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Old 02-08-2015, 04:34 PM   #1
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Default No spark on start up with VVT swap

Rev built me an MS2e back in 2013 for my MSM. All of the wiring was stock. I just completed a vvt swap and am having trouble getting the car started. There is no spark and I cannot figure out why. I am using stock 01+ semi cop coils with the stock wiring. I did have to extend the wiring for the cam sensor because the MSM cam sensor is on the front of the head and reads from the cam gear while the VVT came sensor is on the back of the cam cover and reads from the teeth on the back of the teeth on the cam itself. I was wondering if anyone could take a look at the attached log and see if they can see anything that might cause this as everything else seems to be working just fine. I did change the setting in 'ignition settings' to use cam sensor reading if available to 'on'. It was previously 'off' but neither setting worked. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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File Type: msl 2015-02-08_14.55.09.msl (22.5 KB, 49 views)
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Old 02-08-2015, 06:10 PM   #2
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Go over your wiring again, the ECU is not seeing a cam signal.
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Old 02-14-2015, 04:56 PM   #3
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I went back over the wiring for the cam sensor and I know the ground wire and the power wire are working. I have not been able to figure out how to test the signal wire connections yet but Sixshooter is coming over with his multimeter now. I also respaced the crank sensor because it was bothering me. I have attached a composite log to show what I am seeing. It definitely does not look right to me but I am at a complete loss.



I know that each of those red lines is also the recording of an event that the computer did not expect. Any ideas?
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No spark on start up with VVT swap-composite%2520log%2520ryan_g_zpsoewqxwao.jpg  
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File Type: csv 2015-02-14_15.46.21.csv (10.1 KB, 34 views)
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Old 02-14-2015, 05:06 PM   #4
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I am also attaching my .msq file in case there is some sort of setting problem that I am completely missing.
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File Type: msq Ryan_G no spark.msq (96.3 KB, 45 views)
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Old 02-14-2015, 06:32 PM   #5
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Been trying to fix this all day. I have attached some a new data log and the latest composite log. After doing some more research, I think the cam and crank signal may be correct the way they are now but I am not sure.
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File Type: msl 2015-02-14_17.22.49.msl (35.2 KB, 37 views)
File Type: csv 2015-02-14_17.03.22.csv (10.2 KB, 29 views)
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Old 02-14-2015, 06:43 PM   #6
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Your CAM signal looks as expected, but your crank signal is all whack. Should be all single peaks. Your signal stays up, goes down and is in general unpredictable.
I'm not familiar with your particular MS, but if you're sure your crank angle sensor works OK and your wiring is done well, you may have to adjust the input sensitivity on the MS in some way. My MS3 has a potentiometer for that.
You could also post a composite log (*.csv) for further troubleshooting.
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Old 02-14-2015, 07:07 PM   #7
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Never mind. Saw the composite log. Your crank signal looks inverted from what mine looks like.
Weird since we both have "rising edge" selected.
Why did you disable the CAM signal?
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Old 02-14-2015, 07:09 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stefanst View Post
Never mind. Saw the composite log. Your crank signal looks inverted from what mine looks like.
Weird since we both have "rising edge" selected.
Why did you disable the CAM signal?
The cam signal was disabled from when I was driving it around and to my knowledge has always been that way. However, I did enable it and tried that as well and there was no change. I believe the crank sensor is good as it was fine on the car before it exploded so unless I just got really unlucky and it died somehow while it was off the car I don't think that would be the problem, but not impossible.
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Old 02-14-2015, 07:18 PM   #9
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Let me show you mine :-)
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Old 02-14-2015, 07:36 PM   #10
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I am having a bad feeling that my crank trigger wheel may be on backwards. Not sure if that would create an inverted signal but here is a picture from when I did my timing just to see.



Are those teeth oriented correctly? I have no point of reference.
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Old 02-14-2015, 07:38 PM   #11
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Trigger wheel is installed backwards?
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Old 02-14-2015, 09:31 PM   #12
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Quote:
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Trigger wheel is installed backwards?
I have no idea if that is a thing but I feel like I read it somewhere. I am just pretty much out of ideas and have no clue where to go from here.
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Old 02-15-2015, 05:33 AM   #13
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Unless the timing is off a few teeth, the wheel is on backwards.
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Old 02-15-2015, 07:59 AM   #14
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Is there a diagram somewhere so I can make sure the teeth are oriented correctly and I am not just guessing?
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Old 02-15-2015, 08:06 AM   #15
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Maybe someone else with an NB could post pictures of their timing marks and you could see if the trigger tooth that is just to the right of them on your car is just to the left of them on someone else's.
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Old 02-15-2015, 08:08 AM   #16
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You just need to take the four 10mm bolts off to pull the pulley and flip it around, right?
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Old 02-15-2015, 09:19 AM   #17
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It makes sense that the error detection marks in the composite log align with the crank signals if the ecu isn't expecting them to be where they are.
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Old 02-15-2015, 09:41 AM   #18
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I've actually been tinkering with mine recently. Here are some pictures that should help. Reference pin is at 12 o'clock.



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No spark on start up with VVT swap-19oz8n.jpg   No spark on start up with VVT swap-10gd4b7.jpg  
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Old 02-15-2015, 01:22 PM   #19
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Ryan's is opposite from yours.
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Old 02-15-2015, 03:37 PM   #20
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Going to see if that is the issue today. Thanks for all the input so far.
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