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Old 08-22-2014, 09:49 AM   #41
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I hate light colored interiors, especially in cloth. It is very difficult to keep clean, and no matter how careful you are, you will get stains.
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Old 08-22-2014, 10:15 AM   #42
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Treated? Most likely no.
Can you buy stuff to "treat" em? sure

It entirely depends on how clean you and your wife are.
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Old 08-22-2014, 10:19 AM   #43
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Buy a couple of cans of Scotchguard, and soak the crap out of the seats, especially the bottoms. Let dry thoroughly, and then do it again. They will be damn near waterproof after that.
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Old 08-22-2014, 10:24 AM   #44
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What about two-tone? The Fiat has balck seat and steering wheel, but the dash and all of the trim is tan. It looks really good IMO, and you don't have to worry about the two most stain prone areas (seats/ steering wheel).
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Old 08-22-2014, 11:22 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rleete View Post
Buy a couple of cans of Scotchguard, and soak the crap out of the seats, especially the bottoms. Let dry thoroughly, and then do it again. They will be damn near waterproof after that.
This method works very well.

I find it interesting that everyone likes the prius. I drove one for a week for business and it made me want to kill myself. It couldn't get out of its own way and it was so bland. I preferred the RWD impala over the prius because even though it was also bland, floaty, and handled like a bloat it at least had some grunt to it. I think my favorite rental was the new altima that I drove. The seats were very comfortable, the engine had some grunt when I needed it, and it had a nice ride that still handled well.
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Old 08-22-2014, 11:27 AM   #46
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Because most people look for gas mileage and creature comforts/gizmos in their "other" cars rather than grunt.

If OP was looking for grunt this would be a completely different convo.

.....Though it does sound like OP wants something more "fun" than a prius so that convo is pretty much over anyway.

BTW: I know its way out of the price range, but I really like the new FXT
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Old 08-22-2014, 12:11 PM   #47
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Quote:
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Because most people look for gas mileage and creature comforts/gizmos in their "other" cars rather than grunt.

If OP was looking for grunt this would be a completely different convo.

.....Though it does sound like OP wants something more "fun" than a prius so that convo is pretty much over anyway.

BTW: I know its way out of the price range, but I really like the new FXT
I understand power not being a priority but when it is so wheezy that I feel uncomfortable pulling out into traffic when its anything but all clear that is an absolute no go for me. Nothing else about the car made up for it either. It wasn't particularly comfortable, the inside wasn't very nice, it looks like garbage, it drove like ****, and there was no technology I wouldn't have access to in a base kia. The only thing it has going for it is MPG and that is just not enough.
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Old 08-22-2014, 12:20 PM   #48
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I'm not going to derail the OP's thread attempting to refute that since he clearly isn't interested on one, so we'll just let it go.

BTW just a random comment:

my in laws have a 13 corolla and sister in law has a 14 camry, and I believe Jason already made a whole thread about this, but:

WHAT THE CRAP is up with the throttle mapping on these new cars?

I mean, its beyond retarded. The first 5% throttle makes the car LURCH forward like you're half throttling it, and then you are rewarded with a big fat NOTHING until the very last 5% of the throttle when the car actually goes WOT.

If test driving new cars, this would be something that'd be a deal breaker for me.
It could possibly be a torque converter lock-up engagement issue, I don't know. All I know is its nearly impossible to drive either of the above without looking like a complete retard.
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Old 08-22-2014, 12:30 PM   #49
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^all the new Subaru's are the same way and Toyota's have been that way for years, especially on lower-power models. I'm sure they do it to mask the fact that the car is gutless. Lurch = power, oh look how hard I come out of the hole by just breathing on the throttle so much power.

But then you hit the chasm and nobody is fooled.

It does annoy the crap out of many people though. I hear it all the time on test drives. "Why does it do that??"

The Mazda's don't do it, and neither do Fords or VWs
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Old 08-22-2014, 03:14 PM   #50
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My 2005 Expedition has something similar. The throttle is mapped to torque, not plate position. To start smoothly is almost impossible.

I let my wife do all the driving on these tests, so I just thought she was being indecisive on starts.

I did a bit of internet comparison between the Prius V and the Outback. They actually seem to be similar (other than the obvious HYBRID). Outback has 2 pluses: AWD and electric driver's seat. I will have to go to back to the Toyota dealer to look at the other aspects, visibility, ride, and to see if we care about the seat being manual. Some have reported that the Prius V has adequate power.

This has been an interesting quest for me. I've only bought 1 car new, but with the inflated prices of used cars these days, I am surprising my wife and myself and mostly looking for new.
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Old 08-22-2014, 03:16 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monk View Post
What about two-tone? The Fiat has balck seat and steering wheel, but the dash and all of the trim is tan. It looks really good IMO, and you don't have to worry about the two most stain prone areas (seats/ steering wheel).
On many of the cars we are looking at, at the trim levels of interest, it's Charcoal or Bone. (the words vary, the colors; not so much). That's it.
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Old 09-03-2014, 11:31 AM   #52
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Temporary Conclusion:
First, thanks for all the input.
Second, we have decided to put the $$ into the house and drive the Camry a few more years. Surprise surprise, the estimate on the work we wanted done was higher than the funds we had set aside.
Third, Outback is still in the lead.
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Old 09-23-2017, 01:19 PM   #53
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Monday, we will be picking up our 2018 Outback Premium with Eyesight, power lift gate, and dimming exterior mirrors. 2.5 flat 4. Silver with black cloth.
That ticked the boxes that were important to Heidi and me, and final price below $30K.

Second new car we ever purchased. Hope we like is as well as we think we will.

Will check for factory cloth treatment with water. Either immediately, or when otherwise needed, we plan to treat with 303 Fabric Guard.
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Old 09-23-2017, 02:40 PM   #54
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Have you already driven it?
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Old 09-23-2017, 04:02 PM   #55
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Yes I have. I'm not sure why you ask. We drove a 6 and a 4. I also calculated #/HP of that car, my Expedition, and my 4 cylinder Camry.. W/P ratio is same as the Camry that has served us well for 10 years.

They seem to have improved the control on the throttle and CVT from older versions. Take-off is smooth and well controlled, not jumpy.

Floor it and the CVT does what it should, but delivers torque from the offset, before the engine gets up to high RPM. Thus, not so much sling-shot or rubber-banding that I have heard about. Or maybe I just expect a CVT to act like a CVT?

The 6 was a bit smoother / quieter on the highway.

I went in thinking we'd get the Touring at just under $40K, with the 6. The extras were not worth 33% more $ to us. I still think the Limited is no man's land, but I may be just strange, because that is their big seller.

Anyway, what prompted your question?
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Old 09-23-2017, 04:56 PM   #56
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We own a 2016 Legacy. I absolutely hate throttle mapping, numb response, and basically everything about the engine/power output.

But all that pales in comparison to how much I hate the CVT mapping/programming.

I really really really hope they changed/improved it for 2018, because I cannot imagine having a more terribly programmed transmission.

It "shifts" like a normal auto, which really isn't a shift, but a stupid sudden drop in rpm that's spaced WAY far apart, and a power cut to make it seem like it "shifted". What results is a car that is jerky on shifts, for no reason whatsoever. A cvt is a cvt. It can try to be a "normal auto" but it's not, and that's not a bad thing. A cvt is supposed to be seamless, or at least smooth enough that it doesn't disrupt the way the car drives.

Then there's the huge delay in power delivery if you're in a really low throttle situation and suddenly floor it. You know, like in an emergency situation. It will do nothing for a long time, then finally "downshift" and throw the throttle body wide open resulting in a power surge. Except when you're not going WOT, but say go from 5% throttle to about 30% throttle, it does the same thing. There is absolutely zero correlation between your right foot and the power output. it does what it wants when it wants and only takes the drivers inputs as a suggestion that it seldom takes.

I could go on and on, but the bottom line is: their tuning/mapping is horrendous. I'm sure they'll fix it over the years, and it's highly likely that they already did for 2018, but I'll be selling our legacy because I can't stand driving it for this very reason alone.

Just my .02
(you might want to take it on a lonnnnnng test drive and make absolutely sure it won't bother you).

Our 2014 mazda 6 is a 500% better at all of the above.
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Old 09-23-2017, 08:43 PM   #57
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Im gonna say Toyota Avalon or the Lexus ES350 (which is the same thing only nicer and quieter)
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Old 09-24-2017, 11:38 PM   #58
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I have 2 daughters, ages 7 and 9... already wondering what their first cars will be. Our middle-class status means I'll probably be able to buy them something used but decent that really only has to last 8 years max (assuming we get them a car at 16 that needs to last through a Masters Degree).

I had always thought Volvo 240 wagon was the answer, but after owning a Celica and a 4Runner for 10 years, I've changed my mind. If I had to do this today for them, the requirements will be simple... boring, 25mpg, AWD, not small, not big, not a car, and DEAD NUTS RELIABLE for the next 100k.

No matter where my brain takes me, I always come back to RAV4. And as I read this thread, I realize that when I turn 60, I'll be in the market for the exact same thing in a DD.

Good luck with the new Subie... let us know which aftermarket exhaust you go with!
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Old 09-25-2017, 12:42 AM   #59
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The previous generation RAV4, fine. The new RAV, hard pass.

The previous model's V6 got better mileage in C/D testing than the new 4 cylinder. The new RAV is a disappointment IMO. Forester or CX5 FTW.
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Old 09-25-2017, 01:18 AM   #60
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Everytime I see the newer Mazda6 I like them more and more. They look awesome and I'm contemplating having a car payment for once when the new one comes out! Recently I had a long range shooting match at the top of the state and had a Altima as a rental car- it was definitely nice, good visibility, nice interior, power bla bla bla. I liked it much better then the rental Dart, Camry, Malibu and fusion I drove in the last year. Put about 500 miles on that thing and it drove fine, but long term? I don't know if it would make that cut though it did seem pretty solid. Me and the wife have been looking for a replacement for her 05 Honda pilot that we have had for 8 years now and I'm leaning towards the 6 or the cx-5... I drove a '14 cx-9 because she still thinks she might want that third row and it was nice but I couldn't see crap - blind spot city! The mirrors were only ok but man having all that peripheral vision blocked by stuff is really annoying. The Mazda3 was great too, but I have kids in car seats / boosters still so more room is needed... I'm still trying to justify one though. Subaru's are great but I only have experience with the 2.5 my girlfriend put in a snow bank/ tree ( oh my god what 25 in the snow can do!) And an 04 wrx wagon that you could watch the gas needle move as you drove. Good luck on the car search
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