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Old 09-13-2010, 02:07 PM   #1
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Default Upgrading MS1 to MS2.

Before I begin, how has the firmware matured? Is it finally at the stability that MS1 offers?

If yes. Have there been any threads discussing upgrading an MS1 to MS2?
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Old 09-13-2010, 02:15 PM   #2
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stability: has it ever been an issue?
threads discussing upgrading: yes.
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Old 09-13-2010, 02:24 PM   #3
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Any write ups on upgrading the DIY mspnp unit to MS2? Not sure how it differs. I know Ben mentioned he was going to do a write up but haven't seen it.
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Old 09-13-2010, 02:34 PM   #4
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should be as simple as moving some jumpers and replacing the cpu in that instance, then upgrading the firmware.
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Old 09-13-2010, 03:00 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
stability: has it ever been an issue?
threads discussing upgrading: yes.
Last time I looked at MS2, I had just built the MS1 and got it running, MS2 was still in its infancy with beta or maybe even alpha stage firmware, hell Hires wasnt even stable yet when last looked at MS2.

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should be as simple as moving some jumpers and replacing the cpu in that instance, then upgrading the firmware.
This is what I was looking for.

To be totally honest, I haven't looked inside my MS in a while so I wasnt sure whats involved. I was thinking id have to rework all the tach and spark mods, If its as simple as putting in the new brain and moving the jumpers from the old brain to the right pins on the new brain, then excellent.

My car is running excellent, so im wondering if its worth it or not you know.
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Old 09-13-2010, 03:02 PM   #6
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that was in reference to the MSPNP specifically. A v2.2 or v3.0 requires altering the tach input mods.



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Old 09-13-2010, 03:28 PM   #7
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Looks pretty straight forward if my MS follows the same pinouts.

For example, I THINK, I already swapped my IAC2B and IGN for some reason.
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Old 09-13-2010, 03:37 PM   #8
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you still must swap it. otherwise just the tach input circuits get changed. pretty simply.
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Old 09-13-2010, 03:44 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
you still must swap it. otherwise just the tach input circuits get changed. pretty simply.
Then I wonder why I swapped it in the first place. I remember there was some confusion between the jump on the board or doing it at the boomslang. The swap could have been done in either place, I just dont remember why.

What kinda benefits did you notice with the MS2?
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Old 09-13-2010, 03:51 PM   #10
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before we settled on the "accepted" method of building the board/mods/harness there were variations on what outputs and pins we used for the two spark outputs. you probably had issue at that time. MS-2 outputs Spark A and Spark B in reverse of MS-I so you must swap the spark output leads or you'll be firing at BDC instead of TDC.

all of them.
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Old 09-13-2010, 03:55 PM   #11
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OH. I got what youre saying.

So give me an example of an immediate noticeable benefit of MS2 vs MS1.
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Old 09-13-2010, 04:22 PM   #12
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Quote:
You must use two 2N2222 transistors for the spark output.
Am I supposed to upgrade these too?

Read it here.
http://miataturbo.wikidot.com/ms2-a
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Old 09-13-2010, 04:25 PM   #13
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i wouldn't necessarily bother if you haven't the need yet. it solved an issue some people were having where the coils would ignite with key on and burn any residual fuel
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Old 09-13-2010, 04:28 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saml01 View Post
So give me an example of an immediate noticeable benefit of MS2 vs MS1.
offhand:

PID closed loop idle control
PID closed loop boost control
EAE acceleration enrichments
16x16 fuel map
finer fuel and spark resolution (100 times greater)
seq. fuel & spark, at least even semi-seq. fuel with injection timing.
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Old 09-13-2010, 04:36 PM   #15
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Wirelessly posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saml01
OH. I got what youre saying.

So give me an example of an immediate noticeable benefit of MS2 vs MS1.
Search noob, this **** has been discussed. I have a couple of those threads bookmarked but I don't feel like digging those up from my blackberry.

For one, MS2 has a bunch more resolution for more accurate fueling. My car runs a bit smoother everywhere than it did with MS1 hires. I'm also not sure you can run full sequential on MS1 due to lack of outputs. (?)

But if you're about to upgrade then take a look at MS3 and see if those features appeal to you. I'm looking at it for onboard datalogging for example. The board mods you have to do would be the same for MS2 or MS3. Of course MS3 does cost more, but if you think you want to end up there you could save the 90 bucks or whatever the MS2 card costs and just put that towards MS3.
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Old 09-13-2010, 04:59 PM   #16
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MS3 is overkill for me. Its way more than I could want right now. Im completely happy with MS1 to tell you honestly, just debating if I should upgrade or not. So far I havent been in a single car that runs better or as close to stock as my own.


Post the threads you have bookmarked if you have a chance. Its not an emergency.
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Old 09-13-2010, 05:32 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottFW View Post
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I'm also not sure you can run full sequential on MS1 due to lack of outputs. (?)
.
Physically MS1 and MSII have the same number of outputs, MS1's problem is it lacks the timers for sequential.
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Old 09-13-2010, 06:03 PM   #18
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There are only a couple reasons to NOT upgrade IMO. One is if you don\'t have 90 bucks. Another is that you\'re worried you\'ll **** up your MS doing the mods, and the third is you think your car won\'t run right after the upgrade.





I\'ll admit I\'m no MS genius, but I can read and follow instructions and braineack\'s little how-to photos were all the info I needed and I didn\'t brick my MS.





You will have to retune the VE table some after the upgrade. No big deal now since tunerstudio essentially does it for you. It will run great and you will have future upgrade options.





Also FWIW I don\'t see why people use a stock car as a reference for the car running smoothly. My car ran a **** ton smoother on MS than it did stock, once I got it tuned.

Last edited by ScottFW; 09-13-2010 at 06:09 PM.
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Old 09-13-2010, 06:46 PM   #19
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its insane how smooth my car runs on ms3 with full seq.
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Old 09-14-2010, 10:41 AM   #20
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Quote:
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There are only a couple reasons to NOT upgrade IMO. One is if you don\'t have 90 bucks. Another is that you\'re worried you\'ll **** up your MS doing the mods, and the third is you think your car won\'t run right after the upgrade.

I\'ll admit I\'m no MS genius, but I can read and follow instructions and braineack\'s little how-to photos were all the info I needed and I didn\'t brick my MS.

Also FWIW I don\'t see why people use a stock car as a reference for the car running smoothly. My car ran a **** ton smoother on MS than it did stock, once I got it tuned.
Im not worried ill brick my MS. I built and wired the thing from scratch, its just a combination of laziness and the benefits.

I use a stock car as a base for running smoothly because I imagine you cant make a car run better than the engineers that built it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
its insane how smooth my car runs on ms3 with full seq.
I thought MS3 was still in beta stages?

I have to witness this smoothness, I cant imagine it running smoother than stock.

If the MS3 is that awesome, I might as well as wait till it goes stable and make a bigger upgrade.

Last edited by Saml01; 09-14-2010 at 10:53 AM.
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