Techsalvager

datalogs of idle?
PW at idle?
seq or batch fuel?
stock motor mounts?

superdve

Ugh, OK, now that you've sent me here I see the frustration. I don't think a plug change to a different brand/type will help much until you straighten out the rough running. The IR's can fire a leaner mixture so this might be why it's running better at WOT. If your fueling has been off since the issue came back you could have carbon fouled any and all plugs in there so run cheapies for a few. Plugs look black or new when you pull them?

I hate to throw tools at this issue but I would have a scope on the injectors, coils and crank sensors to rule out any electronic faults. I'm also going to assume stable/correct cam timing and good valve train with good vacuum gage readings and not a wildly moving signal at idle. I'd also check fuel pressure for delivery and be sure it's not bleeding down fast with engine off indicating a leaking injector.

Faeflora

iTrader: (2)

What???

Blarn u try to hard. Tichen i up till it stumbles.

blaen99

iTrader: (6)

Well, superdve, unfortunately I swapped back to the old set of BKR6E's. Then I swapped to a new set of BKR7E's...Ran damn near perfectly on both. They don't have nearly the...smoothness, the much better feel of the new plugs on acceleration, but they run damn near perfectly anywhere else. The new plugs you recommended have all sorts of hesitation or misfires if not under acceleration, but I'll be damned if they don't feel amazing under acceleration.

Following is the datalog of the new set of BRK7E's. They are running rich as hell because the tune is for the new plugs Superdve recommended, however.

Working on a log of the plugs Superdve recommended, and also to make entirely certain I didn't change something in all the switching of plugs/etc. I did.

Faeflora

iTrader: (2)

Your a ---- valen. You make too many fukkn changes to determine wtf is goig on. Make one change. Datalog like a motherfullr.

U work in texh. Uou shoul know this. Jay reminded me of this after he sexed my ride.

blaen99

iTrader: (6)

Okay, new datalog is here.

Faefae, just for you, the only thing that has changed is the plugs. That's it. It fixes the idle headache, but the NGK's suck *** under acceleration compared to the Autolite's. Seriously, you can tell the difference between them under accel big time.

P.S. This new log is the Autolites, old log is the NGK BRK7E's.

(Edit) Added a new log just for you Faefae of it at absolutely maximum richness - idling at ~10AFR, and the absolute limit before it won't run. Nothing has changed from the previous Autolite log except it being rich as fuuuuuuuuuck

superdve

It's weird for sure. I think the XS's are pretty cold in the XS3922 as well as a 7 in NGK, (our 3923's cross to an NGK BKR6EIX but our 2 might be a fuzz colder than NGK's 7's explaining why it runs better upstairs and worse down low.

The car SHOULD have little issue idling at lambda 1.0, (14.12 ish on E10), and I'd think that you need to square up the VE table after verifying any of the basics you might have overlooked. Like fae says 1 change, 1 test, anything else will skew you over!

blaen99

iTrader: (6)

I can't get them to idle at a steady 14.12 Dave. Right now, the closest I can get goes from between 12.8 to 14.2

I don't have the problems with the NGK's, could it be due to a particular design of the plugs as I noted they were meant for ATVs or something similar?

Faeflora

iTrader: (2)

I hate yog go kill yourself. One change a t a tien

blaen99

iTrader: (6)

The only goddamn change I'm making is spark plugs Faefae, except for the one time where I kept richening it like you wanted, and when Dave mentioned 14.12 - and I'm still using the same goddamn Autolite plugs in all tests from the first Autolite plug log with no changes other than the fuel table FFS.

(Edit just for drunk Faefae)

I'm making one change at a time.

EITHER I change spark plugs and test
OR I change the fuel VE and test

AND that is ALL I am doing. One change at a time broski.

superdve

Put the NGKs back in as they idle better and work the ve table. The AFX is good but make sure it has been calibrated in free air recently. If you can't get good idle check compression and I'd do a leak down. Those 3922s are too cold right right now!

Reason why I suggest lambda 1.0 is you should calibrate ve ttables to hit a desired 1.0 with no correction then adjust afr tables for required ratios after.

blaen99

iTrader: (6)

Thanks man, will do.

Techsalvager

is it seq or batched fuel?
Where is your wideband in the exhaust stream.
Upload your tune
Do you have a pyrometer?

blaen99

iTrader: (6)

Batched, 24" from the turbo, tune is in the OP, no pyro.

Techsalvager

why so far from the turbo?
I have mine like 8 inches right off the turbine exit.
with a sensor that far away readings will be delayed even more from exit of engine to sensor reading.
hmm NGK AFX, bosch sensor? the exact bosch sensor for it or did you get one people mention from the parts store?
I've used those units with the bosch sensor and seen it at idle not read correctly.
AFX was at 13.x while the narrowband was at stoich and the SLC DIY one was hovering around 14.5 to 15.1 area

blaen99

iTrader: (6)

You have a wideband sensor, 6" off the turbo exit Tech?

Most widebands recommend 18" minimum to prevent sensor damage and/or correct sensor readings FYI. I run 24" simply because it's the easiest spot to put it.

Techsalvager

yeah around 6 to 8 inches from where the downpipe and turbine exit meet.
read above last post about my dealings with the ngk afx and bosch sensor. I have no experience with the ngk afx and ntk sensor, though I've heard its way more accurate.

Your tune on the first page is it with the 550cc injectors or 650cc injectors?

blaen99

iTrader: (6)

550cc. I just adjusted req_fuel for the 650's.

The NTK sensor is very explicit about a minimum of 18" in the docs, so I just followed what they said.

Techsalvager

checked the dead time and what I found is off from what you have in your tune.
A proper dead time will make tuning idle nicer and will keep the injector output at various voltages much more stable in terms of output.

8volt 2.55ms = 2550us
10volt 1.70ms = 1700us
12volt 1.20ms = 1200us
14volt 0.92ms = 920us
16volt 0.75ms = 750us

FIC 650cc ev14 dead times that I found
since ms2 only has 13.2v gonna have to wing it unless there is some softare or aloghtrim to use to figure it out.
I'd start at 1ms instead of 1.2ms
Yes you will have to retune idle area atleast.

Faeflora

iTrader: (2)

If techsalvage n faefaef r correcting you u r fuked son