Is it perception, or did lots of stock cars just get faster? - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 10-13-2010, 03:41 PM   #1
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Default Is it perception, or did lots of stock cars just get faster?

I think back to about 3-years ago when I started hitting the track and it seemed like a 250whp Miata killed at the track. Now cars like lightly modded Mustangs, STI's, Evo's, BMW's, NC's, Caddilacs, and especially Ferrari and Porsches have become amazingly fast out of the box? This **** is not fair.
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Old 10-13-2010, 03:48 PM   #2
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It is considering when your miata cost less to buy and build then all those cars you mentioned. More like stock cars are becoming even now with our Turbo'd gaysleds
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Old 10-13-2010, 03:53 PM   #3
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Its a horsepower battle all over again with the big car manufacturers. Car makers are now able to get decent (not great) gas milage with massive engines, so their going for it again. My 2 c
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Old 10-13-2010, 04:07 PM   #4
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moar boost
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Old 10-13-2010, 04:14 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Preluding View Post
Its a horsepower battle all over again with the big car manufacturers. Car makers are now able to get decent (not great) gas milage with massive engines, so their going for it again. My 2 c
Look at the brakes, suddenly 4-slugger Brembos are standard fare. Suddenly the Mustang is holding 1g sustained.
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Old 10-13-2010, 04:27 PM   #6
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Its called progress, look it up.
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Old 10-13-2010, 04:31 PM   #7
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It's become a game leap frog. My '89 LX 5.0 was the **** back in high school/college (and they weren't bad as SCCA street-prepared auto-xers either), then the mid/late 90s 4th gen Camaro blew that out of the water. All of a sudden, though, it seems like all the expensive toys like VVT, stupid-big brakes and decent legs have trickled down to the middle class. That new 5.0 Mustang makes my pants go nuts, BTW... a far, far cry from 1977...

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Old 10-13-2010, 04:40 PM   #8
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Wow, there are Mustang II fans? Who knew?
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Old 10-13-2010, 06:33 PM   #9
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It's cyclic. Car manufacturers build higher HP cars for the mass market, then govt decides to increase fuel mileage requirements, HP gets fuxored to meet fuel/emissions requirements, manufacturers figure out how to make power on the new standards, then standards get re-raised....

Case in point: C4 Corvette

If you want a new high HP car, better plan to get it in the next couple of years, before gov't raises that 30mpg fleet avg to 38mpg
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Old 10-13-2010, 09:43 PM   #10
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turn the boost up you ******* *****
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Old 10-13-2010, 09:56 PM   #11
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It sucks. I remember back in High Schoolish times if you could pull a 13 at the track you were awesome. Everyone thought my 9000 turbo saab was a beast. (14.6) Now i would laugh at my saab while pulling away from it in 5th gear not even bothering to downshift. It seemed like LS1 camaros were the ****. Well, I still love those cars....whatever. Times change, we just have to put bigger turbos and injectors on our *** rockets. After we get tired of getting beat by 12 second minivans and suv's we will man up and all just start rolling 3071's.
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Old 10-13-2010, 09:56 PM   #12
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Its not just the power. They are now engineering great suspensions/brakes into regular cars to make the enthusiast and regular joe both happy. I ran 2:11's all day long at TWS in a bone stock understeering 4cyl Hyundai in early 2009. If you had told that to someone in 2005 they would have laughed at you.

I get what Hustler is saying. If he counted what he has in his miata I bet its close to 15-20k. It has no warranty, is almost 20 years old, etc. He can now go buy a new Mustang throw pads and tires on it and run the same times. Then drive home without the fear that his torsen going out or brakes or or or. If he has a problem he just drops it off at the dealer with his painters tape removed.

I'm not hating on Hustlers car, anyone would be lucky to have it. When he started building it that was how you got a 15k supercar. Now they come off the lot that way. I just watched a 2011 Mustang on youtube run a 1:30 at Hallet in traffic, talking to a passenger, not attacking. With tires, pads, attack mode it would be in the low 20's...lol Makes you think a little.
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Old 10-13-2010, 11:07 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leatherface24 View Post
It is considering when your miata cost less to buy and build then all those cars you mentioned. More like stock cars are becoming even now with our Turbo'd gaysleds
Erm, how much less though? I know I've spent like over 15K on modifications for my car and I think hustler has probably spent about that too.

So the new game is that in order to beat common stock cars with a miata (in a straight line), you need a built engine AND a big turbo. Kinda sucks.
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Old 10-13-2010, 11:09 PM   #14
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Although they're definitely fast out of the box, I doubt the 2011 Mustang is the most confidence inspiring car on the track. When I first purchased my 2010 Mustang, I thought that it handled great compared to previous generations of Mustangs. However, after I started driving my Miata again a few weeks later I soon realized that the handling was nothing to write home about.

If you're having troubles on the track with a turbo Miata, throw your turbo drivetrain into a Locost type car or perform an LS* swap.
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Old 10-13-2010, 11:09 PM   #15
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Quote:
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turn the boost up you ******* *****
You too mr 18psi. ****. Your turbo is bigger than mine AND you have e85. What are you waiting for?
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Old 10-13-2010, 11:32 PM   #16
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Saw a similar bit at the Texas Mile. Guys had years invested in building/tuning/refining/retuning their cars to see 150+ mph standing miles. In comes a young 20-something who had purchased a Nissan GT-R the week prior turn a 167, w/ A/C on and his girlfriend in the car.

Of course a dozen years ago you needed to buy a Ferrari to have paddle shifters in your car; now you can get them with a slushbox Miata...
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Old 10-14-2010, 12:40 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jacob300zx View Post
I'm not hating on Hustlers car, anyone would be lucky to have it. When he started building it that was how you got a 15k supercar. Now they come off the lot that way. I just watched a 2011 Mustang on youtube run a 1:30 at Hallet in traffic, talking to a passenger, not attacking. With tires, pads, attack mode it would be in the low 20's...lol Makes you think a little.
Exactly, its not fair. Just 3-years ago a 1:28.5 at Hallett was fast, now its "run of the mill" for a street car in the $40k range. I suppose its more reason to push it harder and man up...John and I think it can do 1:25 with some work.

BTW, I'd love to get an S197 and a set of these.
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Old 10-14-2010, 01:14 AM   #18
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Factory cars are getting sick. Companies are finally staring to understand consumers want performance. Nut just "muscle" cars either. Look at Suzuki and the Kizashi, Hyundai and the genesis. Light years beyond what could of been picked up years ago in that price range.
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Old 10-14-2010, 01:25 AM   #19
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It's frustrating, but keep in mind that new cars say 15,000+ will still always be more expensive than a cheap 20yo miata with a decent setup. If you think about it the other way around, new car owners might think it's not fair that they just spent huge bucks, and a cheap 20 year old miata just ran them down.

Last I checked most current production cars weigh ~500lbs or more than miatas, so I think there is still an advantage.
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Old 10-14-2010, 01:51 AM   #20
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My car costs less to own and insure win win situation. I dont have any stupid smog bs screaming at me all the time to not kill trees and club baby seals and, I dont feel like i am destroying a major investment when i decide to make a change(more boost) or try and unorthodox part(WI and wet nitrous shot) etc.
The simplicity of the miata wins hands down for me. I dont want to have to get out the multi meter/scantool/osciliscope, to diagnose why my throttle by wire is having a hicup on down shifts and lagging the rpms. I just trace the cable and figure out wtf is going on. (Another huge bonus is that my car cant be onstarred to stop at a railraod track or just die while merging onto a highway ) Slim chance i know but it is there if not with malice than maybe from someone leaning on the wrong console or pushing the wrong button or some pc glitch. To much tech gets in the way of driving and ultimatly will make us worse drivers.
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