:

Britain did not declare Israel a nation, nor did it happen in 1917. Palestine is refered to a geographical location, not a soverign nation.
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Old 12-30-2008, 01:56 AM   #9
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Palestine is also several million people swept aside to make room for the Zionists.

Of course it didn't happen in 1917, and we didn't gain our independence in 1776 either... but it set things in motion. It's all right there: "His majesty's government view with favor the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people" Doesn't get much more black-and-white than that.
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Old 12-30-2008, 02:04 AM   #10
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Britain did not declare Israel a nation, nor did it happen in 1917. Palestine is refered to a geographical location, not a soverign nation.
In the great imperialistic tradition of our forefathers you declare that just because you don't have a flag, you don't have a right nor the pleasure of owning the land you've inhabited for 2000 years.

Zionism was a bigot's answer to the "Jewish Question".

They had no right to the land outside of writings in the bible.
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Old 12-30-2008, 02:10 AM   #11
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I can't believe I'm posting Eddie Izzard material to illustrate a point..

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Old 12-30-2008, 02:12 AM   #12
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I can't believe I'm posting Eddie Izzard material to illustrate a point..
You got my reference
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Old 12-30-2008, 03:45 AM   #13
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Old 12-30-2008, 07:30 AM   #14
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There will always be fighting - like two brothers...no peace. We should leave them be. As I explained to anyone who asked...short of genacide...there is nothing we can do - and since genocide isn't an option (not even close to an option) we should keep our noses out of it.

Sidebar...did anyone else notice Obama stating we would withdraw from the Middle East if he got the Presidency...but the other day making a statement he would infuse more troops into the Middle East by the summer?
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Old 12-30-2008, 08:51 AM   #15
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If demanding a land be surrendered by its rightful owners to a new group simply because the British thought it was a good idea is birth then sure..
Are you talking about the Middle East or the US of A? There's some American Injuns that might take offense to your offense. Just sayin. Though you might need to replace "British" in the sentence above.

Frank
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Old 12-30-2008, 10:21 AM   #16
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Nuke em all!
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Old 12-30-2008, 10:36 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kotomile View Post
Palestine is also several million people swept aside to make room for the Zionists.

Of course it didn't happen in 1917, and we didn't gain our independence in 1776 either... but it set things in motion. It's all right there: "His majesty's government view with favor the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people" Doesn't get much more black-and-white than that.
Again your history is wrong, but I guess we should give back the US from your point of view? The native americans were here first...

What you are missing is at the same point Israel was created, Palestinians were given an opportunity to make their own nation, and they refused. I guess i am surprised that given how the world has formed and people have fought to create sovereign nations that somehow Israel should be exempt from that.

And the White Paper of 1939 disagrees with your assertion, in fact Britain wanted to limit Jewish immigration. In fact Arabs would have had to grant permission for Jewish immigration.
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Old 12-30-2008, 10:46 AM   #18
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I feel bad for the civilians, but thats the problem with Terrorists they hide among civilians.
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Old 12-30-2008, 10:58 AM   #19
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Problem is as it will always be.

Good people can live together in harmony regardless of their cultural or religious beliefs, age, sex, or ethnicity. The other 10 percent can only elevate themselves by hating on others.

The horror is that it is NOT a small minority.
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Old 12-30-2008, 11:24 AM   #20
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I think we need to have Iran, Iraq, and Afghanistan turn on each other much like this situation. Would free up our military for awhile at least.
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