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New guy tryin' to make a decsion

 
Old 07-06-2019, 11:18 PM
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Default New guy tryin' to make a decsion

Hey guys, fell in love with Miatas after wanting to get in to drifting and wanted to buy any car but a Miata lol. Once I broke down and bought one because of how cheap the aftermarket/parts were, I was instantly hooked. I bought a '95 1.8 and kept it for a while and had to sell it because we were having our 2nd baby and the wife didn't know why I was out trying to kill myself in a "tin can". Well, damn did I miss that thing. Like up at night type ****. My friend came across an '03 LS Blue Mica (always wanted blue) in my home town, garage kept, with only 63k original miles, no accidents, and was bought originally in my home town. That just never happens. He had the receipt for a new clutch, battery, and only wanted 5k. Old dude didn't know how to use the internet and had it posted up with a sign. I about ****. This was one of those "ask for forgiveness, than for permission" moments. Keep in mind this was only about a month after I sold the first one. I knew this type of deal/car just wouldn't happen again. So I snagged it. All I've done is BC coilovers and replaced the muffler with one from an old friends turbo setup. Also added the tupperware and the front lip. It's perfect. Not raspy, just tone throughout the whole RPM band.

Meet Meegan the Miata.









Just finished paint correction and ceramic coat

Just finished paint correction and ceramic coat

The reason I am here is that I wanted to turbo the Miata and give it some more power. I eventually wanted a track car for autox and actual road courses (live in Sebring, FL where we have a big lemans style track) this car is so clean I'd hate to track it. I'm also a hp junkie having 3 Chargers and the last one being a Hellcat. I've heard that even by the time you turbo it, I might be in the 13's. I'd still be spending a minimum of 5-7k. An LS swap looks insane as far as work and parts, and the cost is well over 10k. So brings me to my predicament.

Do I just buy a C5 Vette? I'm probably dreaming about actually getting my car out on the track that much, so it would be a weekend cruiser and I like raw power. I also wanted a sleeper to "beat V8's" with a Miata blah blah cause it's more fun. So I'm stuck between keeping this car and turbocharging it, or buying a C5 Vette and building that car because it can also handle "well enough" if I want to take it out on the track.

I'd hate to have to sell this specimen, and regret buying the Vette. Also, I'd always have the "what if" factor if I kept the Miata. I don't really know what I want yet, and I read a thread on this forum where a guy was going through the exact same situation. I know they are 2 totally different animals, so I have some thinking to do. I almost think I could build a C5 for ***** out stuff, and then get a "track grade miata" later on down the road.
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Old 07-07-2019, 12:29 AM
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A turbo miata will do a lot better than a 13. Lots of street cars on here probably capable of 11s and 12s

More in the 7-10 k range though, if you want it to be reliable.
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Old 07-07-2019, 07:38 AM
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Welcome to the forum. There are several of us in Tampa who frequent the track at Sebring (in cooler weather).

The Miata is a good track platform and has inexpensive consumables but needs things to be great. The stance shocks you purchased are slightly better than stock and will be a liability to you on the track. The best choice around is the Xidas from Supermiata (FKA 949Racing). They will allow the ride height you have but will have optimal spring rates and damping for track work and better performance street driving. The damping is the secret sauce.

You will need a real rollbar from Hard Dog or Boss Frog or Blackbird to be permitted on the track.

The car will require track pads to upgrade the brakes for now, and maybe a 11.75 brake kit from V8Roadsters (local to us) after you add boost. My favorite brake pad is Performance Friction's 01 or 11 compound. It works correctly on the street and is the best I've run on the track. Stock calipers and rotors are fine at stock power levels with just the better pads and fresh fluid.

The easy button for boost is MK Turbo (goes by screen name Shuiend), FlowForce (Nigel) injectors, and a MS3 Basic ECU from MS Labs (he goes by Reverent on this forum). Check the vendors section of the forum for these guys. With these and a few more supporting mods you can double the stock horsepower.

Start with suspension and brake mods for the best times at the track. You can easily flip the Megans to a stance kid who only cares about hardparking and recoup a lot of the money. Xidas don't lose their value much on the used market so you may as well get them new.

Good luck.
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Old 07-07-2019, 08:18 AM
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Originally Posted by sixshooter View Post
Start with suspension and brake mods for the best times at the track. You can easily flip the Megans to a stance kid who only cares about hardparking and recoup a lot of the money.

Good luck.
I have BC coilovers. I thought those were really good. This was the height I bought them at. I know they can be adjusted and also have fully adjustable dampening.

Thanks for all the advice, I'll check that info out. My main concern is here that I'm wondering which way I should go.
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Old 07-07-2019, 08:20 AM
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Originally Posted by ryansmoneypit View Post
A turbo miata will do a lot better than a 13. Lots of street cars on here probably capable of 11s and 12s

More in the 7-10 k range though, if you want it to be reliable.
Yea I'll have to scope some people's builds, thanks!
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Old 07-07-2019, 08:54 AM
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I thought you had Megan coilovers for some reason. BC are ok. Coffee wasn't working fully yet this morning.
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Old 07-07-2019, 09:00 AM
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Sonofthehill has run a 12.02 quarter mile on a MK Turbo budget kit. There are more expensive options as well.
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Old 07-07-2019, 11:30 AM
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I got to get to a track. All my passengers turn green just going in straight lines.
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Old 07-07-2019, 04:23 PM
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Originally Posted by sixshooter View Post
I thought you had Megan coilovers for some reason. BC are ok. Coffee wasn't working fully yet this morning.
The name of my Miata is Meegan lol. I said that at the end of the paragraph.

Originally Posted by sixshooter View Post
Sonofthehill has run a 12.02 quarter mile on a MK Turbo budget kit. There are more expensive options as well.
Do you know if that's with a built engine?

Originally Posted by ryansmoneypit View Post
I got to get to a track. All my passengers turn green just going in straight lines.
How much did it take you to get there?
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Old 07-07-2019, 04:57 PM
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I'm sure he has to have a built engine and around 300whp. Stock rods stretch if you over rev if you miss a shift and also bend from cylinder pressure at above roughly 250whp. Rods are the real weakness after clutch and cooling system.

5 speed transmission can die above 250 sometimes and the 6 speed can handle above 300 mostly but there are exceptions that go higher for extended periods. The baller swap is the KMiata BMW transmission kit. I'm not a baller but that's what I'm using now.

Rear diffs are reliable for more power than most of our engines can make, unless drift or drag. Track days don't kill them.

Billet oil pumps are good for high revving and higher power. Boundary Engineering
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Old 07-08-2019, 01:10 AM
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Yes I have forged rods and pistons. I have both the manual hellcats I have raced under my belt. They seem to only be able to run mid 12's at my track without front skinnies, non DOT slicks, and seats removed. Finally chatted with the one from last year, he is in "Comp-Rod" now. Non DOT tires are not allowed in my manual transmission class.
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Old 07-08-2019, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by quiXilver View Post



How much did it take you to get there?
no real idea on power. built motor, 6258 EFR around 20-25 psi. But even 15 psi makes them sick.
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Old 07-11-2019, 01:34 AM
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Originally Posted by quiXilver View Post
...
Do I just buy a C5 Vette? I'm probably dreaming about actually getting my car out on the track that much, so it would be a weekend cruiser and I like raw power. I also wanted a sleeper to "beat V8's" with a Miata blah blah cause it's more fun. So I'm stuck between keeping this car and turbocharging it, or buying a C5 Vette and building that car because it can also handle "well enough" if I want to take it out on the track...
The Miata vs. Vette dilemma arises frequently, whether we are seasoned craftsmen or so-called "Newbs". While there's no comprehensive resolution of the dilemma, one consideration is power to weight ratio. The C5 weighs around 3200 pounds, and depending on year or whether it's a Z06, would make something like 350 hp. Let's assume 200 pounds for driver etc. That works out to power-to-weight ratio of around 1:10, in hp to pounds. To get 1:10 in a NA or NB Miata, again assuming a 200 pound driver, we need something like 240 hp. This BTW is crank-hp, not rear-wheel hp. Though I have no standing to personally claim expertise, perusing recommendations on this forum leads one to conclude that 240 hp at the crank, which si to say maybe 220 hp or thereabouts at the rear wheels, is eminently doable, with a 1.8 and well-proven forced-induction system.

Where I personally find the Corvette to be lacking, is its low-speed manners, its capacity to be thrown-around a parking lot. There is little doubt that at the higher-speed tracks it offers an advantage, assuming of course adequate driver skill etc. But in the sort of low-speed situations that we predominantly encounter in our regular lives, if we're going to be honest with ourselves - well, in such situations, a car that weighs 900-1000 pounds more, with a wheelbase that's foot (or more) longer, will be the one at a disadvantage.
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Old 07-11-2019, 01:44 AM
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If you're a "track nut", surely it comes down to the cost of consumables: tyres, pads, rotors, etc since they're an ongoing cost.

This is where a light+built Miata has a clear advantage over the heavier Corvette (I think lightyear in Australia came to this realisation after switching briefly to a Subaru).

Bang-for-buck, the built Miata wins easily (if you build it properly in the first place).
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Old 07-11-2019, 03:13 AM
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Originally Posted by quiXilver View Post
I have BC coilovers. I thought those were really good. This was the height I bought them at. I know they can be adjusted and also have fully adjustable dampening..
My understanding is that BCs are among the best of the budget end.

Great value, but not necessarily great.

Probably equivalent to my Tein Flex-Z, good for the price point, and not bad in general, but there are certainly better options out there (and obviously for your intended use)
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Old Yesterday, 10:37 AM
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Another consideration of C5 vs Miata is simply whether you'll be happy spending time inside a 15-20 year old GM product. It's guaranteed to have aged much more poorly than the Miata. FWIW.
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Old Yesterday, 11:21 AM
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Having driven a C5 Z06 with upgraded suspension and tires in anger on the track, I would quickly choose the Miata. Unless you like dead steering and a really heavy feeling car that seems about 12 inches too wide, Miata is the answer.
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Old Yesterday, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by sixshooter View Post
Having driven a C5 Z06 with upgraded suspension and tires in anger on the track, I would quickly choose the Miata. Unless you like dead steering and a really heavy feeling car that seems about 12 inches too wide, Miata is the answer.
We are in this community presumably not untouched with a smattering of bias. That is inevitable. Somewhere out there, there may be a Corvette forum, with the reverse sentiment, but of similar magnitude, Nevertheless, there is something overwhelming pleasurable in lightness itself. A small, light car, with the dangerously proverbial "all else being equal", has an enormous advantage. This advantage may not always be realized in organized competition. But it's a strong consideration in these soul-searching "what if" games.

My own experience with a C5 is limited, and it was only with a base model (but fortunately with manual transmission). I found the car to feel competent as a highway cruiser, but unwieldy in tight, low-speed situations. Consider for example plain-Jane maneuverability in a parking-lot. A low car that's also short and narrow, is easier to maneuver, both in terms of actually moving it, and in seeing where one is going. A low car that's wide and long, is not so easy.

The big advantage of the Corvette is that it's already all-there, so to speak. A Miata, to be brought up to comparable theoretical standards, such as power-to-weight ratio, becomes a bit of an engineering project. This entails risk, and potential frustration. For the experienced, this is probably irrelevant. For the inexperienced, it's easy to let ambition get the better of ourselves. This is a balance that one has to forecast when making the initial purchase decision.
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