help with mspnp9093 fan control - Page 2 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


MEGAsquirt A place to collectively sort out this megasquirt gizmo

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 12-05-2008, 11:21 AM   #21
Supporting Vendor
 
Matt Cramer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,266
Total Cats: 51
Default

Pin 1R. It's grounded to turn the fan on.
Matt Cramer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 08:03 PM   #22
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben View Post
Use a DMM or testlight to see if the fan is getting power, then start tracing back. There's a relay in the underhood fuse area, probably a fuse in there too. If you've done any 'experimenting' with a dual fan set up and a/c, it's likely you've blown the relay.

I hijacked the fan switch and re-wired it to the a/c fan through a DPST relay. So the main fan comes on at the temp set by MS and the secondary fan comes on with a/c or at where the fan switch is set-207 I think.
should I be able to jump the gnd and tfa terminals on the black box thingy, or did that little guy die with the MS computer?

I did this but was almost certain that I switched it back to stock (quick change for the track) due to the addition of the slim fans and uncertainty with MSpnp.

If I forgot to switch everything back, did I just lose $700 by burning up my computer?



Any links or preferably pics how to wire up the relay? I'm electrically stupid. I need to set this up so MS turns on both fans because the AC is gone.

Man, I'm super ******* nervous right now. $700 down the *******. Looks like going the turbo route was a mistake because I'm dumb.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 08:27 PM   #23
Elite Member
iTrader: (5)
 
Atlanta93LE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Marietta, GA
Posts: 2,198
Total Cats: 1
Default

^ Calm down. It sometimes scares me that you have any influence in any decision-making related to the spending of my tax dollars.

Look at Ben's post here for a slick dual stage fan setup. It's currently successfully implemented on my car, as well as his old '91.

It's nearly impossible to have fried your MSPNP just by screwing with the fans. Have you even tried jumping the fans at the connector? Tracked wiring at all?
Atlanta93LE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 08:36 PM   #24
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlanta93LE View Post
^ Calm down. It sometimes scares me that you have any influence in any decision-making related to the spending of my tax dollars.

Look at Ben's post here for a slick dual stage fan setup. It's currently successfully implemented on my car, as well as his old '91.

It's nearly impossible to have fried your MSPNP just by screwing with the fans. Have you even tried jumping the fans at the connector? Tracked wiring at all?
Well, I'm confident in my work with my programs because I'm educated and understand the process.

I've never been good at electrical **** because I don't know much about it and I've never learned enough to be confident enough to make major decisions...and i smoked every ground wire in my jetta once because I forgot to connect a gnd on the transmission. I'm speaking from another bad experience.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 08:43 PM   #25
Elite Member
iTrader: (5)
 
Atlanta93LE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Marietta, GA
Posts: 2,198
Total Cats: 1
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hustler View Post
Well, I'm confident in my work with my programs because I'm educated and understand the process.

I've never been good at electrical **** because I don't know much about it and I've never learned enough to be confident enough to make major decisions...and i smoked every ground wire in my jetta once because I forgot to connect a gnd on the transmission. I'm speaking from another bad experience.
As somebody who has a hand in developing some of the FEMA documents that I hope you use, it still scares me

Anyway, try jumping the fan at the connectors. If it works, work your way back to the ECU. You'll figure it out.
Atlanta93LE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 09:14 PM   #26
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlanta93LE View Post
As somebody who has a hand in developing some of the FEMA documents that I hope you use, it still scares me

Anyway, try jumping the fan at the connectors. If it works, work your way back to the ECU. You'll figure it out.
The fan does not come on when hooked up like stock via the black box. With the jumper, it comes on. Does that mean the relay is dead? I am trying to pick the car up on sunday to drop it off at BEGi on monday.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 09:24 PM   #27
Ben
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (33)
 
Ben's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: atlanta-ish
Posts: 12,689
Total Cats: 99
Default

Yes, I am that good...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben
2 stage fan mod
Goal: Have first fan stage circuit excite at 175 F. Have second stage fan circuit excite at 206 F. Do not interfere with A/C control over pass side fan.

Result:
engine temp < 175 F = No fan
engine temp > 175 F & < 206 F = Single stage fan
engine temp > 206 = 2 stage fan (both fans running)
A/C on = A/C fan on, regardless of engine temp

Required items: SPDT relay, primary wire, crimp connectors, electrical tape, 30A fusible link

Instructions: The relay has 5 positions, wire as follows
Pin 30 to A/C side fan black/blue stripe wire FAN SIDE OF WIRE
Pin 85 to thermosensor
Pin 86 to +12V
Pin 87 NO to +12V (high power)
Pin 87a NC to A/C side fan black/blue wire on the CAR SIDE OF WIRE

You need a real automotive SPDT relay with a true NO contact and a true NC contact. The el cheapo $1.49 relays probably won't cut it. It should run $7-10.

You can grab +12V at the underhood fuse box. There are a variety of places. I had an unused position, so I crimped a spade connector onto a 14ga wire, and inserted it into the bottom side of the unused positon. Then reinstall the fuse block and insert a 30A fusible link. *(I ran this wire to both pin 87 (high power input) and pin 86 (switched 12V) so that my relay had power full time. If you wanted the relay to only work key on, you would need to run a switched on +12V source to pin 86.)

The A/C side fan has 2 wires. Leave the black wire alone. Cut the black/blue stripe wire. The side of the wire that goes to the fan connects to pin 30 on the relay. The side of the black/blue wire that comes from the car goes to pin 87a on the relay.

The thermosensor on top of the thermostat housing has only one wire. Cut it and bring it to pin 85 on the relay.

Tape everything up and make sure all your wiring is secured.

Enjoy
Ben is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 09:30 PM   #28
Junior Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicago
Posts: 219
Total Cats: 0
Default

Hustler, I ran into a similar issue and at the end of it all it ended up being just bad connections at the fuse box where the realy pins are. They were not lining up correcty and getting a good connection. You might have also caused the realy to go bad as I did mess up 2 of my self just testing stuff. Take a look at my post here it might help.

https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/t25604/
zarish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 11:03 PM   #29
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by zarish View Post
Hustler, I ran into a similar issue and at the end of it all it ended up being just bad connections at the fuse box where the realy pins are. They were not lining up correcty and getting a good connection. You might have also caused the realy to go bad as I did mess up 2 of my self just testing stuff. Take a look at my post here it might help.

https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/t25604/
when I take the old sensor plug to GND the fans come on...but if I pull the relay out of the box, they turn off.


Brain, is there a more simple solution to getting both fans to come on. I don't need that multi-temp ****, I just want them to turn on when **** gets hot. I'm going for "easy" here because I don't have very much time to do all this...in a hotel parkinglot.

Last edited by hustler; 12-05-2008 at 11:17 PM.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2008, 11:47 PM   #30
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/t10109/#post117025
edit:
maybe I screwed this all up a long time ago, and the 2nd clt sensor kept turning on the fans. Man, I'm dumb.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2008, 06:58 AM   #31
Ben
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (33)
 
Ben's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: atlanta-ish
Posts: 12,689
Total Cats: 99
Default

My name ain't brain.
I told you like 10 years ago to not do the stupid "hakuna mod". then I told you a few days ago to un-do any modifications you did to your fan system and bring it to stock. you don't listen, then you bitch when **** don't work. hmm.

bring your junk to stock. then do the mod I outlined for you. it's 10 minutes worth of work, being ---- and careful. there are at least 3 cars running fans the way I've outlined.
Ben is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2008, 07:50 AM   #32
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

lol, you're my dad. I listened, and spent a few hours working on it, and i think it was back in stock form.

thanks for the write up. I'm going to get this figured out on sunday I hope.

Last edited by hustler; 12-06-2008 at 08:00 AM.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-10-2008, 08:38 PM   #33
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

so is there an absolute minimum for the fan trigger temp? Its 46* outside and what I believe to be pin 1R is not going to gnd when set at 50* (10*f in reality)

for future searching:
pin assignments

Last edited by hustler; 12-10-2008 at 10:57 PM.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2008, 04:57 PM   #34
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

so, is there a how-to on assigning additional outputs to switch to gnd, so I can still have a fan?
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2008, 02:13 PM   #35
Supporting Vendor
 
Matt Cramer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,266
Total Cats: 51
Default

The absolute minimum is -40 degrees.

You can use the boost control as output 1 for a second on/off control.
Matt Cramer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2009, 05:28 PM   #36
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

which pin or wire can I just to MS for "dual fans"? I was told I could do this with the AC wire, since I pulled the compressor. I still can't get the fans to work.

things I know:
both fans come on with the AC switch
driver side fan comes on with the TFA and GND pins jumped
i have continuity at the black/green wire from the MS computer connector to the fuse panel plug
I have continuity at the black/green wire on the fuse box side with the computer
I have continuity with the black/green wire (pin 1r) at gnd with the value set at 70* (actually triggered at 50*)


I am confused.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2009, 05:49 PM   #37
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

if the front fan lead activates the fans when i gnd the plug...does that mean the wiring is in working order and the fans will come on when triggered by the front sensor?
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2009, 05:57 PM   #38
Elite Member
iTrader: (15)
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Incline Village, NV
Posts: 2,073
Total Cats: 5
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hustler View Post
if the front fan lead activates the fans when i gnd the plug...does that mean the wiring is in working order and the fans will come on when triggered by the front sensor?
hustler im thinking yes, you can test it by splicing your oem sensor back into place and dipping it into some hot water. Or install it inline with your coolant and wait for the temps to rise and turn the fans on.
thesnowboarder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2009, 06:14 PM   #39
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thesnowboarder View Post
hustler im thinking yes, you can test it by splicing your oem sensor back into place and dipping it into some hot water. Or install it inline with your coolant and wait for the temps to rise and turn the fans on.
my sensor is like 3-hours away, if I can find it. I'm litterally giving parts away right now because all this **** is taking over. Can I just heat that bitch up with a torch and see if it triggers? I don't see why that wouldn't work. I ask because I have to machine a port or whatever for it, which is totally gay.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2009, 08:14 PM   #40
Elite Member
iTrader: (15)
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Incline Village, NV
Posts: 2,073
Total Cats: 5
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hustler View Post
Can I just heat that bitch up with a torch and see if it triggers?
The wire? No, the sensor? I dont see why not. Its just triggered by tempature.

What are you giving away? Im looking for a thermostat housing to do that remote thermostat i PMed you about.
thesnowboarder is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Another Cast Manifold Corky Bell Prefabbed Turbo Kits 18 11-22-2016 10:01 PM
My solution for Oiltemp and Oilpressure input into Megasuirt (MS3) Zaphod MEGAsquirt 41 01-24-2016 01:25 PM
1991 special edition with hard top full part out JC, NJ russian Miata parts for sale/trade 6 10-08-2015 04:01 PM
Back to Stock Part Out!! Turbo Parts, MS2 Enhanced 01-05, Suspension, and MOAR! StratoBlue1109 Miata parts for sale/trade 16 10-02-2015 10:39 AM


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:07 PM.