Look at my timing map tell me its safe ? - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 01-27-2009, 12:05 AM   #1
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Default Look at my timing map tell me its safe ?

Ive been looking at the maps everyone else has posted and it has me alittle nervous about my map.

I Cant hear any Ping, nor can my buddy who has tuned his 12second mustang.

But it just seems like im running a crazy amount of timing compared to everyone else.

Car pulls Great all the way to redline.

specs, 92 1.6L, Stock header, 2inch side exit exhaust no cat cherry bomb muffler, Webcams.

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Old 01-27-2009, 12:11 AM   #2
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Very safe on 93 octane, but not so retarded that you'll run the EGTs up. Not a map for power, but a good, safe map.
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Old 01-27-2009, 12:17 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 92Miata View Post
Ive been looking at the maps everyone else has posted and it has me alittle nervous about my map.

I Cant hear any Ping, nor can my buddy who has tuned his 12second mustang.

But it just seems like im running a crazy amount of timing compared to everyone else.

Car pulls Great all the way to redline.

specs, 92 1.6L, Stock header, 2inch side exit exhaust no cat cherry bomb muffler, Webcams.

There is no way in HELL you can run 31* @ 800 RPM or 33* @ 1200 RPM at 101 kpa. No way. Change that to like 20 and 22 respectively. And even the 1800 @ 101kPa needs to be pulled back some. There's no way you can that much timing in that soon without knocking.

Also you 101kPa rows across all look high to me. Nobody here runs that much timing in those rows. Cruise cells are rather aggressive as well. I'd change it.

Boost cells are safe though. Rather conservative actually.
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Old 01-27-2009, 12:23 AM   #4
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Im NA so i havnt touched the Boosted cells.

The whole map is ment to be aggressive, Lugging the engine in 5th at 1000-1200 had no aubible ping/knock. Cruise has no audible knock or ping either.

But i guess ill back the whole map down alittle till i get to the dyno Saturday.

Im guessing Sav just looked at the boosted cells then ?


This is the Table i was using before and the local miata guys said i could go alittle more.
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Old 01-27-2009, 12:28 AM   #5
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No boost yet correct? The 100 kpa and below cells look fine for out of boost if you run high octane... you don't need all that timing in cruise tho
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Old 01-27-2009, 12:28 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 92Miata View Post
Im NA so i havnt touched the Boosted cells.

The whole map is ment to be aggressive, Lugging the engine in 5th at 1000-1200 had no aubible ping/knock. Cruise has no audible knock or ping either.

But i guess ill back the whole map down alittle till i get to the dyno Saturday.

Im guessing Sav just looked at the boosted cells then ?


This is the Table i was using before and the local miata guys said i could go alittle more.
Either you don't know what knock sounds like, or your base timing it off. Have you verified that TDC on the balancer is indeed TDC?

I run like 20* @101kPa and 500 RPMs, 22 at 1000 RPMs, maybe 26 by 1500, and 29 by 2K all at 101kPa. Add two degrees to any of those numbers and my **** knocks.
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Old 01-27-2009, 12:39 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patsmx5 View Post
Either you don't know what knock sounds like, or your base timing it off. Have you verified that TDC on the balancer is indeed TDC?

I run like 20* @101kPa and 500 RPMs, 22 at 1000 RPMs, maybe 26 by 1500, and 29 by 2K all at 101kPa. Add two degrees to any of those numbers and my **** knocks.
Ive never heard Knock in a miata but ive had it in my 73 hornet I6 and my 240.

TDC on the balancer is TDC.
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Old 01-27-2009, 12:42 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePass View Post
No boost yet correct? The 100 kpa and below cells look fine for out of boost if you run high octane... you don't need all that timing in cruise tho

NO BOOST.. motor is still NA.

Running 93 Octane highest pump gas we have.
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Old 01-27-2009, 01:02 AM   #9
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For comparison, here's my map. I have a lot of headwork, and ~8.5:1 compression. All cells N/A below 3500 are all the advance I can run without knock. Add 2 degrees to that region and it will knock in ever cell. Above 3500 N/A, it's conservative. I've ran more timing there, but it does fine like this. In boost it's a bit conservative too, as I don't wanna loose a motor if say, I loose 10PSI fuel pressure and go into high 13's at 11 PSI.

Name:  timing1-18-09.jpg
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Old 01-27-2009, 01:41 AM   #10
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Hmm... do you know what the stock ecu adds at WOT ?

I was told it adds up to 20* to the base, which is what i based my WOT numbers off.

If this Map doesnt Ping/knock on the dyno ill keep using it, untill then ill back it off.
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Old 01-27-2009, 01:45 AM   #11
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How do I save my spark table so I can post it up here??
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Old 01-27-2009, 01:48 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePass View Post
How do I save my spark table so I can post it up here??
Open your msq, open the spark table, then go to file>export>save as. Then attach it here.

I have no clue about the stock timing. I think it's in the low 30's though. I still don't see how it could possibly not knock at 500 and 1000 RPMs with that much timing. Pretty much impossible for it not to.
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Old 01-27-2009, 01:56 AM   #13
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Ok here's my spark table for comparison. It's hard to figure out exactly how far you can go in all the cells... When I was spiking to 8 psi at 4k rpms it would ping a bit so I backed all the 156kpa cells off a bit but this map seems to work pretty well.

edit: ok why did mine come out as a downloadable file isntead of a picture..
-Ryan
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File Type: vex 1-26-09 spark table.vex (1.7 KB, 114 views)
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Old 01-27-2009, 02:14 AM   #14
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Name:  sparkmap-testpipemap9.jpg
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Mine. Don't copy it.
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Old 01-27-2009, 02:28 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePass View Post
Ok here's my spark table for comparison. It's hard to figure out exactly how far you can go in all the cells... When I was spiking to 8 psi at 4k rpms it would ping a bit so I backed all the 156kpa cells off a bit but this map seems to work pretty well.

edit: ok why did mine come out as a downloadable file isntead of a picture..
-Ryan
Open megatune, open the spark map and do ALT+Print screen, then paste that in paint and save it.
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Old 01-27-2009, 02:31 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patsmx5 View Post
Open your msq, open the spark table, then go to file>export>save as. Then attach it here.

I have no clue about the stock timing. I think it's in the low 30's though. I still don't see how it could possibly not knock at 500 and 1000 RPMs with that much timing. Pretty much impossible for it not to.
if stock is 30* with 10* base then the people that run 18* base are running within 1-2* of me.

But it seems no one else is running as much as me with MS... they dyno will tell all.
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Old 01-27-2009, 02:53 AM   #17
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My current spark table. I've been gradually adding advance in the boosted cells a degree or two at a time for the past few days. Hard to know (without a dyno) exactly when to stop. The KnocksenseMS is still giving me false indications...



I'll note this is with WI and a FMIC, on a 1.6 with all stock internals and a TD04H-15G.
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Old 01-27-2009, 03:36 AM   #18
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Joe, I never knew you were running the tdo4-15g turbo

threadjack over---
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Old 01-27-2009, 06:10 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Savington View Post
Mine. Don't copy it.
Looking at yours, I believe back when I began tuning I did exactly that, or at least loosely based mine on yours haha
[IMG][/IMG]

-Ryan
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Old 01-27-2009, 06:20 AM   #20
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Ryan, how much boost do you run? If I ran your map I'd ping.
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