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Old 10-17-2013, 10:16 PM   #1
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Default Tubular Exhaust Manifold Options for NC

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Moderator Edit: This thread has been split from the other. Please keep separate topics separate if at all possible.

I have a 2013 PRHT myself and have been researching the FI route. I'm a turbo "*****'" myself from my good old SE-R days so I know what route I want to go. I won't make excuses, so to make a long story short I need to pay someone to fabricate a manifold for me. Can anyone here recommend a legit vendor where I can get something like this done? I'm not looking for a crazy equal length blah blah. I'd like to fit a T3/T4 type turbo with an external wastegate, right now the only pre-fab option I see is a log manifold which I'd like to avoid if possible. I live in North Central FL, so removing AC/PS is not an option.

Last edited by sixshooter; 10-18-2013 at 12:41 PM.
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Old 10-17-2013, 10:20 PM   #2
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Are you wanting to avoid a log for any actual reason or just so your buddies with zero knowledge about turbocharger systems dont give you a hard time?

Dann
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Old 10-17-2013, 10:25 PM   #3
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Are you wanting to avoid a log for any actual reason or just so your buddies with zero knowledge about turbocharger systems dont give you a hard time?

Dann
I don't care what other people think, I'm modding the car for me.

It's mostly from personal experience. My previous car started with a log manifold, made good power for what it was, but it made more at the same boost when I went with a "tubular" manifold. I don't know a ton about the MZR motor, but if I'm starting off with 10.8:1 compression, I'd like to stack the deck in my favor backpressure and flow wise.
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Old 10-17-2013, 10:34 PM   #4
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Of course it made more power at the same boost, but do you really think that boost pressure has any significant bearing on anything when within the realms of realistic?

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Old 10-17-2013, 10:41 PM   #5
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Of course it made more power at the same boost, but do you really think that boost pressure has any significant bearing on anything when within the realms of realistic?

Dann
Yes.. Tuning aside better manifold design equals more power at less boost pressure. High compression motor would probably prefer not to have as much hot air shoved down its throat longevity wise. Anyway your line of questioning has nothing to do with my ask. I'm all for bro science discussions, but I would really like to buy a manifold
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Old 10-17-2013, 10:43 PM   #6
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Your time and money. Go ahead.
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Old 10-17-2013, 10:47 PM   #7
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I have a 2013 PRHT myself and have been researching the FI route. I'm a turbo "*****'" myself from my good old SE-R days
Its funny how many of us former SE-R/SR20 guys are driving Miatas and turbo Foresters these days lol. Sending you a PM Luis.
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Old 10-17-2013, 10:52 PM   #8
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Your time and money. Go ahead.
I appreciate your input and opinions. I used to have lots of time and zero money. I ended up cutting corners to save cash etc. And ended up changing bits out later after the fact, turbo manifold etc. Being "older" now I'd rather do what's right for me. I want to do it the best way the first time . It's not a 2000 dollar car with a "disposable" engine for me anymore.
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Old 10-17-2013, 10:58 PM   #9
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Its funny how many of us former SE-R/SR20 guys are driving Miatas and turbo Foresters these days lol. Sending you a PM Luis.
I actually traded in a Mazdaspeed3 for it which is another post SE-R car lol.
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Old 10-17-2013, 11:02 PM   #10
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>2013: 10:1 high compression.

Right.

Spend money making it as complicated as possible and then try to impress people with your old guy antics.

Whatever man. The thing will be intercooled, the extra 1psi of boost required to have the log keep up with the tubular will come with worse spool, less reliability, and install and maintenance headaches. There is a time and place for tubular manifolds, and it isnt a car with **** all space to work with, heat affected components inches away in almost every direction and with a low power goal, in a street car that needs good response and a lot boost threshold.

Im currently building an equal length genuine twinscroll (fully split, twin external wastegate, no cheating) GTX3076r manifold for a Suzuki samurai that already has a supercharger, I know all about making **** too complicated. I pointed all of this out to that customer also, and he is doing it because he wanted to do it. Where as you are giving bro science answers with a condescending tone and answering with the same answers as everyone else who comes on and wants to run stuff that is more complicated than their goal requires.

Whatever.
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Old 10-17-2013, 11:08 PM   #11
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Condescending? Re-read your initial response. I asked a question, I can understand your negative props now.
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Old 10-17-2013, 11:13 PM   #12
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You've still given no reason for wanting a tubular setup except that, "you are older now" and " It's not a 2000 dollar car with a "disposable" engine for me anymore". Sounds like an attempt at being condescending to me.

Whatever.

Im out. Gotta go finish a manifold.
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Old 10-18-2013, 12:48 PM   #13
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Dann, I know you've been a bit tense lately but try to keep it light. This guy is not the source of your troubles. He didn't do anything.
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Old 10-18-2013, 01:22 PM   #14
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Luis what is your time frame? Most of the fabricators here are (at least a month ago they were) really busy and backlogged with work.

I will be building a custom tubular mani to fit an EFR 6758 in the next few months hopefully. If you haven't looked into the EFR turbos you should check them out. The integrated recirc valve and internal wastegate design outperform any external option, and make packaging much simpler. Only problem is the EFR is a bit bigger in size than a gt turbo, but I'm pretty optimistic it will still fit. Hopefully once I get mine done the other tuners and fabricators in the NC game will realize the EFR is doable. Until I get mine going though, I'm all talk .
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Old 10-18-2013, 01:28 PM   #15
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LOL as I said in the other thread, this guy right here ^^^

T3/T4 = old *** 80s/90s tech

EFR = Brand new fancy race designed turbo

When you factor in $300 for an EWG and $150 for a BOV, suddenly a new EFR is a similar price to a new T3/T4.
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Old 10-18-2013, 01:33 PM   #16
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LOL as I said in the other thread, this guy right here ^^^

T3/T4 = old *** 80s/90s tech

EFR = Brand new fancy race designed turbo

When you factor in $300 for an EWG and $150 for a BOV, suddenly a new EFR is a similar price to a new T3/T4.
thenuge I've had a hard enough time trying to get my own setup going I don't predict I will have the time to build manifolds for any customers, but I will definitely make the final design available to those who deserve it! I'm hoping to mock up the final design in my cad program, using all the correct weld-el radiuses. That way it will be very easy to cut all of the angles first, and piece the runners together.
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Old 10-18-2013, 03:21 PM   #17
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Luis what is your time frame? Most of the fabricators here are (at least a month ago they were) really busy and backlogged with work.

I will be building a custom tubular mani to fit an EFR 6758 in the next few months hopefully. If you haven't looked into the EFR turbos you should check them out. The integrated recirc valve and internal wastegate design outperform any external option, and make packaging much simpler. Only problem is the EFR is a bit bigger in size than a gt turbo, but I'm pretty optimistic it will still fit. Hopefully once I get mine done the other tuners and fabricators in the NC game will realize the EFR is doable. Until I get mine going though, I'm all talk .
Witty, I'm not in a huge rush. I travel quite a bit for work, so I am still trying to break the car in. I'm also a former East Bay resident . I was originally looking to do a GT35R since that's what I "know". But I have been reading good things on the BW EFR and am open to going that route if it will fit. Let me know how things go with yours or if I can pitch in some cash to maybe get it prioritized a little higher? . I'm actually heading back to the East bay for the month of December..
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Old 10-20-2013, 01:12 AM   #18
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On a less aggressive note than before... And I apologise for my bluntness.

Just putting parts on because you are familiar with them is not the recipe for success, the devil is on the details and you ALWAYS want to put on the bare minimum parts to suit your goals otherwise its just a waste of money and adding failure points and complication.

An efr6258 on a log or shorty semi tubular is the way to go, there is just too much that is easily heat affected on a road going NC and no advantage at all whatsoever doing to a tubular on an NC that is keeping its stock internals. What the tubular will give you is a lower peak boost figure for the same HP(completely irrelevant to anything, there is no real world advantage in having this), it will be much more expensive and difficult to work on, more prone to cracking, radiate more heat off its much larger surface area onto your alternator and ABS and all of the lines in the area, and spool at a higher RPM in the vast majority of cases.

Just use conventional parts.

Dann
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Old 10-21-2013, 11:35 AM   #19
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Thanks for the input Dann. In the end it may come down to packaging restrictions, especially since I'm definitely looking at a EFR setup.
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Old 10-21-2013, 04:19 PM   #20
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and spool at a higher RPM in the vast majority of cases.
Dann
But a properly designed tubular manifold should spool better than a log manifold when the manifolds are designed to support the same power levels.
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