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... and on my 3rd attempt, an SE

Old 09-14-2017, 08:57 PM
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Smile ... and on my 3rd attempt, an SE

I started out with a Grace Green 98, pristine with 18k kms in January 2000 - the Green Machine. Kept stock it for a few years, then started the downhill slide with a MX5 Club track day. Hooked. Long story short, won Club trackday class a few years, started NSW State Supersprint Championship, won 2B Class in 2006. Car at that stage running 115rwkw, Bilstein suspension, LSD (Torsen). Fun car, but ... not so much fun in the city, lumpy cams, low clearance, stiff ride.

Decided I liked this stuff, bought a logbooked caged roller - a 2000 NB8B shell. Plan to transfer good bits from road car to make a cheap racecar, but at its last outing the GM dropped a valve. Bit the bullet, ordered new Garry Stewart engine - cheap racecar not so cheap now. Spent lots of time sorting car, brakes were a real problem, electrical woes zapped an ECU, usual story of the DIYer! Eventually the results started to flow, I won 3B Class, moved up to 4B, great tussle but even though I won four rounds to two, I was pipped by one lousy point for the Class win. 2017 saw a major restructuring of the tech regs which crystallised a realisation that the racecar would have to go sooner or later.

Enter the new car. Happened to be in a workshop talking to the mechanic working on an SE (MSM to some). He asked if I was interested in one, as his mate was selling his. No way says I, knowing what these are bringing. Then he named the figure his mate was looking for. Hmmm ... I have a six-speed, LSD, spare BP engine, plus my existing NB8A - that pretty much covered the cost ... a week later I was the owner of a 100k km 2004 Velocity Red (ugh) SE, heavy 17s, slippy clutch, no cat and an imitation rear muffler (lovely noise, but attracted Plod from 10kms away).

Next week it goes on the hoist to look at the clutch/TOB (slip was adjusted out, but pedal has a bad buzz), fluid changed in diff, gearbox and engine, long wheel studs, Singular brake ducts and a filter relocation. 17s will be sold, I will run my 15x7 RPF1s on the road for now, and 15x8 6ULs on the track. The noisy exhaust has gone, replaced with a 3in from the dump pipe to a SMB 2.5in muffler. Nice note, legal even, but will probably be replaced with a 3in muffler to remove any back pressure from the smaller diameter SMB.

Next step is a new ECU, stage 8 kit, and a bigger intercooler. Car will run 98 on the road, E85 on the track. Yes, the plan is for the racecar to be sold, and the SE to run in 2018 as a Clubsprint Time Attack car. It will not be a front runner next year, but I can see a bigger turbo and built engine in my future ...

... and this is where I started out many years ago lol! The slippery slope looms again!

I am not a big build thread person, but this time around it might be different.

Pictures soon.
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Old 09-15-2017, 11:04 PM
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Awesome
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Old 11-03-2017, 08:56 AM
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New clutch is in, full 3in from the dump pipe. new fluids, studs and brake ducts installed. I miss the SMB note, but the butt dyno likes the new one.

The tuner wanted a photo of the ECU plugs, no problem but wtf the ECU cover has security nuts on it!? Fortunately I was able to replace it with some of the ECU hardware from one of the cars I have dismantled. Interestingly, the CEL light which had just come on was cleared as a result of removing the plugs (presumably), and it might be my imagination but it now pulls much harder and cleanly to redline than previously.

Freshly washed, but about to get a layer of dust.


Next step is the rollbar (removed from its predecessor) and the upgraded Walbro fuel pump. Also on the lookout for an intake and IC. At that point it will be ready for the ECU.
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Old 11-03-2017, 07:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Gee Emm View Post
New clutch is in, full 3in from the dump pipe. new fluids, studs and brake ducts installed. I miss the SMB note, but the butt dyno likes the new one.

The tuner wanted a photo of the ECU plugs, no problem but wtf the ECU cover has security nuts on it!? Fortunately I was able to replace it with some of the ECU hardware from one of the cars I have dismantled. Interestingly, the CEL light which had just come on was cleared as a result of removing the plugs (presumably), and it might be my imagination but it now pulls much harder and cleanly to redline than previously.

Freshly washed, but about to get a layer of dust.


Next step is the rollbar (removed from its predecessor) and the upgraded Walbro fuel pump. Also on the lookout for an intake and IC. At that point it will be ready for the ECU.

Looks great, you should also ditch those 17's and put some 15x9's on it. I really like the MSM ( SE to you ) such a nice car. Good luck with it.
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Old 11-03-2017, 08:22 PM
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Thanks Andy. Agree, the 17s are for the chop. I am planning on some 15x8 RPF1s for road use, and for the moment the 15x8 6ULs from the racecar will be my track wheels (running Yokie AO50s).

I was going to run my old faithful 15x7 RPF1s, but did a deal on them instead. 15x9s are not legal here on the road, and I want it to look as inoffensive as possible, given the noise is already going to attract unwanted attention.
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Old 11-05-2017, 02:04 PM
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How would anyone be able to tell that theyre 15x9? Do the wheels get removed for inspection? Usually the size is cast is in the rear. Thats a bummer regardless.
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Old 11-05-2017, 10:52 PM
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Not really, I am happy to stay with 8s, for now anyway. If I want 9s, I could get an engineer to certify them, and that would make them 'legal' - I might get the question if stopped, but the paperwork would (should) stave off the ticket. But the strategy is not to get stopped in the first place, well that is the hope behind keeping the car looking at least somewhat stockish.
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Old 11-06-2017, 04:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Gee Emm View Post
15x9s are not legal here on the road
I'm confused. I thought the ****'s lost the war.
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Old 11-06-2017, 10:38 PM
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Old 11-07-2017, 03:43 AM
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You're right, why didn't I think of that Art?!

Yes, I'll run 205s on the road, and 215s on the track. I'll be interested to see how the 215 AO50s go on the track, especially after the modz. Already in stock form I am getting some squirm from the rear exiting my favourite roundabouts, but the current tyres are nothing to write home about so some decent rubber will probably cut that back.

But I don't see any dragstrips in my future, for now anyway.
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Old 11-29-2017, 04:22 AM
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Things are ticking over with the SE, even if too much of my time is going into selling parts from various cars, including my old racecar which is now being parted out after a good offer for the engine - don't look a gift horse in the mouth is my motto. Intercooler and intake upgrades on hand, ECU before Christmas hopefully, patch harness is ready.

One problem has emerged - the ABS light has come on some time after the last work was done, and fiddling with connections doesn't seem to help. I did reverse (L-to-R) the front sensors as part of the ducts install, would the ABS know this, and/or care? I have some spare sensors, I might swap them in and see if that makes a difference.
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Old 12-20-2017, 05:28 AM
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ABS fixed by swapping sensors around until I got one that works, I don't know what happened to that one to cause it to fail. Also took the opportunity to lever out the one rubbing brake duct.

Now have SM4 ECU, patch harness, PWR intercooler, 40mm Cooling Pro alloy radiator, AFR500v2 WB with NTK sensor, and another drunk2 TB and a few other minor bits and pieces. I've been lucky with the broken TBs so far, the screws have done nothing more than mark the bottom of the head, but with a turbine wheel sitting there to catch one, I think I'll ditch the stock TB before disaster strikes, not afterwards.

What I though was the intake was something else, so I have to chase the bloke to deliver on his promises - hopefully before Christmas. After New YearI have blocked out a day to do the radiator, intake and intercooler. I'll also look at fixing the ducting, might even steal some pieces from the racecar since that is not needing them any more.
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Old 03-04-2018, 06:55 AM
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Time for an update.

The Cooling Pro and intercooler are in, with the Singular ducts and long studs. Still need to seal up the ducting for the IC and radiator though.

There were delays in getting the Autronic and AFR500v2 WB installed, got the call late last week that they were in and working fine, but the boost was stalling at 8psi with 12 the target. That is currently being investigated, which has pushed back the timeline for SS lines, new fluid and pads and getting the ducting done. Then a wheel alignment and install the ELBJs that have been sitting around for yonks.

I am deferring the injectors, fuel pump and flex sensor for 'stage 2'. This was locked in when inspecting a stripped down SE engine, with a rod in multiple pieces, great groove ground in the big end journal, and detonation marks all over the piston. Sure the stock rods are on the weak side, but running a manual boost control, on a stock ECU with no adjustment for fuel, and what do you expect?! I need to start stripping my spare BP and seeing whether it is a rebuild proposition ...

Oh, and I got some Advanti S1s in silver, 15x8 with 205/50 Federal RSRs as road wear. Rides a lot better than the 17s, not fair to compare grip as they were shod with Chinese imitation tyres, but the new tyres have so far proved unstickable. I must be getting old.

Rd1 of the 2018 State Supersprints has been run and won, without me :-( Fortunately there is a big gap to Rd2, hopefully enough of a gap!
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Old 03-07-2018, 06:24 PM
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Autronic SM4 is in, wow!

140rwkw, and it pulls like a train, very even flow and a marked contrast to stock. Small bug - a/c switch produced cool air, but it also implemented traction control, quickly fixed. Currently limited by injector duty cycle, there is more to come with an injector swap, fuel pump, and flex fuel, but rods ... maybe they will wait for the built engine.

This is my first turbo, so it might be good to stage the power at this level for a while , build the new bottom end, and learn how to drive a turbo, or at least to get the most out of this power level before progressing.

But I have heard that power is addictive ...
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Old 03-07-2018, 08:58 PM
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Still running MBC? How much boost? Because I've been Americanised to power figures thanks to the forums and Youtube I've had to convert KW to HP and it looks like you're about 190whp, so I'm guessing somewhere around 11psi?

Make sure you get big enough injectors if you go Flex, like ID1050x or the new bigboi FFs (if they're out by then). That was a misstep I made, I went with FF640s, they're great but I'm at their limits at 15psi and E85 on my SE.

I need to do wheels, I can't believe all the stuff I've done to mine, but I'm still running the 17s
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Old 03-08-2018, 06:36 AM
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No, EBC, 10psi.

Yes, it will certainly run E85, big injectors will be required. I will check those out. But big injectors, E85 and moah boost will over-reach the rods. Until I can make full use of those, it seems futile to install them and then choke the car back to protect the engine. Hence my revived interest in tearing down my spare BP, and building it with forged rods and pistons, and maybe an oil pump. That will make the IHI turbo the limiting factor I suspect, and am I game/rich enough to take that next step?

First things first, the brakes and oil cooling are my priorities. Pads (carbotech 10/8), fluid and ss lines coming next, with sealing the ducting in the inlet, and a guard roll for the 215 AO50s. I have a post in the oil cooling sticky for that, picking up on Lokiel's solution. With an alignment, I will then be ready to hit the track.

Have you installed the poly/bronze kit yet? That will be next, after the above, with shocks.

I have a set of stock PSS9s, race-valved and sprung PSS9s, and Chris' (Zossy) set of Xidas - decisions, decisions! One thing is for sure, the Tiens on the car now are going. Not impressed with them, well not favourably.

Yes, ditch the 17s. The difference in ride is marked, and enough to justify the change alone.
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Old 03-08-2018, 06:38 PM
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The stock MSM/SE turbo is POS (I know you know this). Mine is turned up to 15psi on E85, only makes 250whp, barely hits 225fltbs and can't sustain it. I wouldn't be too concerned about the rods if you manage the EBC well. Maybe run a little less boost if you're tracking though, pretty sure the IHI is going to get quite hot if I ran 15psi for sustained periods.

I know a lot of MSM/SE rods get bent, but they get bent on the stock ECU. I think it's the hesitation at 4000rpm, followed by the sudden whack of torque when fuel is finally added in that does it. Plenty of MX-5/Miata's run up to 270whp without bending rods on all sorts of turbos, provided the torque delivery is managed nicely, so there's no reason the MSM/SE shouldn't be able to safely run all that little IHI can give. Just my thoughts

Haven't done the SADFab poly/bronze kit yet, but I now have all the bits and pieces I've been waiting on. I'm doing a full-on refresh, upping my spring rates from 550/350 to 700/400, new extended LBJs, new R-package tie rod ends and new bolts, nuts and washers. It's all arrived now, so I just need to get on with my preparation by installing the bushes, bearings and zerks (I've got a spare re-conditioned set of control arms to replace what's currently on the car) and then clear a weekend for the install.

I say run those Gen 1 Xidas. They're supposed to compare pretty closely to the Gen 2s, which are fantastic. What springs are on them at the moment? I know where you can get some nice soft 550/350s soon
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Old 03-08-2018, 08:11 PM
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I hear you. Thanks, that is food for thought. I need to learn to drive this thing with 140, with very different characteristics than the racecar, and that will take a little time. When I have wrung its neck, and can't get more speed out of it, I will be ready turn the wick up. Hopefully by then I will have the rebuilt engine ready. I haven't mentioned the aero have I? That will also take some time to exploit fully.

Yes, I am looking closely at the Xidas. I need to check with Chris (or maybe look over my emails) to see if he revalved them, and the spring rates. I just had a time waster trying to buy them for nothing, they are certainly not moving as quickly as I would have liked, so maybe I can put them to use. I would have to check, but the springs from the race car PSS9s might fit, and that might give me more tuning options.

You may need more springing, and firmer damping, with the poly/bronze - I will be very interested to hear your findings, if I don't beat you with my installation! I have a spare set of arms too, great minds!!
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Old 05-01-2018, 06:42 AM
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Today's effort was installing a MR tall angled short shifter. Memo to self: read the instructions before starting, not halfway through when something isn't working right.

Much improved feel, sharper and less slop - I think my old bush must have been pretty shagged. I read somewhere that it improves reverse selection, and I though 'yeah, sure'. But it does! Probably the new bush, rather than the shifter, but I'll take it anyway it comes.

PWR oil cooler on the way, so need to sort out temperature and pressure sensors, and lines. I looked at the fender mounting, and it was pretty tight for a fan-assisted cooler, and difficult to avoid interfering with the brake ducting from the foglight hole. Now falling back to Plan B - mounting behind the radiator, drivers side. I have spare hose and AN fittings, plan is to take one of the lines off the remote filter and feed the cooler from the filter. Oil will travel engine-->filter-->cooler-->engine.

I had a look at the Xidas today - 800/500 Hypercos. That is giving me pause for thought, but given they are just sitting there I will still give them a run - probably. Wouldn't give it a moments though if my hoist was up, but that is a few months off yet.
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Old 05-01-2018, 09:48 PM
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Run the freaking Xidas already! Clearly the others in Car Talk can't see their worth.

I'm running 550/350 right now, but going to 700/400 when I install my SADFab bearing equipped control arms (soon! maybe this weekend...), I want a little more spring and I figure loosing the slight spring rate from the rubber bushings will reduce the overall increase. I might be willing to sell my 550/350 springs if you find the 800/500s too stiff.

The MR shifter is great, I went stock height but kinda wish I went tall angled.

I just bought this oil pressure sensor a few weeks ago, its nice and compact compared to the VDO sensors I've seen.
Honeywell Oil Pressure Sender

You're getting a hoist?
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