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Old 02-15-2008, 05:23 AM   #1
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Default basic DO INSTALL ?S

ok so i bought a used basic kit and it came with inside mount nozzles how do i use these the outside mount ones are like common sense but these look weird to me??? or should i even use the inside mount ones???? and the main thing should i put it before or after the ait sensor?
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Old 02-15-2008, 10:50 AM   #2
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Put it about 2-6 inches in front of the TB. You will most likely be post AIT with it unless you have the intake manifold tapped. As far as i can tell on the inside mount nozzles you tap the hole then thread the nozzle through it using a nut or other fitting to keep it from falling off into the motor. The screen part goes to the outside and is the entrance the flat part is the exit. These do not seem idealy safe to me but they should work just fine.
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Old 02-15-2008, 05:34 PM   #3
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ohh i understand now which ones work better and how big are the outside mount ones they look big in the picture?? and should i use a 2gph or 3gph for 8-9 psi???
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Old 02-15-2008, 07:10 PM   #4
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The inside-mount nozzles aren't too bad. The nozzle holder (a 1/8" NPT elbow) goes on the outside and retains it pretty securely. Even if the thread in the pipe stripped, it couldn't fall through.

Outside-mount nozzles are a bit more convenient if you want to be able to periodically remove and inspect the nozzle, but otherwise I doubt there's a significant difference.

Do has a nozzle size calculator you can use here: http://www.alcohol-injection.com/for...lator-351.html

2gph should be plenty for only 9 PSI.
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Old 02-15-2008, 09:45 PM   #5
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I just finished max boost. Bell expressed an unmistakable distaste for WI.
Have major improvements been made in this area since the 1997 release of his book?
Maybe he’s since changed his view. If not, is he simply mistaken? Because I’m sure you guys wouldn’t be using it if it didn’t help…
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Old 02-16-2008, 01:58 AM   #6
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WI does help alot. While i have never read Mr. Bells books i think that from reading his posts on WI he actualy likes it but finds it impracticall for the Shadetree average FM wine and cheese consumer. Alot of people are turned off by the idea of empty tanks and checking the fluid level etc. But realy if the tank is sized appropriatly and you keep a good stock of WI mix in the garage and try to mentally note how much agresive driving you do it works awesome. It is alot more effective than a FMIC. To my knowledge there has not been alot of improvement since the 1950's maybe a new nozzle here and there but that is hardly any huge improvemtent. Search Mine/Joes posts and you will see several steps to make WI practical. I tend to be on the extreme of WI performance and Joe tends to be on the inovative side but overall it comes out quite nicely.
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Old 02-17-2008, 11:32 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnamx-5 View Post
... and Joe tends to be on the inovative side
Hahahahaha. Translation = I tend to come up with rather complex solutions.

Corky gives water injection a rather harsh review, calling it an unreliable band-aid. I actually agree with him. A water-injection system is basically nothing more than several points of failure cobbled together to form a mission-critical system. Seriously- empty tanks, clogged nozzles, an electric pump and controller, lots of tubing... If I were designing and building forced induction systems to sell to other people as a turnkey solution with a guarantee, I wouldn't include WI in the package.

That said, I consider WI to be a nice, inexpensive safety margin. I do still use an intercooler, and my timing map is not ludicrously advanced. What's more, I have a safety system (the "innovation" that magna refers to) that prevents the engine from going over about 6PSI unless the water system is running and making pressure, automatically refills my washer bottle from a much larger tank in the trunk, and alerts me if the water level in the washer bottle falls below a certain level. Once I get it set up in MS, I'll also be switching back and forth between ignition maps based on whether the WI is pumping or not.

All in all, I think WI is a good thing. You just have to satisfy yourself that you've done a solid job of putting it together and not design yourself into a situation where a failure of the system is likely to result in the total and immediate destruction of the engine.
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Old 02-17-2008, 12:46 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
That said, I consider WI to be a nice, inexpensive safety margin. I do still use an intercooler, and my timing map is not ludicrously advanced. What's more, I have a safety system (the "innovation" that magna refers to) that prevents the engine from going over about 6PSI unless the water system is running and making pressure, automatically refills my washer bottle from a much larger tank in the trunk, and alerts me if the water level in the washer bottle falls below a certain level. Once I get it set up in MS, I'll also be switching back and forth between ignition maps based on whether the WI is pumping or not.
Do you have any pics or a thread on this?
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Old 02-17-2008, 03:08 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
Hahahahaha.

All in all, I think WI is a good thing. You just have to satisfy yourself that you've done a solid job of putting it together and not design yourself into a situation where a failure of the system is likely to result in the total and immediate destruction of the engine.
This means don't be like me i am an extreme example of ignorance being bliss. Since my first melt down i have put in some safety measures, i just hope it is enough.
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Old 02-17-2008, 04:50 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vsloun View Post
Do you have any pics or a thread on this?
A couple, actually.

Here's the original install, which used only the stock washer bottle:
https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/showthread.php?t=6932

Here's the failsafe mechanism I built to disable the MBC (thus reducing boost) if the WI system fails:
https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/showthread.php?t=9083
(now that I've got MS installed, the MBC is coming out and the switch will be used to toggle the MS into a "safe" ignition map and defeat the EBC)

And here's how I installed a second, much larger tank in the trunk and built an automatic transfer pump to refill the washer bottle when it gets low. It also illuminates a light on my instrument panel whenever the transfer pump is running, so if it stays illuminated for any length of time I know that the tank has gone empty:
https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/showthread.php?t=9256
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Old 02-17-2008, 10:45 PM   #11
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Let me know if I can send you an outside mount nozzle to ease installation.
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