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Old 02-12-2009, 12:57 PM   #1
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Default Need some info and guidence on setting up a MS2 for a 2000 NB JRSC car.

I'm a regular on miata.net and have been doing tons and tons of research on ECU's for about a year now. I'm also a certified ASE tech so I understand details(just to save time from people typing a lot to explain stuff.)
While the car is basic now, in the future it will become rather extreme as all my cars do. I'm already amassing parts and picking others for either an MP62 or turbo upgrade with Forged Pistons and rods, and refabed crank from Shaftech, ported head and intake, supercharger cams, FMIC, WI etc. big build.

So right now my car is having a little more work done, The car currently has the JRSC and CAI from DDM, base powercard, RB header, midpipe and RB cat.
I'm sending my blower out to be rebuilt and ported for now(I already know I should upgrade to the MP62 and will eventually, it's a money thing, as I'm sure everyone understands right now.) and I'm swain coating the header for heat control. After I do this I want to address ECU tuning, the car has some annoying off idle stumbling problems(especially when cold or when the AC is on) and it runs WICKED rich and keeps fouling O2 Sensors and cats from the crappy old Powercard setup. After MUCH research I have recided a MS2 will fit my needs and expandability best. The MS2 will need to be wired in parallel to retain OBDII scan capabilities for emission testing in AZ.

So here is where I need the help. This car is my daily driver. I already spoke with Arizona dyno Chip, they will install and tune the setup for me and have experience tuning MS systems.
Thing is, I'm not doing this erector set crap MegaSquirt seems to do? I was directed to diyautotune.com for preassembled MS2's, but I'm still not sure what parts, and sensors I will need.

See this is what I'm looking for.
Complete timing control
Complete custom fuel mapping
Both based on boost psi, intake temp, engine knock, wideband O2 info, EGT, engine temp, basically a fully tunable system. I also want to be able to control a water Injection setup with the MS2 as well.
I want a setup ready to go, I believe I have heard some refer to a "boomslang" harness and I'm not sure what that is totally.
All I want is a MS2 box and a parallel harness prewired ready to hook up to the senders and tune, I'm willing to pay to get what I want so that installation time is at a minimum so I can get my car back quick. The shop said if the harness is ready to wire in they can install the setup and do 2 hours of dyno tuning and be done, like 6 hours tops and my car will be ready.
Several miata.net members said this is the site I need to go to for NB MS2 setups. They said I could find people willing to fab me just such a harness I will need, advise me which sending units are best and what problems I will have to deal with to tune the MS2 correctly for an NB and not throw codes.


See my 2000 is my Daily Driver, my other car is still back east. So I need a system that can be installed and dyno tuned in 1 day and work perfect. I see SO many horror threads about "problems with my MS install" "car wont start after MS install" "car dies randomly after MS install" "car won't idle right after MS install"
I CAN NOT afford that type of problems. I need this car to get to work everyday. So I need to know FOR SURE that I can get the correct parts I need through purchase or paying others to prefab, have it assembled correctly, have a harness with it that simply requires a little wire splicing and then an hour or 2 dyno tuning it and I'm done. No "weird" drivabilty problems, nothing.
My setup is fairly simple after all. Can anyone guide me here?
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Old 02-12-2009, 01:36 PM   #2
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Install Megasquirt in parallel with the stock ECU, this will save you lots of headache, trust me. Buy a boomslang harness or build one yourself, share whatever sensors MS will need with the stock computer and be done. Seems like you already have the idea, just not sure how to act on it.

My advice, either build the MS yourself following the ignition steps for the 99-00 Miata on the MS2extra manuals website, goto Boomslang Fabrication - The Performance Wiring Specialists and buy a harness extension for your car, and then splice in the harness you make for MS. If you don't want a CEL then you will have to leave the MAF connected.

You can follow the ignition input instructions on the MS2extra site, and the spark output instructions from the DIYAutotune Miata page, simple as that. Just get familiar with the MS2extra manuals and you shouldn't have too much issue.
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Old 02-12-2009, 01:47 PM   #3
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Old 02-12-2009, 01:58 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karter74 View Post
Install Megasquirt in parallel with the stock ECU, this will save you lots of headache, trust me. Buy a boomslang harness or build one yourself, share whatever sensors MS will need with the stock computer and be done. Seems like you already have the idea, just not sure how to act on it.

My advice, either build the MS yourself following the ignition steps for the 99-00 Miata on the MS2extra manuals website, goto Boomslang Fabrication - The Performance Wiring Specialists and buy a harness extension for your car, and then splice in the harness you make for MS. If you don't want a CEL then you will have to leave the MAF connected.

You can follow the ignition input instructions on the MS2extra site, and the spark output instructions from the DIYAutotune Miata page, simple as that. Just get familiar with the MS2extra manuals and you shouldn't have too much issue.
I'm definitely going Parallel, I have to for AZ emissions.

NO WAY am I building my own MS2, i'll order one premade, I was a BMW tech for years till I broke my back, no more working on cars for me now, plus I don't enjoy it after doing it for a living.

To my knowledge boomslang only offers NA harnesses and I'm not building my own MS harness, thats actually why I posted this thread.

I want to buy an MS2 premade, buy a boomslang harness if available and pay someone to make me a boomslang to MS2 harness with all the sensor wires marked and ready to hook up and tell me buy "this" sensor, and "that" sensor to avoid problems. I want a complete package of every part and wire I need, ready to simply plug in and connect to the new or existing sensors and tune it and avoid any "learning curves" by having someone with experience with MS and NB's set up my system.

Like I said this has to be a 1 day install, so I want everything idiot-proof and ready to go to make the techs job easy and quick. This is my daily driver thats why everything has to be perfect. And i don't mind paying someone for their time to set this up at all, I'm not looking for anything for free here at all. I just want this to be as simple and error free as possible and I will gladly pay more to make it happen like that.
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Old 02-12-2009, 02:13 PM   #5
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I don't think you can buy a premade MS for the NB, not yet at least.
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Old 02-12-2009, 02:18 PM   #6
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Unfortunately, IMO, you are a little naive if you think you can do EVERYTHING in a single day. Unless you can find someone to build you the Megasquirt, you may be waiting. And yes, boomslang does in fact make an extension for your car, GO to the website and you will see that.
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Old 02-12-2009, 02:36 PM   #7
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Sorry man, not happening in one day. That is just not how these things work, as you should know by now.
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Old 02-12-2009, 02:52 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karter74 View Post
Unfortunately, IMO, you are a little naive if you think you can do EVERYTHING in a single day. Unless you can find someone to build you the Megasquirt, you may be waiting. And yes, boomslang does in fact make an extension for your car, GO to the website and you will see that.


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Originally Posted by coastertrav View Post
Sorry man, not happening in one day. That is just not how these things work, as you should know by now.



OK now I fully admit I've never installed a megaSquirt. My understanding was that the Boomslang harness would wire directly into the MS harness, and that could be done on a bench beforehand. Then you could clearly label the wires that you would need to connect. Then when you started the install you could simply connect your premarked wires to the necessary sending units and power source, and then just tune? The majority of the wiring work could be done beforehand at a bench, that was my understanding? Am I mistaken? I thought the install process would simply be hooking up sensors?

As far as a premade MS2 goes isn't this one here?
MegaSquirt II Engine Management System w/ PCB3 - Complete Assembled Unit DIYAutoTune.com
I am honestly a little fuzzy on all of the MS add-ons and thats where i was hoping for some advice, but even if more assembly is required for the MS2 couldn't that also be done on a bench beforehand?

When I say a day to install, I'm not talking all the work required to pull this off naturally. I'm talking "downtime" on the car. Many more hours of work are required but I thought that could be done beforehand? Am I mistaken?
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Old 02-12-2009, 03:04 PM   #9
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The unit you linked to is what I'd start with. It'll require modifications for spark out and crank/cam in, but these are fairly simple.

Boomslang... love 'em & hate 'em. Here's what we're talking about:

It's an Extension Harness, just a short little harness where every wire is pinned straight through. The idea is that for those lines that the MS needs to access, you cut or splice into the wires on the extension harness and connect them to a DB37, making a simple, easy to install parallel harness that you then install between the factory ECU and the car's harness, giving the MS a place to plug into. This way, 100% of the wiring is done at the bench, making it plug-n-play.

In addition to the MS itself, you'll need the following:
GM Open Element IAT Sensor with Pigtail DIYAutoTune.com

I suggest you also get a GM Closed Element CLT / IAT Sensor with Pigtail DIYAutoTune.com to use as the CLT sensor and plumb it into the cooling system somewhere so you don't have to much about trying to get the factory CLT sensor calibrated properly on the MS.

You'll also want a wideband O2 sensor, such as the Innovate LC-1.

There are a few other little odds 'n' ends that are useful, like the MegaSquirt Wiring Bundle - 23" Long DIYAutoTune.com which is nothing special, but it's nice having all the pre-labeled colored wires when building the MS portion of the harness.
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Old 02-12-2009, 03:05 PM   #10
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The boomslang harness is just what is says, a harness extension. That means you then have to cut those wires and splice in wires that go to the DB37 connector that connects to MS. That is the easy part of the whole installation, and yes this can be done on the 'bench'.

What you may not understand is Megasquirt is a universal engine management computer. That means you can't just plug it into any car in the world and it will just 'work'. Internal circuitry has to be modified to properly accept different type of ignition/timing inputs from different types of cars. This means a pre-built megasquirt is just that, pre-built, not pre-modified for a specefic car, that part is up to you.

This is why its not turn-key like you may think it is. If you want turn-key, Megasquirt is definitely not for you, maybe look into a Hydra, AEM EMS, or other standalone. Megasquirt is popular with the DIY crowd for the reasons stated above and because of its price/performance.

In other words, expect some work....
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Old 02-12-2009, 03:25 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
The unit you linked to is what I'd start with. It'll require modifications for spark out and crank/cam in, but these are fairly simple.

Boomslang... love 'em & hate 'em. Here's what we're talking about:

It's an Extension Harness, just a short little harness where every wire is pinned straight through. The idea is that for those lines that the MS needs to access, you cut or splice into the wires on the extension harness and connect them to a DB37, making a simple, easy to install parallel harness that you then install between the factory ECU and the car's harness, giving the MS a place to plug into. This way, 100% of the wiring is done at the bench, making it plug-n-play.

In addition to the MS itself, you'll need the following:
GM Open Element IAT Sensor with Pigtail DIYAutoTune.com

I suggest you also get a GM Closed Element CLT / IAT Sensor with Pigtail DIYAutoTune.com to use as the CLT sensor and plumb it into the cooling system somewhere so you don't have to much about trying to get the factory CLT sensor calibrated properly on the MS.

You'll also want a wideband O2 sensor, such as the Innovate LC-1.

There are a few other little odds 'n' ends that are useful, like the MegaSquirt Wiring Bundle - 23" Long DIYAutoTune.com which is nothing special, but it's nice having all the pre-labeled colored wires when building the MS portion of the harness.
OK good those are most of the sensors I had been thinking of going with. I now fully understand what the boomslang harness is. The LC-1 is what I had planned on going with already as well. So a majority of the wiring can in fact be done on the bench, with some extra purchases of a few more parts (perfectly fine with me)

Quote:
Originally Posted by karter74 View Post

What you may not understand is Megasquirt is a universal engine management computer. That means you can't just plug it into any car in the world and it will just 'work'. Internal circuitry has to be modified to properly accept different type of ignition/timing inputs from different types of cars. This means a pre-built megasquirt is just that, pre-built, not pre-modified for a specefic car, that part is up to you.

This is why its not turn-key like you may think it is. If you want turn-key, Megasquirt is definitely not for you, maybe look into a Hydra, AEM EMS, or other standalone. Megasquirt is popular with the DIY crowd for the reasons stated above and because of its price/performance.

In other words, expect some work....
I can't run stand alone because of Arizona emissions requirements to pull OBDII codes. So none of those options work for me.
How much work is required to modify the preassembled MS2 for Miata NB use, and how can I get that done? I'm not in a hurry and will gladly wait so I could have the piece of mind knowing it is done correctly and would gladly pay for the service.
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Old 02-12-2009, 04:08 PM   #12
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When we refer to a boomslang harness, we're typically bastardizing the name and talking about the finished product, which may or may not be based upon something built by Boomslang (the company). Boomslang does make complete PnP harnesses for some applications (like the EMU) but not one for MS.

Here's an example of one that's home-built, using a male connector scavenged from a deceased stock ECU:

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Old 02-12-2009, 04:22 PM   #13
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When we refer to a boomslang harness, we're typically bastardizing the name and talking about the finished product, which may or may not be based upon something built by Boomslang (the company). Boomslang does make complete PnP harnesses for some applications (like the EMU) but not one for MS.

Here's an example of one that's home-built, using a male connector scavenged from a deceased stock ECU:

I see, now how would one such as myself acquire such a harness? Are there any members or vendors that make and sell them? Or is boomslangs that green one in the pic earlier?

And what about internal MS2 mods, is that necessary or is that all just tuning?



This all seems so complicated, all I want to do is adjust fuel and timing based on several inputs(boost, IAT, Wideband O2 and stock sensors), add bigger injectors, and control WI?

Last edited by stubbs; 02-12-2009 at 04:37 PM.
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Old 02-13-2009, 04:24 AM   #14
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I'd contact DIYAutoTune and see if they can build you a harness to go with one of their pre-made MS boxes. When I bought my MSPNP from them I got them to do some internal mods to it for an extra fee, perhaps they could work something out?
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Old 02-13-2009, 12:32 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by saboteur View Post
I'd contact DIYAutoTune and see if they can build you a harness to go with one of their pre-made MS boxes.
Sorry, but we are not set up to build custom harnesses yet. We do have an 18" pigtail harness for use as a starting point for this sort of thing.
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