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Old 02-07-2011, 03:07 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbundy View Post
http://www.wilwood.com/Calipers/Cali...%20Low-Profile
Bias would be an issue because it only comes with small pistons however.
And only with 5.25" lug mount, unless I'm reading wrong.
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Old 02-07-2011, 03:30 PM   #62
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And only with 5.25" lug mount, unless I'm reading wrong.
Yea but the profile of the caliper and the pad it uses looks like it would be useful for fitting in 13" wheels.

Either one of the calipers I mentioned fits in small wheels better than Dynalite.

Bob
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Old 02-07-2011, 03:54 PM   #63
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Look for more space for thicker front discs too…more thermal mass and cooling capacity. I should lay something out along those lines. After all I keep getting stock bits to work wonderfully with some mix & match and tuning.
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Old 02-07-2011, 06:44 PM   #64
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Look for more space for thicker front discs too…more thermal mass and cooling capacity. I should lay something out along those lines. After all I keep getting stock bits to work wonderfully with some mix & match and tuning.
Simply won’t work well with the Dynapro Radial and 11.75" rotors in many 15" wheels. Not enough room between the tie rod end and the spokes. The DynaPro Radial 11.75" with .81" rotors is simply the best combination of parts that currently fits in 15" wheels for the high HP track junky in terms of performance and longevity. You will be giving up pad thickness to get rotor thickness and pad thickness is the better thing to have more of to reduce wear replacement costs due to pad life. Thermal capacity of an 11.75"X.81” directional vane rotor is pretty well suited to the task as it is.

Bob
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Old 02-07-2011, 07:15 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbundy View Post
Simply won’t work well with the Dynapro Radial and 11.75" rotors in many 15" wheels. Not enough room between the tie rod end and the spokes. The DynaPro Radial 11.75" with .81" rotors is simply the best combination of parts that currently fits in 15" wheels for the high HP track junky in terms of performance and longevity. You will be giving up pad thickness to get rotor thickness and pad thickness is the better thing to have more of to reduce wear replacement costs due to pad life. Thermal capacity of an 11.75"X.81” directional vane rotor is pretty well suited to the task as it is.

Bob
Except that other cars with similar space issues have solved the issue...
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Old 02-07-2011, 07:53 PM   #66
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Except that other cars with similar space issues have solved the issue...
If you feel the need then you can work it out.

I want to see pictures and data logs of how wonderfull it is compared to the 11.75X.81" setup though.

Bob
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Old 02-08-2011, 12:31 AM   #67
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Quote:
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I think the caliper you want for that is the PowerLite. I have done a little thinking about smaller as well.

http://www.wilwood.com/Calipers/Cali...name=Powerlite

Then I just noticed this guy which looks like it could have some advantages as well.

http://www.wilwood.com/Calipers/Cali...%20Low-Profile
Bias would be an issue because it only comes with small pistons however.

The standard Dynapro Radial Mount really wants to work on 11” rotors or bigger. I'd recommend you go with the Powerlite radial mount calipers

Bob
I originally was going to use the Powerlite, but the current lack of pad choices and the smaller pad surface area made me go for the Dynapro.

According to Wilwood's schematics on a 275mm rotor (10.8'') the radius measurement from the center of the bore to the edge of the caliper is 156.2mm. Diameter being 313mm. The Panasport C8's I plan to use have a barrel diameter of 320mm. It will be tight, but it should work.

If it ends up not working out, I'll downsize to the Powerlite but I would rather give a proper caliper a go first. Going to the Powerlite would only give me an extra 6mm clearance on the overall diameter. And if the Dynapro ends up being rather tight, I noticed that have about 5mm of un used rotor surface the hub (I can tell by where the pads were biting on the old Dynalite setup). So I can turn the rotors down from 275mm to 270mm and adjust the mount as needed, hopefully allowing enough space.

Going this way will allow me to keep the larger pads, ideal piston diameter and more fluid in the caliper itself for cooling.

A local friend of mine is using Powerlites on a 10.1' rotor on his MK1 Scirocco race car under 13'' Keizers and has over an inch of barrel clearance all around.

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Old 02-27-2011, 02:48 AM   #68
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I was digging through some old photos and I found a photo that really helps illustrate why the radial mount Dyna pro caliper fits 11.75” rotors in 15” wheels better than the popular Dynalite.

Blue backing plate is a Dynalite pad back to back with the used Dynapro radial pad. The shape and area of the friction material is Identical between the two. You can really see how much less material sticks out past the radius of the rotor with the DynaPro radial. Both calipers use just as much radial space as there respective backing plates do.

Bob
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Old 02-27-2011, 04:11 AM   #69
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And that right there is one of the reasons I ditched my Dynalites in favour of my new Dynapros for the setup I'm having made for my Panasports. I've had a few people tell me it wont work, however I have spoked directly with Wilwood and they said with my rotor diameter (10.6'' OEM NB Sport Rotor) that I will have no issues with the C8's if the brackets are made correctly.

Same idea applies with the 11.75'' kit. Less space being taken by the caliper = more room for rotor or more room for a smaller wheel if you use the same size rotor.

Did I mention how big these things are though in comparison to my dynalites?

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Old 02-27-2011, 05:01 AM   #70
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Pads don't cause interference, the edges of the calipers do first.
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And falcon, I hope you're measuring caliper clearance right behind the spoke, not the final drum diameter.
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Old 02-27-2011, 06:02 AM   #71
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Quote:
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Pads don't cause interference, the edges of the calipers do first.
Bob's point is that the DP4R is a slimmer caliper overall.
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Old 02-27-2011, 05:31 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curly View Post
Pads don't cause interference, the edges of the calipers do first.

And falcon, I hope you're measuring caliper clearance right behind the spoke, not the final drum diameter.
Yes the caliper causes interference. I think bob was just trying to show how much slimmer the dynapros are by showing pad size.

And I already figured out I need 5mm spacers which is fine. C8s dont have a drop center.
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Old 03-01-2011, 10:48 AM   #73
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The DPr is simply a more compact offering for a tight fit. This is accomplished by lowering the mount height down and around the rotor edge tighter than the FBDL calipers do. They also incorporate a tighter radius at the transition around the rotor edge negating those bumps you see on the DL stuff. The DPr also does not have the pad abutments which can often contact a hat at low mounting heights on the DL also.


All of that substantiates much of what Bob has been saying since the start of the thread; for a low profile fit and max rotor fit inside a 15 this is really the best choice on the market. In fact as is the case on the Subaru and rally wheels it can even run a 12.0" rotor. The same fit for a DL will be pretty much limited to about 11.2-11.5" max depending upon wheel design.

just sayin...
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Old 03-01-2011, 02:02 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd TCE View Post
The DPr is simply a more compact offering for a tight fit. This is accomplished by lowering the mount height down and around the rotor edge tighter than the FBDL calipers do. They also incorporate a tighter radius at the transition around the rotor edge negating those bumps you see on the DL stuff. The DPr also does not have the pad abutments which can often contact a hat at low mounting heights on the DL also.


All of that substantiates much of what Bob has been saying since the start of the thread; for a low profile fit and max rotor fit inside a 15 this is really the best choice on the market. In fact as is the case on the Subaru and rally wheels it can even run a 12.0" rotor. The same fit for a DL will be pretty much limited to about 11.2-11.5" max depending upon wheel design.

just sayin...
You should thank me. You might get some good business out of my ranting.

I tried this fit first and for some reason brake suppliers that make money selling these things haven't picked up on the advantages of this setup for the Miata and ran with it. Better fit stiffer caliper with significantly longer pad life due to thicker pads.

Bob
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Old 03-01-2011, 02:51 PM   #75
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And I have but not here. So 'thank you'.

I've actually been down this road one time before Bob and it met with some rejection due to price. But that's another story we can talk about some other time.

I think the project has some potential but I'll also state the limitation with this is going to be the installation. Few folks are going to have the tools or desire to really "drill it out" to make it work. It sounds good and seems simple enough but it requires a 1/2 drill and some moxie to do it without messing things up. Ideally I'd suggest it be done off the car in a mill. The other option is to change the bolt-up format and if there were to become some interest in it maybe I'd look deeper into that too.

Anyhow, yes a fine adaptation of the MINI kit nevertheless, just not sure it's going to be for everyone.
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Old 03-01-2011, 03:19 PM   #76
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Back when I used to design aftermarket braking systems, a rule of thumb was that you could generally fit a rotor about 3 inches smaller than the wheel diameter, and often a bit larger. Look at all the Nascar 12.19s in 15s fer instance. If you lay things out properly, you can fit thicker rotors than most Miata BBKs utilize. This would have various benefits.
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Old 03-01-2011, 11:49 PM   #77
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I would like to say "Thank You" to both Bob and Todd. I order the kit from Todd with all the parts needed. It showed up in less than two weeks. I am very impressed by the service and promptness. I am hoping to find some time to do the install in the next few weeks. I will report back with the results.

Bob, thanks for blazing the trail for the rest of us.
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Old 03-02-2011, 12:01 AM   #78
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Looking forward to seeing and reading more about your install.
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Old 04-10-2011, 08:24 PM   #79
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Been a month now...any final installed pics or result noted?
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Old 04-12-2011, 01:34 PM   #80
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I will say that with my current brake setup Radial mount Dynapro Mini 11.75” fronts 11.44” rear with sport calipers and 1.6l pads I tend to go through rear pads faster than I do the front pads. The front pad life is huge compared to any other Miata setup.

Bob.
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