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FM II Turbo System vs Trackspeed EFR Turbocharger System - Which one?

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FM II Turbo System vs Trackspeed EFR Turbocharger System - Which one?

 
Old 01-13-2016, 01:36 AM
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Question FM II Turbo System vs Trackspeed EFR Turbocharger System - Which one?

I want to turbo charge my Miata(1997) and i had my eye on the FM II Turbo Kit for a long time until i came across Trackspeed EFR Turbo kit.. now i have no idea who to go for...

Flyin' Miata offers:
*GT3071R(My choice)
*Inconel studs and Fasteners (Assurance of safety)
*Hardlines - Water and Oil - Instead of silicone(again, my choice)
*Intercooler
*Integrated Wideband O2 sensor, Knock Sensor and Air Intake Temperature Sensor
*Parts that connect the turbo to engine(Manifold etc)

Trackspeed offers:
*EFR7163(Biggest turbo they offer, right?)
*Inconel fasteners
*Oil/water Lines
*Full Intercooler Kit
*Heat shield
*Other small components over the coming months.(???)

Basically both are the same, but i guess the piping, quality etc also makes difference..

Who's had experience with either? What do you think?
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Old 01-13-2016, 01:47 AM
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So you're trying to make like 450+ WHP?
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Old 01-13-2016, 02:16 AM
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What transmission? What motor internals?

The TSE kit is better in almost every way except price.
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Old 01-13-2016, 07:12 AM
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Your list of supporting mods for a build with the turbos you are considering, is astronomical. Way beyond the 7 or 8 parts that you have listed.
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Old 01-13-2016, 07:30 AM
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Buy a second miata.

Get both.

you tell US which is better.
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Old 01-13-2016, 08:30 AM
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Get a smaller turbo.

If you are asking this question, then anything larger than the 6278 or 2560 is only going to make you hate your turbocharged car. When you have sunk the money into the turbo setup and driven it for 10,000 miles, only then will you understand the $3,000-$15,000 in supporting mods necessary for you to make use of any powerband above what those two options offer.

Both of these turbos are capable of the "bolt-on" power that you seem to be looking for. They are also both capable of power beyond "stock bottom end" and "stock head". If you get a larger turbo than you need, then it will make as much power at the top of the RPM range as the smaller turbo while being an absolute turd of a car in EVERY OTHER DRIVING SITUATION.
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Old 01-13-2016, 09:48 AM
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For plug-n-play. A FMII kit with a 2560 would be plenty.

Everything has already been said about your current choices. Example... I have a 2860 and it's spool is on the sloow as ***** side compared to a stock IHI. I got use to the mazdaspeed IHI and now I crave spool . If I keep my current setup for a long time I'll eventually pickup a gt2560 since it'll be a direct swap. Probably save and pickup the full TSE EFR kit when everything is said and done and resell my entire current kit via these forums (one day). Unless you're going to the track with the huge turbo, the FMII is good nuff' for your stock motor.

You should create a supporting mod's list and total up how expensive everything gets in the end.
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Old 01-13-2016, 09:52 AM
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You're comparing a kit to a not yet kit.
I know a lot of people here really support Andrew's efforts and cannot wait for him to release a full kit (myself included) but it's not that yet, and I don't think anyone besides Andrew even really has "experience" with this "kit" yet.

so,

Until I see a TSE full kits getting flogged out there and owners providing their unbiased feedback and experience, I will point out the above.
If you want a kit, right now, get the FM. If you want a few turbo parts, right now, get the TSE. If you want to wait until there is such a thing as a TSE kit, and then get that, then that is a good choice as well.
PS: I would definitely prefer an EFR and tse mani over the FM log mani and garrett turbo. Just sayin

Last edited by 18psi; 01-13-2016 at 10:33 AM.
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Old 01-13-2016, 10:03 AM
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Also since no one besides Savington has a TSE setup, it is sort of hard to compare the two.
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Old 01-13-2016, 10:32 AM
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It's all been said but I'll just put in my $0.02.

If you want (almost) P&P, go FM but do yourself a favor and get the 2560 turbo.

If you don't mind a bit of fiddling, get the TSE setup with the EFR 6278 (again, smaller turbo).

And - unless your supporting parts list is MUCH larger - be prepared to break stuff and hate life.
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Old 01-13-2016, 11:08 AM
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If you want something that bolts on today, buy an FM2 or FM2R.

If you are willing to wait a few months, or if you're willing to build some of your own components in exchange for (IMO) a significantly superior product, go with our parts.

If you're looking for a lot of power, I would still suggest the 6758 over the 7163. The 6758 is going to spool quite a bit better and it's still able to make over 450whp with the right supporting modifications. If you get to that point (including the required built motor, trans upgrade, full fuel system, etc) and you still decide you want more power, the 7163 will bolt into place without changing anything (same manifold, downpipe, oil/water lines, intercooler, intake, etc) so you won't have to retool the entire kit to find more power. The same is true for the 62 and 67 - you can upgrade between those turbos without changing anything (even the turbine housing is the same, so 6258 users can buy a 6758 Supercore for ~$1200 and slide it into place without even unbolting the turbo/downpipe fasteners).

I'm biased, but I think our kit is worth waiting for, especially if you want a lot of power. The 6258 is a cool turbo, but the capabilities of the 6758 are so superior to a comparable Garrett (we typically compare to the GTX2867R). The 6758 is going to spool a bunch earlier, respond substantially better to throttle inputs above 3000rpm, and make a little more power to boot.
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Originally Posted by codrus View Post
Basically I've come over to the camp of "If something is a reliability problem on the track, just ask Andrew and do what he says".
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Old 01-13-2016, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by aidandj View Post
What transmission? What motor internals?

The TSE kit is better in almost every way except price.
Rebuild the engine, and upgrade it to 2L engine(via stroker kit).

Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
Buy a second miata.

Get both.

you tell US which is better.


Originally Posted by rwyatt365 View Post
It's all been said but I'll just put in my $0.02.

If you want (almost) P&P, go FM but do yourself a favor and get the 2560 turbo.

If you don't mind a bit of fiddling, get the TSE setup with the EFR 6278 (again, smaller turbo).

And - unless your supporting parts list is MUCH larger - be prepared to break stuff and hate life.
Does forged internals and heavy duty transmission sound good?

Originally Posted by Savington View Post
If you want something that bolts on today, buy an FM2 or FM2R.

If you are willing to wait a few months, or if you're willing to build some of your own components in exchange for (IMO) a significantly superior product, go with our parts.

If you're looking for a lot of power, I would still suggest the 6758 over the 7163. The 6758 is going to spool quite a bit better and it's still able to make over 450whp with the right supporting modifications. If you get to that point (including the required built motor, trans upgrade, full fuel system, etc) and you still decide you want more power, the 7163 will bolt into place without changing anything (same manifold, downpipe, oil/water lines, intercooler, intake, etc) so you won't have to retool the entire kit to find more power. The same is true for the 62 and 67 - you can upgrade between those turbos without changing anything (even the turbine housing is the same, so 6258 users can buy a 6758 Supercore for ~$1200 and slide it into place without even unbolting the turbo/downpipe fasteners).

I'm biased, but I think our kit is worth waiting for, especially if you want a lot of power. The 6258 is a cool turbo, but the capabilities of the 6758 are so superior to a comparable Garrett (we typically compare to the GTX2867R). The 6758 is going to spool a bunch earlier, respond substantially better to throttle inputs above 3000rpm, and make a little more power to boot.
Not looking to buy today so i can wait few more months and save more cash.
And sounds like the 6758 is perfect for track use and straight line action.
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Old 01-13-2016, 01:00 PM
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What heavy duty transmission?
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Old 01-13-2016, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by 18psi View Post
You're comparing a kit to a not yet kit.
I know a lot of people here really support Andrew's efforts and cannot wait for him to release a full kit (myself included) but it's not that yet, and I don't think anyone besides Andrew even really has "experience" with this "kit" yet.

so,

Until I see a TSE full kits getting flogged out there and owners providing their unbiased feedback and experience, I will point out the above.
If you want a kit, right now, get the FM. If you want a few turbo parts, right now, get the TSE. If you want to wait until there is such a thing as a TSE kit, and then get that, then that is a good choice as well.
PS: I would definitely prefer an EFR and tse mani over the FM log mani and garrett turbo. Just sayin
Well if you say so than i'll definitely wait till the kit is complete. And since i'm in no rush to spend 10K+ , i wouldn't mind waiting..
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Old 01-13-2016, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by aidandj View Post
What heavy duty transmission?
I haven't got my eye on a proper one right now, but FM LEVEL 2 CLUTCH was 1st on my list(Since i was considering buy the FM II Turbo Kit with it).
Also came upon ACT 1.8L Clutch Kit - By TrackSpeed but it's made for low-boost forced induction setup, so hopefully but the time they finish the turbo kit they also have a heavy clutch.
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Old 01-13-2016, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by exonerare View Post
I haven't got my eye on a proper one right now, but FM LEVEL 2 CLUTCH was 1st on my list(Since i was considering buy the FM II Turbo Kit with it).
Also came upon ACT 1.8L Clutch Kit - By TrackSpeed but it's made for low-boost forced induction setup, so hopefully but the time they finish the turbo kit they also have a heavy clutch.
We said transmission, not a clutch. The clutch is not the issue. The breaking 6 speeds continuously at those power levels is the problem.
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Old 01-13-2016, 01:12 PM
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With +400whp goals I feel like you're better off going straight to a LS motor. At that power level the entire miata drivetrain really needs to be swapped out anyway. Might as well just move to a LS3 with a mild cam and make 500whp all day without breaking a sweat vs a comparably peaky and questionably reliable BP.
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Old 01-13-2016, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by pdexta View Post
With +400whp goals I feel like you're better off going straight to a LS motor. At that power level the entire miata drivetrain really needs to be swapped out anyway. Might as well just move to a LS3 with a mild cam and make 500whp all day without breaking a sweat vs a comparably peaky and questionably reliable BP.
Best post. It's the truth. The LS would be wayyy more reliable too.
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Old 01-13-2016, 01:38 PM
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confirmed lost cause.
as soon as he said "heavy duty transmission"
sadly this is another little kid wasting everyone's time with a "dreamer" thread

hey bro,
now I'm sad to have wasted keystrokes


Last edited by 18psi; 01-13-2016 at 02:29 PM.
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Old 01-13-2016, 01:41 PM
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Originally Posted by exonerare View Post
Does forged internals and heavy duty transmission sound good?
Negcat for this.
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