Manufacture Debate. Is American built junk?
 

SPIN OFF FROM THE PARKING LIKE AN A**HOLE THREAD

$88k for an friggin Avalanche?? WTF?

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...5&d=1322671873

this was the exact one i looked at, photo was sent to the wife. Chrome gayness over the wheel wells could be removed they said. It had around 4k on it.

I believe total cost on that one specifically was north of 50k with taxes, as it sits without any other options. New they said around 88k out the door.

A new escalade was around 110 i think they said but at that point i was lolling. Wife wanted the EXT Esc as did i, I thought they were nice (though since I test drove a used one and they seem like junk). And after test driving a used one i realized the EXT was kind of stupid.

Not in my realm will I be flossing an Escalade with twenty foes.

Rick, you have a problem. This problem is that you seem to have considered buying a GM product. I feel sorry for you.


I don't get why people think that a truck with a few leather and chrome bits is something to feel "baller" about. Hell, a true baller would buy a Peterbuilt or Freightliner..

Rick, you need this, without the big wheels:

http://i41.tinypic.com/24fbdqu.jpg

Think about it, you could go around blasting the Team America soundtrack and everyone would love you so much for it.

Yea, diesel cummins is mint, same with the 7.3 Ford..think thats it.
Every diesel person I spoke to said go that way if I must, not 6.0

I would totally rock that truck above, but it needs a cap.

I was wondering what thread I put that post in, I went into the "Ricks toy truck is a chop shop special" thread and it wasn't there...

Rick buy a GM, after you put a fuel pump, and a WP on it, you will have no out of the ordinary problems maybe a hub assembley after 120K. Plus working on an LS is easy as shit.

If its a 2WD the front end parts are very durable.

If its a 4WD you will eventually need pretty much a whole front end, same goes for the dodges, and Ford are way out in front as clearly the worst front suspension ever.

Im a service writer/mechanic in Texas, Id say 80% of my work is trucks. I would buy a Dodge or Chevy any day, you couldnt give me a Ford unless it was a 7.3.

And Tundras are complete shit.

Also doppleganger I dont think anyone who drives a miata should talk about what is and isnt a manly vehicle.

If you're considering anything American you're a little light in the head department if you ask me. Nearly all junk.

If you don't like the Tuntra get something else Japanese or better yet, British. Just please, nothing American.

Sorry this isn't the right thread, but whatevs.

Oh the paradox...I can't say what is "manly" because I drive a Miata...yet I can say what is manily because I do drive a Miata.

I'm not knocking on the mechanicals of some American trucks and whatnot, there are a lot of them that run forever. However, it's the overall design and all the shitty interior materials are complete garbage. Nothing like being reminded of shitty plastics everytime you get into your GM made vehicle.


I'm really surprised that the Japanese mfgs. have not tried to get in on the diesel market.

The only experience I have is the bushings in my '97 (2nd gen) Dakota Sport 4x2 being completely shot after 11xk miles. Everything else was fine, but in heavy vehicles the suspension parts put up with a lot of abuse. My moms 2005ish caravan has 60k-70k miles and the front suspension is starting to squeak. That shit isn't cheap to fix either.

I towed my miata plus 1500 pounds from New York to TX with a Chevy 1500. It had horrible rod knock before I even began the journey. Not only did it complete it, but I drove it as a daily for a while and eventually sold it for good money.

Although that was an older Chevy.

Seriously how hard is it to build a quality vehicle. I keep wondering, there must be a guy that just keeps fucking shit up. To get hired by ford/chevy/dodge, you would think that you would need to be very fucking smart. So why do they keep fucking up?

"tradition", seriously. They refuse to change their ideals. It's why Toyota and Honda have grown so much, they constantly improving. Trying to implement change in an American manufacturing company is like pulling teeth. "we're different", "we used to make more product faster than we do with this new system". Bull shit.

Shareholders want a specific return on their investment. Say, 40% profit as an arbitrary mark.

They hire some guys who claim Six Sigma experience for streamlining and QC. the guy comes in and tells the engineers you gotta make this car 30% cheaper, so we can sell it at the same price in a slightly larger quantity because EVERYONE loved the one from last year.

engineers cut cost, sacrifice quality, reliability, performance, or usability. You think GM made an awesome car before!!! let me buy this one, and it sucks. Some people think its a fluke and buy another, so it further reinforces this type of behavior. Some don't and move on to a jap/euro manufacturer.

Eventually it gets bad enough like in 06-08/09 where GM/Chrysler/Ford cars were so fucking shitty that no one bought them.

I really don't think you guys could be any more wrong. GM has increased their quality level by light years. Every bread and butter GM vehicle made between 1970 and ~2008 was a universally bad vehicle, but a new Cruze/ Malibu is actually REALLY nice. The interior quality has come up 200%, and the drivetrains have been COMPLETELY redesigned. Where GM Powertrain rocked face with the 3rd/ 4th Gen small blocks, and left an effectively unchanged 1980s 3800 boat anchor in the more pedestrian cars, the new 6-cylinders are every bit as good as Nissan's or Honda's best products. The same can be said of the newest Ecotecs, and the trucks have seen significant improvement, too.






You still couldn't give me an Avalanche. Those damn things are hideous.

My wife has a Murano, its a chick truck... errr wait, wrong forum for that.

:fawk:

I like the domestic stuff. I did have a thing for the Honda Ridgeline but it looks more awkward than the Avalanche or EXT Escalade.

I also had an older Mazda MPV for a moment in time... engine failed, sold it. It was a great truck otherwise but engine wise it started to fall apart with a limited amount of mileage on it.... but I liked it.

I liked the Toyota FJ Cruiser. In fact we looked at that before her Murano. I thought it had such a unique look. First thing I did getting in was slam my knee on the dash so bad that I limped out.... i was pissed and declared it too small. Murano is surprisingly big for how it looks from the exterior and we bought it 1 hour later.

Rick, I want you to listen to me...05-07 Toyota Sequoia 4x4 Limited
2UZ motor
3 rows
Tuff as shit, if you could see what I did to mine you would be impressed, towing, mudding, baja, sleeping, ramping, racing, 3' water crossings, etc. I put a 3" lift on it and 33" tires and called it a day.

I believe several members here have those, SamNavy comes to mind.

I was just about to suggest the FJ Cruiser.

I'm pretty sure truck buyers could give two shits about "soft-touch" plastics and "nickel-finish" trim on the dash. They want shit to work and not fall apart.

Nothing like being reminded of dead-nuts reliability, cheap parts, and ease of repair every time a Chevy cranks up and does its fucking job every time you ask it. Same thing with my beat-to-shit $2300 F150. Sorry, but if you want an affordable, reliable, full-size, modern truck that can tow some shit, then you probably want to buy American (and don't throw Toyota back at me - they may be built in San Antone, but they're hideously overpriced and not worth the money).

Besides that, have you been inside a new Ford or Chevy lately? They're every bit as nice (or nicer) than a full-size Far East truck. Dodge is still working on their act, but they're catching up.

There's no way they could go head-to-head with the Big Three. They don't even want to touch the heavy duty market because we've got it covered. ;)

Its comforting knowing I don't have to replace the timing belt every 60K miles which can be a major ordeal. The newer 5.3/6.0/4.6/5.4's are also very reliable. Hell, the junk 5.3 in the Miata had 120k miles on it when I put it in it hits 6800rpm on a daily basis while making a conservative 320rwhp or so. The 180k mile I6 in the Jeep has sat at the far side of its tach for minutes in mud holes because it'd keep inching forward while buried up to the headlights in soup.

If I wanted comfort, I'd get into a car. Trucks should be harder, rougher, and more intolerable then the sissies they've become. In the 50's-70's, you had a truck for WORK and a car to be seen in. You didn't go to church in your truck. I laugh every time I see a truck without any "work marks" in the bed, especially the diesels. If you don't work a diesel, you kill a diesel.

As far as the diesels- US emissions have choked out any good left in new diesels. When I have to run the equivalent of hog piss in a separate tank and the mileage is about the same as a gasser, its just not worth it. Now add in the added expense of owning a diesel over a gasser in maintenance and extra money up front and it makes it a waste now unless you actually use the truck (like pulling 15k or more which would rip the guts out of most any gasser when our old coal burner takes it and runs better from it).

Cliff notes-
Simplicity rocks in trucks.
Buy a truck to use it. If you don't intend to use it, don't waste it...Buy a car.
Make trucks more like a truck was intended to be.
Emissions choke the life out of everything fun.

*edit*- in most of you cats defense, I come from a far more "backwoods" background and use/depend on trucks for their original purpose.

If Pusha hadn't been assassinated by Columbian drug lords, he would be bragging about his old 300K+ mile Ford F250 or F350 and how repayable and baus it is. And he'd be correct.