Notices
Insert BS here A place to discuss anything you want

The Science of Nutrition

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Feb 19, 2014 | 02:26 PM
  #301  
Leafy's Avatar
Elite Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 9,491
Total Cats: 105
From: NH
Default

Lol gluten free bread. I hate that term so ******* much. Gluten is what makes bread, thats like trying to make concrete without cement. You cant. You end up with something maybe resembling bread that was either made by scientists in a lab rather than a chief or doesnt have the correct texture to be bread.
Reply
Leave a poscat -1 Leave a negcat
Old Feb 19, 2014 | 02:39 PM
  #302  
Savington's Avatar
Former Vendor
iTrader: (31)
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 15,442
Total Cats: 2,106
From: Sunnyvale, CA
Default

I like the thread title change.
Old Feb 19, 2014 | 02:53 PM
  #303  
Joe Perez's Avatar
Boost Pope
iTrader: (8)
 
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 34,402
Total Cats: 7,523
From: Chicago. (The less-murder part.)
Default

Originally Posted by Savington
I like the thread title change.
Interestingly, when I saw it, it kind of spurred me to do a little research along those lines.

It turns out that Orthorexia Nervosa is actually a recognized eating disorder.

Those who have an “unhealthy obsession” with otherwise healthy eating may be suffering from “orthorexia nervosa,” a term which literally means “fixation on righteous eating.” Orthorexia starts out as an innocent attempt to eat more healthfully, but orthorexics become fixated on food quality and purity. They become consumed with what and how much to eat, and how to deal with “slip-ups.” An iron-clad will is needed to maintain this rigid eating style. Every day is a chance to eat right, be “good,” rise above others in dietary prowess, and self-punish if temptation wins (usually through stricter eating, fasts and exercise). Self-esteem becomes wrapped up in the purity of orthorexics’ diet and they sometimes feel superior to others, especially in regard to food intake.

Orthorexia Nervosa | National Eating Disorders Association




I think that's my cue to stop attempting to have rational debate in this thread.



The condition, orthorexia nervosa, affects equal numbers of men and women, but sufferers tend to be aged over 30, middle-class and well-educated.

The condition was named by a Californian doctor, Steven Bratman, in 1997, and is described as a "fixation on righteous eating". Until a few years ago, there were so few sufferers that doctors usually included them under the catch-all label of "Ednos" – eating disorders not otherwise recognised. Now, experts say, orthorexics take up such a significant proportion of the Ednos group that they should be treated separately.

"I am definitely seeing significantly more orthorexics than just a few years ago," said Ursula Philpot, chair of the British Dietetic Association's mental health group. "Other eating disorders focus on quantity of food but orthorexics can be overweight or look normal. They are solely concerned with the quality of the food they put in their bodies, refining and restricting their diets according to their personal understanding of which foods are truly 'pure'."

Orthorexics commonly have rigid rules around eating. Refusing to touch sugar, salt, caffeine, alcohol, wheat, gluten, yeast, soya, corn and dairy foods is just the start of their diet restrictions. Any foods that have come into contact with pesticides, herbicides or contain artificial additives are also out.

The obsession about which foods are "good" and which are "bad" means orthorexics can end up malnourished. Their dietary restrictions commonly cause sufferers to feel proud of their "virtuous" behaviour even if it means that eating becomes so stressful their personal relationships can come under pressure and they become socially isolated.

"The issues underlying orthorexia are often the same as anorexia and the two conditions can overlap but orthorexia is very definitely a distinct disorder," said Philpot. "Those most susceptible are middle-class, well-educated people who read about food scares in the papers, research them on the internet, and have the time and money to source what they believe to be purer alternatives."

Deanne Jade, founder of the National Centre for Eating Disorders, said: "There is a fine line between people who think they are taking care of themselves by manipulating their diet and those who have orthorexia. I see people around me who have no idea they have this disorder. I see it in my practice and I see it among my friends and colleagues."

Jade believes the condition is on the increase because "modern society has lost its way with food". She said: "It's everywhere, from the people who think it's normal if their friends stop eating entire food groups, to the trainers in the gym who [promote] certain foods to enhance performance, to the proliferation of nutritionists, dieticians and naturopaths [who believe in curing problems through entirely natural methods such as sunlight and massage].

"And just look in the bookshops – all the diets that advise eating according to your blood type or metabolic rate. This is all grist for the mill to those looking for proof to confirm or encourage their anxieties around food."

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2...ating-disorder




Further reading, some of it scholarly:

Orthorexia nervosa: a preliminary study with a proposal for diagnosis and an attempt to measure the dimension of the phenomenon. - PubMed - NCBI

Orthorexia nervosa: validation of a diagnosis questionnaire. - PubMed - NCBI

Orthorexia; When eating healthy goes awry - Mayo Clinic

Orthorexia nervosa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Old Feb 19, 2014 | 02:56 PM
  #304  
Leafy's Avatar
Elite Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 9,491
Total Cats: 105
From: NH
Default

Originally Posted by Joe Perez
Interestingly, when I saw it, it kind of spurred me to do a little research along those lines.

It turns out that Orthorexia Nervosa is actually a recognized eating disorder.

Those who have an “unhealthy obsession” with otherwise healthy eating may be suffering from “orthorexia nervosa,” a term which literally means “fixation on righteous eating.” Orthorexia starts out as an innocent attempt to eat more healthfully, but orthorexics become fixated on food quality and purity. They become consumed with what and how much to eat, and how to deal with “slip-ups.” An iron-clad will is needed to maintain this rigid eating style. Every day is a chance to eat right, be “good,” rise above others in dietary prowess, and self-punish if temptation wins (usually through stricter eating, fasts and exercise). Self-esteem becomes wrapped up in the purity of orthorexics’ diet and they sometimes feel superior to others, especially in regard to food intake.

Orthorexia Nervosa | National Eating Disorders Association




I think that's my cue to stop attempting to have rational debate in this thread.



The condition, orthorexia nervosa, affects equal numbers of men and women, but sufferers tend to be aged over 30, middle-class and well-educated.

The condition was named by a Californian doctor, Steven Bratman, in 1997, and is described as a "fixation on righteous eating". Until a few years ago, there were so few sufferers that doctors usually included them under the catch-all label of "Ednos" – eating disorders not otherwise recognised. Now, experts say, orthorexics take up such a significant proportion of the Ednos group that they should be treated separately.

"I am definitely seeing significantly more orthorexics than just a few years ago," said Ursula Philpot, chair of the British Dietetic Association's mental health group. "Other eating disorders focus on quantity of food but orthorexics can be overweight or look normal. They are solely concerned with the quality of the food they put in their bodies, refining and restricting their diets according to their personal understanding of which foods are truly 'pure'."

Orthorexics commonly have rigid rules around eating. Refusing to touch sugar, salt, caffeine, alcohol, wheat, gluten, yeast, soya, corn and dairy foods is just the start of their diet restrictions. Any foods that have come into contact with pesticides, herbicides or contain artificial additives are also out.

The obsession about which foods are "good" and which are "bad" means orthorexics can end up malnourished. Their dietary restrictions commonly cause sufferers to feel proud of their "virtuous" behaviour even if it means that eating becomes so stressful their personal relationships can come under pressure and they become socially isolated.

"The issues underlying orthorexia are often the same as anorexia and the two conditions can overlap but orthorexia is very definitely a distinct disorder," said Philpot. "Those most susceptible are middle-class, well-educated people who read about food scares in the papers, research them on the internet, and have the time and money to source what they believe to be purer alternatives."

Deanne Jade, founder of the National Centre for Eating Disorders, said: "There is a fine line between people who think they are taking care of themselves by manipulating their diet and those who have orthorexia. I see people around me who have no idea they have this disorder. I see it in my practice and I see it among my friends and colleagues."

Jade believes the condition is on the increase because "modern society has lost its way with food". She said: "It's everywhere, from the people who think it's normal if their friends stop eating entire food groups, to the trainers in the gym who [promote] certain foods to enhance performance, to the proliferation of nutritionists, dieticians and naturopaths [who believe in curing problems through entirely natural methods such as sunlight and massage].

"And just look in the bookshops – all the diets that advise eating according to your blood type or metabolic rate. This is all grist for the mill to those looking for proof to confirm or encourage their anxieties around food."

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2...ating-disorder




Further reading, some of it scholarly:

Orthorexia nervosa: a preliminary study with a proposal for diagnosis and an attempt to measure the dimension of the phenomenon. - PubMed - NCBI

Orthorexia nervosa: validation of a diagnosis questionnaire. - PubMed - NCBI

Orthorexia; When eating healthy goes awry - Mayo Clinic

Orthorexia nervosa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
So now dieting and will power is an eating disorder? And also being Jewish apparently.
Old Feb 19, 2014 | 03:00 PM
  #305  
Joe Perez's Avatar
Boost Pope
iTrader: (8)
 
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 34,402
Total Cats: 7,523
From: Chicago. (The less-murder part.)
Default

Originally Posted by Leafy
So now dieting is an eating disorder?
I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion.

EDIT: Saw your little ninja-edit there. I seriously have no idea what you mean by "being Jewish is an eating disorder" in this context. Mind filling me in?

Last edited by Joe Perez; Feb 19, 2014 at 03:15 PM.
Old Feb 19, 2014 | 03:21 PM
  #306  
JasonC SBB's Avatar
Thread Starter
Elite Member
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,420
Total Cats: 84
Default

Originally Posted by Joe Perez
It turns out that Orthorexia Nervosa is actually a recognized eating disorder.

[I][INDENT]Those who have an “unhealthy obsession” with otherwise healthy
Define "unhealthy obsession". I agree with Chris Kresser's 80/20 rule (eat well 80% of the time), unless you have a serious specific food sensitivity to some specific substance that requires 100% avoidance of that substance:
http://chriskresser.com/food-fascism-and-the-8020-rule

I think that's my cue to stop attempting to have rational debate in this thread.
Who's making irrational arguments?
Old Feb 19, 2014 | 03:24 PM
  #307  
mgeoffriau's Avatar
Elite Member
iTrader: (7)
 
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 7,388
Total Cats: 474
From: Jackson, MS
Default

Originally Posted by Joe Perez
I seriously have no idea what you mean by "being Jewish is an eating disorder" in this context. Mind filling me in?
"Fixation on righteous eating" is my guess.
Old Feb 19, 2014 | 03:28 PM
  #308  
Leafy's Avatar
Elite Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 9,491
Total Cats: 105
From: NH
Default

Originally Posted by Joe Perez
I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion.

EDIT: Saw your little ninja-edit there. I seriously have no idea what you mean by "being Jewish is an eating disorder" in this context. Mind filling me in?
Purity of food is mentioned there. Non-Kosher food = unpure. I guess it also goes for muslims and strict christians.
Old Feb 19, 2014 | 03:47 PM
  #309  
y8s's Avatar
y8s
DEI liberal femininity
iTrader: (8)
 
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 19,338
Total Cats: 574
From: Fake Virginia
Default

Originally Posted by mgeoffriau
"Fixation on righteous eating" is my guess.
imagine if you were gluten-sensitive AND jewish...
Old Feb 19, 2014 | 03:49 PM
  #310  
mgeoffriau's Avatar
Elite Member
iTrader: (7)
 
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 7,388
Total Cats: 474
From: Jackson, MS
Default

No matzah ***** for you!
Old Feb 20, 2014 | 12:17 PM
  #311  
JasonC SBB's Avatar
Thread Starter
Elite Member
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,420
Total Cats: 84
Default

Let me reiterate some facts which may have been missed.

- Gluten intake can trigger autoimmune disease which can have no symptoms for many years until irreversible damage has taken place. Destruction of the thyroid is one example.

- Autoimmune disease has risen in past decades, to be the #3 killer in the USA. (e.g. multiple sclerosis, rheumatoid arthritis, lupus, Addison's, Hashimoto's, Graves', Type 1 diabetes, Crohn's)

- Some researchers now think that all automimmune diseases are related to gut permeability issues.

- Gluten causes transient gut permeability in everyone

- Is is suspected that gluten is implicated in most autoimmune disease

- there is now evidence that it's not just the gluten in wheat that causes wheat intolerance


Until we know more, for example, a gene is identified that indicates susceptibility and say 23AndMe can test for it, or, a poo gene sequencing test can tell you that you have protective gut flora, I think it's prudent to cut back on wheat.
Old Feb 20, 2014 | 12:43 PM
  #312  
y8s's Avatar
y8s
DEI liberal femininity
iTrader: (8)
 
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 19,338
Total Cats: 574
From: Fake Virginia
Default

Originally Posted by JasonC SBB
Until we know more, for example, a gene is identified that indicates susceptibility and say 23AndMe can test for it, or, a poo gene sequencing test can tell you that you have protective gut flora, I think it's prudent to cut back on wheat.
Originally Posted by 23andme
< 0.1 out of 100
men of European ethnicity who share y8s's genotype will develop Celiac Disease between the ages of 0 and 79.
I have yet to view my poo, but we do buy (pretty much exclusively) probiotic yogurt.
Old Feb 20, 2014 | 12:52 PM
  #313  
mgeoffriau's Avatar
Elite Member
iTrader: (7)
 
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 7,388
Total Cats: 474
From: Jackson, MS
Default

Here's an interesting one I just stumbled upon.

Is gliadin really safe for non
Old Feb 20, 2014 | 12:57 PM
  #314  
mgeoffriau's Avatar
Elite Member
iTrader: (7)
 
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 7,388
Total Cats: 474
From: Jackson, MS
Default

Originally Posted by y8s
I have yet to view my poo, but we do buy (pretty much exclusively) probiotic yogurt.
It's important to note that while probiotic yogurt is helpful, it only temporarily supplies an influx of bacteria -- they don't actually repopulate the gut. In order to get some long-term changes you need to consume prebiotic foods which are mostly naturally fermented things like kimchi, pickles, sauerkraut, etc. Also, supplying your existing gut flora with resistant starch like the potato starch Jason has mentioned will grow and rebalance your gut biome.

We only buy Bubbies pickles and sauerkraut now as it's actually fermented and not just pickled (and it's easier than fermenting your own).
Old Feb 21, 2014 | 05:39 PM
  #315  
JasonC SBB's Avatar
Thread Starter
Elite Member
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,420
Total Cats: 84
Default

Originally Posted by mgeoffriau
It's important to note that while probiotic yogurt is helpful, it only temporarily supplies an influx of bacteria -- they don't actually repopulate the gut. In order to get some long-term changes you need to consume prebiotic foods which are mostly naturally fermented things like kimchi, pickles, sauerkraut, etc.
Hmm that stuff has pre-biotic in 'em?

Also, supplying your existing gut flora with resistant starch like the potato starch Jason has mentioned will grow and rebalance your gut biome.

We only buy Bubbies pickles and sauerkraut now as it's actually fermented and not just pickled (and it's easier than fermenting your own).
I read somewhere that most mass produced fermented food (e.g. kimchi, kefir), have a bacterial profile that has been optimized for mass production, and is different from and doesn't have as much variety as home-made stuff. Even if true, I'd expect there may be small-operation made stuff that's as good as home made stuff. e.g. a guy at work tells me there's a small family owned Korean grocery that make their own kimchi.
Old Feb 21, 2014 | 05:48 PM
  #316  
JasonC SBB's Avatar
Thread Starter
Elite Member
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,420
Total Cats: 84
Default

$99 poo gene sequencing!

American Gut
Old Feb 25, 2014 | 01:11 PM
  #317  
JasonC SBB's Avatar
Thread Starter
Elite Member
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,420
Total Cats: 84
Default

Phytate counterpoint by paleo guy:
Down the Rabbit Hole: When Phytate Becomes a Nutrient | Free The Animal
Old Feb 27, 2014 | 09:43 AM
  #318  
z31maniac's Avatar
Elite Member
 
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 3,693
Total Cats: 222
From: OKC, OK
Default

Going on the paleo diet, figured why not. Also have to get back into working out 4-5 times a week instead of the 2 or so I've been doing lately.

I've put back the 15lbs I had lost coming into the holiday season, but still needed to lose more than that. I'll step on the scale Monday after my body has had a chance to normalize after this past weekend's debauchery with all the stylists/spouses from my wife's salon.

If I'm where I think I am from how my clothes are fitting. I need to lose about 40.
Old Mar 16, 2014 | 02:34 PM
  #319  
mgeoffriau's Avatar
Elite Member
iTrader: (7)
 
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 7,388
Total Cats: 474
From: Jackson, MS
Default

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/09/op...drug.html?_r=0

Good look at some of the research* into the gut biome.






*Sorry, not research. I meant pseudoscience.
Old Mar 18, 2014 | 11:23 AM
  #320  
y8s's Avatar
y8s
DEI liberal femininity
iTrader: (8)
 
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 19,338
Total Cats: 574
From: Fake Virginia
Default

STUDIES!

cliffs: fats aren't as bad as you thought, but some are better than others. also watch those carbs.

http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/0...088400000&_r=0



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:52 PM.