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Old 07-25-2011, 07:25 PM   #81
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Yeah I'd have to agree with you on that. Before the car noticeably flattened out over 6.5 - 7k. Now It's hard to shift before hitting redline because once the car gets to 6K it hauls *** up to 8k. My tuner said the motor really felt like it wanted to keep revving and looking at the dyno the power wasn't falling with the cams/IM. I am considering pulling the bottom end back out over the winter and having it balanced/blueprinted and throwing an ATI on there. The head is fine for 9k, the bottom end would be risking it. It's all forged but I don't want to take the chance.

We'll see how she does at the track day on Wed.

Hustler, I also took your advice and had them do about 5 pulls through the gears to get the motor really hot all while listening through my polish det-cans. I brought them a long and my tuner really liked them. He said they are on par with some of the really expensive knock ears he's used.
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:27 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by falcon View Post
Hustler, I also took your advice and had them do about 5 pulls through the gears to get the motor really hot all while listening through my polish det-cans. I brought them a long and my tuner really liked them. He said they are on par with some of the really expensive knock ears he's used.
I just grew a big rubbery one.
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:30 PM   #83
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.. they work really good. He said if it could filter a bit more it would be perfect because my blower and with the BOV it was pretty loud. Any idea if the dets will work with a factory style knock sensor? Ocean's HKS knock unit plugs into all kinds of sensors... and I think I still have an old RB26 singe wire knock sensor.
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:37 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by falcon View Post
.. they work really good. He said if it could filter a bit more it would be perfect because my blower and with the BOV it was pretty loud. Any idea if the dets will work with a factory style knock sensor? Ocean's HKS knock unit plugs into all kinds of sensors... and I think I still have an old RB26 singe wire knock sensor.
They're set up to provide phantom power to an electret mic, but you could cut that resistor and run a 2 wire piezo sensor instead.

I think I need to play around with a few different bandpass filters and offer some custom options.....


Edit: Nice #s BTW. I need to check the car out sometime.
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:41 PM   #85
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Yeah I think with the filtering from a stock type sensor or something it would be quite the set up. The sensor I have is a single wire, would it work if I just hook it up?

The numbers are good but don't tell the whole story from my old tune. I'd like to get a chance to do a few pulls on the dynapack to compare. My guess is it will be in the upper 270's to low 280's based on other local guys' experiences with these dynos.
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:42 PM   #86
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Old 07-26-2011, 07:01 PM   #87
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Totally unrelated to my motor, but I got a present in the mail today from Rev9. My exhaust shop fuxxord my resonator install causing the tip of the exhaust to rest on the bumper and therefore melting it. They kindly agreed to replace the bumper, but since I was in a good mood (and partially since I though it was a good opporitunity to get an exhaust shield) they bought this for me instead.

Came with some sweet double sided adheisive and stick on rivet heads. I spent some time measuring and drilling it all out perfectly and used real rivets to attach it.

gaurd.jpg?t=1311717513

I am so cool now.
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Old 07-27-2011, 12:49 PM   #88
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Thats pretty cool...

Are they expensive?
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Old 07-28-2011, 01:56 AM   #89
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$100. Personally, if I didn't get it paid for by the exhaust shop I would have just made one out of alum. It's ncie, but $100 that could be spent elsewhere. I just like that my car dosen't look like a pile anymore with a melted bumper
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Old 07-28-2011, 02:20 AM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanMSM View Post
Polish Det Cans are excellent. I could correlate with my Hydra knock logs making it easy to decide where to pull timing.

Yeah, I guess it's likely that any temp compensation by the Hydra would have been different on the dyno vs the road.

This was a year ago so my memory fades but when I pulled timing I made sure to also do so in the surrounding cells. So the dyno might not have been hitting some of those cells.

Aaron, sorry for the thread hijack!
Hmm how much knock sensor voltage did you see in the hydra when you heard pinging/det?
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Old 07-28-2011, 04:15 AM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faeflora View Post
Hmm how much knock sensor voltage did you see in the hydra when you heard pinging/det?
Examples of audible knock (heard with det can and sometimes without) and the voltage measured by a Hydra on a 2004 MSM:
2400rpm - 0.92V (no knock = ~<0.25V)
3600rpm - 0.70V (no knock = ~<0.35V)
3700rpm - 0.94V (no knock = ~<0.35V)
3900rpm - 0.58V (no knock = ~<0.35V)***
3900rpm - 1.38V (no knock = ~<0.35V)
4150rpm - 0.58V (no knock = ~<0.48V)***
4150rpm - 0.80V (no knock = ~<0.48V)
4450rpm - 0.94V (no knock = ~<0.48V)
5000rpm - 0.96V (no knock = ~<0.5V)
6800rpm - never seen it? (no knock = ~<0.66V)

***These were actual knock events for which the Hydra didn't log the full voltage. I find the Hydra logs will sometimes miss an actual large knock voltage due to the sample rate. However, if you look at the knock ret.(deg) in the log you can see evidence that knock was detected.

To give some margin I have my Hydra knock threshold setup as:
0 rpm - 0.50V
800rpm - 0.52V
1600rpm - 0.58V
2400rpm - 0.60V
3200rpm - 0.62V
4000rpm - 0.64V
4800rpm - 0.66V
5600rpm - 0.68V
6400rpm - 0.70V
7200rpm - 0.70V
8000rpm - 0.70V
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Old 07-28-2011, 11:24 AM   #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanMSM View Post
Examples of audible knock (heard with det can and sometimes without) and the voltage measured by a Hydra on a 2004 MSM:
2400rpm - 0.92V (no knock = ~<0.25V)
3600rpm - 0.70V (no knock = ~<0.35V)
3700rpm - 0.94V (no knock = ~<0.35V)
3900rpm - 0.58V (no knock = ~<0.35V)***
3900rpm - 1.38V (no knock = ~<0.35V)
4150rpm - 0.58V (no knock = ~<0.48V)***
4150rpm - 0.80V (no knock = ~<0.48V)
4450rpm - 0.94V (no knock = ~<0.48V)
5000rpm - 0.96V (no knock = ~<0.5V)
6800rpm - never seen it? (no knock = ~<0.66V)

***These were actual knock events for which the Hydra didn't log the full voltage. I find the Hydra logs will sometimes miss an actual large knock voltage due to the sample rate. However, if you look at the knock ret.(deg) in the log you can see evidence that knock was detected.

To give some margin I have my Hydra knock threshold setup as:
0 rpm - 0.50V
800rpm - 0.52V
1600rpm - 0.58V
2400rpm - 0.60V
3200rpm - 0.62V
4000rpm - 0.64V
4800rpm - 0.66V
5600rpm - 0.68V
6400rpm - 0.70V
7200rpm - 0.70V
8000rpm - 0.70V
Thanks, good info. My knock threshold map is pretty much set up the same way. I too see that knock retard is the ultimate indicator of Hydra detecting knock.
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Old 07-28-2011, 04:13 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faeflora View Post
Thanks, good info. My knock threshold map is pretty much set up the same way. I too see that knock retard is the ultimate indicator of Hydra detecting knock.
Welcome to tuning 2g DSMs 5 years ago.

"Am I pulling timing?"

"No"

"Turn the ******* boost up!"
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Old 07-28-2011, 08:34 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by Jeff_Ciesielski View Post
Welcome to tuning 2g DSMs 5 years ago.

"Am I pulling timing?"

"No"

"Turn the ******* boost up!"
lol awesome. I'm going to hook up your det cans to my boss noise cancelling headphones and use em while I road tune
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Old 07-28-2011, 08:58 PM   #95
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Car looks VERY nice.

On the old intake manifold i noticed you blocked off the air valve on the intake manifold and bypassed the Idle Control Valve. Any tips or tricks?
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Old 07-28-2011, 11:50 PM   #96
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No not really... my idle fluctuated a lot with the old mani though. It never stalled even without a TPS. With this new one it's rock solid but that may have something to do with the injectors and the way the ignition map was tuned around idle to help keep it at about 1100RPM. I idled at 12.5:1 before now I'm 15:1. The current set up only has a TPS and a hole drilled in the throttle plate as an idle hole.
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Old 08-12-2011, 01:05 AM   #97
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i like everything but your torque band. needs more twin screw, less centrifugal.
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Old 08-12-2011, 01:35 AM   #98
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That's OK. You know why? Because I unofficially beat my class record by over 3 seconds yesterday (Street Prepared 3) and matched the overall Street Prepared record with a 1:15.4 currently held by a SP4 car (larger disp.). All on 13's with R888's and no aero. Specs run mid 19's and GT3 Cup Cars/GT1/SPO etc cars run 10/11's. Just for comparison.

I'm very happy with the way the car drives. It's so easy to control. I agree a few more torques could be nice. I may drop the RPM limit down even more to 7000-7200 and throw an even smaller pulley on to see if I can get the torque to peak at all and get some boosts earlier. But no twin screw for me.

But I'm also running a 5sp, and like the fact that I don't have to worry about it grenading.

Pic from yesterday. My friend being a moron... he holds the SP3 record with his old turbo Miata with a 1:18.6. First track day with my new brake kit courtesy of Chikara Motorsports. Custom bracket to fit 4 piston Dynapros on Sport front rotors. Biggest rotor I could fit under the 13's.

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Old 08-12-2011, 01:38 AM   #99
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I guess I haven't posted my most recent dyno results in this thread...

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Old 08-12-2011, 01:40 AM   #100
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I want your paint!!!!!!!!!
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