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Old 08-30-2006, 10:23 PM   #1
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Default MSD boost retard vs. Bipes????

ok why should i get the bipes instead of the msd boost retard system? the msd is cheaper. so anyone know the answer to this? is it that the bipes will allow for more boost or something? please someone help me on this hoice? also the bipes is outta stock.
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Old 08-30-2006, 10:25 PM   #2
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msd box can only retard up to 6 degrees, and only 1 degree per psi of boost. End of story, no adjustability. Bipes can do a bunch....arent there a few for sale on ebay and the classifieds here right now?
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Old 08-30-2006, 10:58 PM   #3
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I second what braineack said. The Bipes simply has more adjustability. Plus it can pull timing back for temperature. The Bipes can do more than the MSD. Like braineack said check EBay. I was lucky and got mine with the used GReddy kit basically for free. It works great. It's the next best thing to a real engine management system.

I don't think the MSD is a bad system though, I just don't know enough about it to comment more.
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Old 08-31-2006, 12:08 AM   #4
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Correct only on the basic MSD pulling 6' of timing. It pulls 2' for each 1 PSI of boost. By 3 PSI of boost all 6 degrees are pulled. One drawback is that it only reacts to boost and no other factors such as RPM. Still an inexpensive devices that allows setting the base timing to 12-14 degrees (pending boost pressure/intercooling). That gives you back your off boost power plus a safety mode during boost.

Prior to Dick Bipes developing the ACU, he made a mod to the MSD to permit boost adjustment based on boost pressure plus RPM. That is what I still use and is very effective. His ACU would give more adjustments and would prefer to use that one. At this point his modded MSD is still working and see only minor benefits to upgrade.

If is is one of the older MSD units, it may only pull 5 degrees and cannot be modified. Easy way to check is to use your bicycle pump or mighty-vac tool to fake boost directly to the unit and use a timing light.
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Old 08-31-2006, 07:28 AM   #5
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Thanks Pop... that's some good information and some good history on the products.

One thing that is cool about the Bipes, that I am taking advantage of, is the temperature readout of air intake pressure. I am in the process of working on a cold air box and drilling holes in the cowl to bring in the cold air. The Bipes allows me to measure intake temperature before, during various stages, and after the intake mod to see just how effective it is.
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Old 08-31-2006, 09:44 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pop VII View Post
Correct only on the basic MSD pulling 6' of timing. It pulls 2' for each 1 PSI of boost. By 3 PSI of boost all 6 degrees are pulled. One drawback is that it only reacts to boost and no other factors such as RPM. Still an inexpensive devices that allows setting the base timing to 12-14 degrees (pending boost pressure/intercooling). That gives you back your off boost power plus a safety mode during boost.
As far as getting the job done it works...like Pop says, you can set your base timing to 14* and pull back to 8* in boost. If that's all you need then you're set.
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Old 09-16-2006, 02:35 AM   #7
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So looking for a balance of costs vs simplicity vs effectiveness, which is best for a simple 6-8 psi boost setup to ensure things won't go bang, keeping in mind I will have an FMIC????
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Old 09-16-2006, 02:35 PM   #8
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Just look at the prices and features. I think Bipes will win out.
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Old 09-16-2006, 02:47 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Arthur View Post
So looking for a balance of costs vs simplicity vs effectiveness, which is best for a simple 6-8 psi boost setup to ensure things won't go bang, keeping in mind I will have an FMIC????
Yet another vote for the bipes, but for yet another reason. For now, your plans are a simple 6-8psi setup, but that can change quickly. Trust me 2 years ago I said I'd never go above 8 psi, do another clutch job, change my diff.....etc..... Even though you may not "need" the extras now, you probably will want it later.
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Old 09-16-2006, 03:51 PM   #10
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If buying retail suggest going with the Bipes since is only about $60 more but permits greater flexible tuning. The MSD has only 4 wires and a vacuum line to hook up and that only takes a few minutes to install and forget about. The capabilities I listed in a post earlier.

Would have gone with the Bipes when first looking for ignition management, but the only thing available was the J&S Knock Sensor and the MSD.
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Old 09-16-2006, 10:49 PM   #11
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My auction for the msd boost ignition retard for the miata starts today on ebay.
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Old 09-16-2006, 11:37 PM   #12
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