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Old 02-03-2016, 10:40 AM   #1
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Default New MSM with MS2 enhanced ECU

Hi all.

Ordered my MS2E ecu about 2 weeks ago. Its going in my 2005 MSM and I will be sharing my expirence with you all.

I have used MS before, but I had an MS1 PnP ecu on an NA miata so its going to be a lot different but I am familiar with what needs to be done to get this thing running correctly and dyno ready.

My car specs.
Stock MSM engine and turbo
Full FM exhaust
FM CAI
Turbosmart MBC
FM (larger) intercooler
Innovate LC2 wideband O2 controller
Speedhut vac/boost gauge
Toyota 321cc injectors

And for a cherry on top (when everything is well sorted)
Water/methanol injection

So stay tuned!
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Old 04-20-2016, 10:14 AM   #2
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Finally starting to plan the install. Im getting my inspection so I dont have to worry about taking this thing out for a year.

So a couple things:
My intake/throttle pipe is the Begi replacment steel tube. So im going to go get my GM IAT bung welded in....I also have a injector nozzle bung for my meth injection, and Im trying to figure out if its ok to get it welded about 8 inches down (before the IAT) on the pipe, probably as low as I can get it.

Does anyone know if the IAT sensor would get ruined by the meth/water spraying so close to it?

i have read that it is a good thing to have it mounted before the IAT, and then read other posts saying that it would be bad...so im not sure how I should go about this.
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Old 04-20-2016, 11:57 AM   #3
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I dont like putting the AIT sensor behind the radiator.
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Old 04-20-2016, 03:41 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deathtrap13 View Post
Does anyone know if the IAT sensor would get ruined by the meth/water spraying so close to it?
Ruined? No. But having water at ambient temperature being sprayed at the sensor will cause it to read artificially low.

I'm with Brainey on this one. Tap the end tank on the outlet-side of your intercooler and stick it there.
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Old 04-20-2016, 04:24 PM   #5
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I'm with Brainey on this one. Tap the end tank on the outlet-side of your intercooler and stick it there.
i already had the bung welded on, but it's fine i have a 1/8npt threaded plug that ill put in there. Im not really worried about W. injection until i really get the tune dialed in, probably around mid-late summer after a dyno. or before the dyno and after i get the secondary table set up, also i could control the water injection with the ecu and have it only operate after a specific CLT temp and at a higher boost level
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Old 04-21-2016, 02:26 PM   #6
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after bungs welded. since the paint was mostly ruined i stripped the rest off, hit it with a polishing wheel and clear-coated the whole thing. I kind of like the look and it matches my FM intake a little bette

New MSM with MS2 enhanced ECU-forumrunner_20160421_132544.png

you can see the injector port at the bottom (currently plugged)
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Old 04-21-2016, 03:32 PM   #7
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i already had the bung welded on, but it's fine i have a 1/8npt threaded plug that ill put in there.l
use it as your boost source for your wastegate.
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Old 04-21-2016, 03:36 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
use it as your boost source for your wastegate.
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New MSM with MS2 enhanced ECU-53991d1346793381-boost-sag-no-you-dont-need-ebc-5.gif  
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Old 04-22-2016, 09:30 AM   #9
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use it as your boost source for your wastegate.
not sure what you mean. the OE turbo has an internal wastegate, and that has a vac line that goes from the can>boost controller>port on the FM pipe right after the turbo.

so i think thats covered unless there is some advantage to having that port right at the throttle

also brain Id like to hear what you have to say about mounting this ECU into my car, because it is Rev's latest model and the case has no mounting tabs, holes or anyway to bolt it to anything, and the stock ECU is on a mount that is bolted to the firewall in two corners. I was told not to try and drill/tap holes in the case and use the OE mount. Rather try to "use zip ties"....is there some kind of trick to getting this thing zip tied in?
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Old 04-22-2016, 09:38 AM   #10
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you want to source boost AFTER the IC but BEFORE the TB.
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Old 04-22-2016, 12:44 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deathtrap13 View Post
also brain Id like to hear what you have to say about mounting this ECU into my car, because it is Rev's latest model and the case has no mounting tabs, holes or anyway to bolt it to anything, and the stock ECU is on a mount that is bolted to the firewall in two corners. I was told not to try and drill/tap holes in the case and use the OE mount. Rather try to "use zip ties"....is there some kind of trick to getting this thing zip tied in?
I made up some aluminum brackets using the OEM ones as a guide. Nice and solidly mounted.
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Old 04-22-2016, 02:26 PM   #12
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I made up some aluminum brackets using the OEM ones as a guide. Nice and solidly mounted.
hmm thats a neat idea. i dont know if the screws in mine can hold it up though. they are tiny and thin. Im also not sure If I have the right tools to make those brackets. how thick was the stock you used? 1/8?
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Old 04-22-2016, 02:31 PM   #13
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the singular motorsports bracket is really sweet for NB owners.
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Old 04-22-2016, 03:17 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Deathtrap13 View Post
hmm thats a neat idea. i dont know if the screws in mine can hold it up though. they are tiny and thin. Im also not sure If I have the right tools to make those brackets. how thick was the stock you used? 1/8?
1/16" 5052, pretty easy to work with. I used the torx screws that came on the case, it doesn't need to hold up much.
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Old 04-23-2016, 04:40 AM   #15
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Old 04-25-2016, 07:13 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by zellers88 View Post

1/16" 5052, pretty easy to work with. I used the torx screws that came on the case, it doesn't need to hold up much.
I made brackets exactly like yours except out of steel stock. i used a thin rubber pad with adhesive on th em to reduce vibration and make it more soild

ill post a picture of it mounted under the dash. it used the original location

i followed all the instructions, made the project, loaded the firmware and opened my basemap. I calibrated the TPS and went on to set base timing.

The issue now is that the car will not start, it cranks over and sputters.

I tried starting both in fixed advance (10deg) and in "use ignition table"

Im going to send Rev a log of this later tonight
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Old 04-27-2016, 08:41 AM   #17
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Update:

Realized yesterday that the AFR gauge in tuner studio always reads 14.7 (and my WB gauge in cab was working) so it must not be getting any input from my wide band. I have an Innovate LC-2 installed in the car, and the controller has 2 smaller connectors on it labelled "in" and "out". So the MS ECU has a db37 flying harness attached to it with all kinds of extra wires for accessory sensors and programmable outputs. It has one harness wired in it to communicate with a wideband controller (such as my innovate LC-2) via a DB9 connector. This in Rev's manual is proffered because it is 100% accurate as compared to the 0-5v yellow analog wire.

The innovate LC2 came with a male DB-9 connector that connects to either the "in" or "out" port connector(s) on the controller. so I connected the innovate "out" port to the adapter DB9 > to the Flying harness DB9 female > and the DB-37 is connected to the ECU.

That has to be how the digital wideband communication works. But obviously it is not. There must be some setting in tuner-studio that I have to change/set that allows the AFR to come through on that port. But I have no clue.

Also I have never acsessed my wideband on it's own through my laptop via innovate's software. I'm curious If maybe I have to do that to change an option that allows the "out" port to send data to the ECU....

Going to go try this now, but If any of you guys have an idea pleas let me know, also If you have links to a specific MS manual that is most relevant to this ECU let me know, I don't know how closely MS2 extra manual relates to this because of the enhanced features. I hate to sound needy but I have not had an MS ECU in like 2 years, and it was MS1 so this is a big big difference.SO many more options/parameters that can be tampered with make me nervous.

Though I have not touched anything from Rev's base map except trying to set the fixed advance to 10* to set base timing, the car will still not start and TS is indicating "no RPM sync" and the "lost sync counter" adds up. All the other gauges, (i.e. MAP, MAT, VE current, IG adv, CLT, etc...are working).

Another Update:
Still can't get the car to start. I checked in CAN1 (Enhanced settings) and the digital com port to the wideband is live, its on Innovate MTX, and in "Calibrate AFR" the gauge is automatically selected by default as "LC-1/LC2"....not getting anything on the AFR gauge in tunerstudio though....just says 14.7. Really dont understand why its not working, because the gauge in the cabin is reading AFR's just fine.
I also plugged the stock ECU back in and the car started back up, I let it run until CLT temps were above 170 and then plugged back in Rev's ECU and it still wouldn't start.

log 1

log 2

Last edited by Deathtrap13; 05-02-2016 at 10:18 AM.
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Old 05-03-2016, 12:48 PM   #18
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Finally, Finally, Finally, it runs.
Rev sent me an email and it was just a setting that was wrong.

Turned out in ignition settings > "ignition input capture" was set to "Falling Edge" Rather than "Rising Edge"
took a few turns but then it started.....finished setting base timing....then it was running lean, but very close in RPMS (about 600-100 oscilating)

went to Fuel/VE table and highlighted the entire table and added +5...wanted to keep the same interpolation that he had. idles very steadily now 850RPM +/- at 14.8 - 15.2 AFR.... thats good.

Now, still have one big issue... The wideband is not communicating with Tuner studio....I have an Innovate LC-2 that is wired "stand-alone" from the ECU (gauge and controller powered from fuse box)
The gauge in the cabin works fine...But I'm using revs digital wideband com cable wired into the DB-37 harness... that is plugged into the DB9 "OUT" port on my wideband controller...Tuner studio's Calibrate AFR table recognizes that it is LC-1/LC-2 by default, and in CAN1 (Enhanced mode) under Digital wideband / EGT port it is set to Innovate MTX....But I have nothing...the gauge in TS just reads 14.7 all of the time.
also in AFR/EGO settings I have "Single wideband" selected, and "Remote ADC '0'" selected

Any suggestions would be much appreciated...thanks again for your help guys. I'm excited to get my 750cc injectors in and really unlock the potential of my MSM.
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Old 05-03-2016, 12:57 PM   #19
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You can use LC2 analog output to Pin 3 and 4 on DB37 connector as a temporary solution
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Old 05-03-2016, 03:29 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by irodd View Post
You can use LC2 analog output to Pin 3 and 4 on DB37 connector as a temporary solution
Rev believes the problem is that he forgot to solder a bridge between the pads on the circuit board that results in the DB-9 digital wideband COM port to be inactive.

I undid my wires for the LC-2....Then re-wired as:
LC-2 Black wire > DB-37 Blk/yellow wire
LC-2 Yellow wire > DB-37 Yellow wire
LC-2 Red wire > DB-37 White/Red wire
LC-2 Brown wire > Innovate Gauge white wire

Then connected to my wideband controller on LM-Programmer (Innovate's software) and re-programmed both outputs to be the same
So now both the yellow and brown wires on the wideband controller use AFR and have 0 - 5 volts (7.35-22.39 AFR)

I think tuner studio sees 1-4v for LC-2 controllers though...I think it's the same linear curve, but I will make sure before moving forward.

Anyway, its working now (after going into "Fuel settings" > "Ego control" > "1st ego port" > Change to "Local")
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