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Old 10-15-2011, 03:34 PM   #21
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Nothing useful to contribute here, but you look very Sterling Moss-like in that brain bucket. I like.
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Old 10-15-2011, 04:19 PM   #22
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Nothing useful to contribute here, but you look very Sterling Moss-like in that brain bucket. I like.
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Old 10-15-2011, 08:59 PM   #23
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Wow. Yours looks like it is experiencing much more travel in the front than mine but a little less in the back. I guess you didn't have an instructor helping to weigh down the rear. You were probably running stickier tires than my RS2s so you were pushing it harder. What were the spring rates on the car in the picture?
Unless you're comparing the same corner of the same track on (really) the same day, a comparison picture isn't going to tell you anything. Different tires, different elevation, different entry/corner speeds, about a million possible different variables, all of which will affect what the car looks like while leaned over.
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Old 10-15-2011, 09:53 PM   #24
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Wow. Yours looks like it is experiencing much more travel in the front than mine but a little less in the back. I guess you didn't have an instructor helping to weigh down the rear. You were probably running stickier tires than my RS2s so you were pushing it harder. What were the spring rates on the car in the picture?
actually that was on legally bald rs-2's. drove to and from the track. but again this was 2007. back then my car was at 2350lbs. not sure what the ebay springs were rated at. later i switched to Qa1 350/250 springs and an rb frt. sway. much, much better than that picture. i was pushing as hard as i could to not impede that spec miata driver. if you look at the sm behind me, you can see the difference 700/400 springs, and the big eibach sways make.
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Old 10-16-2011, 09:43 AM   #25
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The question I would ask myself is what would get you through the learning curve of track driving faster without developing bad habits. What do the instructors have to say about that?
I didn't get any feedback on the setup from my instructor. It was neutral enough that it wasn't the prime concern. He was concentrating on what I was doing with the car and where I needed to be on the track, which is also what I was concentrating on. If the car was actually a problem on the track from a driving standpoint I would have more to worry about. I guess I should make my small adjustments as I can afford to and just concentrate on learning the tracks and learning the braking and turn in points. I guess I've got plenty to worry about with that until I get more comfortable with it.

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Nothing useful to contribute here, but you look very Sterling Moss-like in that brain bucket. I like.
Haha! I had ordered a SA2010 full face helmet several weeks beforehand that had not yet come in. It was actually hot enough out that I was glad I had the open faced one. The Nomex hood kinda looks funny with it (oldschool) but keeps me from sweating up the helmet lining and making it funky. Plus it protects my handsome mug from raging flames, lol.


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actually that was on legally bald rs-2's. drove to and from the track. but again this was 2007. back then my car was at 2350lbs. not sure what the ebay springs were rated at. later i switched to Qa1 350/250 springs and an rb frt. sway. much, much better than that picture. i was pushing as hard as i could to not impede that spec miata driver. if you look at the sm behind me, you can see the difference 700/400 springs, and the big eibach sways make.
Yeah, the most obvious thing was the difference between the roll in the two cars in your pic.




Here's my comparison pic. We aren't fully into the corner yet so we I'm really not swaying much at this point. I passed this Z06 in the previous straightaway because he just couldn't hang with my acceleration, yeah right.

My instructor was balancing his checkbook in this picture because it was so thrilling.



Yeah, ok, I'm waiting for the passing zone to let him by...



The planning has begun and I have seen the cheap ebay spring and coilover kits on ebay but there is absolutely no info on rates, spring lengths, or diameters to know which ones might help a brother out. Do I want the honduh EG, EK, DSM2, integra, accord, eclipse or what? 2" or 4" vertical adjusters? I've searched a bit but here but all too often people just say "ebay coilovers" but I know there have to be differences because they are being advertised for different cars. Nondescript chinese crap. AAArgh. Buying brand name springs looks easier. They actually have dimensions and rates.
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Old 10-16-2011, 11:00 AM   #26
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I used ebay collars amd qa1 springs for a few track days before I ponied up for nice sleeves. Ebay ones were fine all the new sleeves did was make my lowest ride height point lower. Qa1 springs are where it's at for budget racers.
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Old 10-16-2011, 12:31 PM   #27
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^^^ That would be an okay budget plan. At least get springs with known rates from a reputable manufacturer even if you cheap out on the sleeves. There is nothing functionally wrong with used springs (unless they are rusted to **** maybe) and they can often be had cheaper than new QA1s, which are alredy budget-friendly. If you start with springs of unknown rates then it will be difficult to know what direction you need to go with future adjustments to get the balance where you like it. Yeah, you can stand on them and measure the delta to get a rough idea of the rate, but also consider that if they are a name brand with known rate you will one day be able to sell them to somebody else. Nobody wants to buy your used unknown ebay springs, so they will end up wasting space in your garage, or in a landfill.

As far as ebay sleeves go, as a rule, I avoid chinese pot metal suspension parts. But lots of people use them and I haven't seen reports of them failing.

GC sells quality parts, but $400 is more than you really have to spend to get quality parts. If you break it down, you're paying the same for the sleeves as if you bought stuff Koni (who are actually helpful over the phone, unlike others) and you're paying $60 for each of 4 new Eibach springs which isn't saving you money either.
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Old 10-16-2011, 01:04 PM   #28
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right, i have no idea what the ebay springs are. that's why i bought the Qa1 springs i mentioned in my post. i do know my buddy had msm bilsteins (silver ones) and bought the silver sleeve/blue spring ebay coilovers because someone had measured them at 450/325 or something like that. rode 100x better tham oem and was fast at the track.
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Old 10-16-2011, 01:11 PM   #29
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Sixshooter,


I have Koni Yellows with 525/335 springs, damping set ~half turn off full stiff. Ride height is slightly lower than stock.

It rides much better than stock on the street. I was surprised, but the point I am trying to make is if you go with yellows, don't worry about a harsh street ride.
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Old 10-16-2011, 02:00 PM   #30
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Y'know, I have a set of GC sleeves in the basement. I THINK they're for Honda Bilsteins, but if you get me a shock diameter measurement I'll see if they match up. They're in great shape and I'd let 'em go cheap.
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Old 10-17-2011, 10:17 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by stinkycheezmonky View Post
Y'know, I have a set of GC sleeves in the basement. I THINK they're for Honda Bilsteins, but if you get me a shock diameter measurement I'll see if they match up. They're in great shape and I'd let 'em go cheap.
That would be great! I was sitting here contemplating buying a set of ebay sleeves and springs just to have to chuck out the springs and shop for proper rate springs.

According to wisdom posted on the interwebz, "outside of the NB Bilstein tube is a bit over 50mm or 1.97 inches." If I am able to collect the proper parts I'll send my Billies out for a revalve eventually and get serious about this. After denying myself the ability to spend a few bucks on the car for so long I'm finding it hard to stop now, especially after getting a taste of the track. I gotta get another fix. I'm going to be a full-blown trackhead.
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Old 10-17-2011, 10:50 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by cardriverx View Post
Sixshooter,


I have Koni Yellows with 525/335 springs, damping set ~half turn off full stiff. Ride height is slightly lower than stock.

It rides much better than stock on the street. I was surprised, but the point I am trying to make is if you go with yellows, don't worry about a harsh street ride.
Everytime I drive in a miata I think is harsh as ****, I will ask the owner, "are you on konis?" I'm almost always right. Doesn't matter if it's 500/300 or 375/250 or 318/222 or oem, konis are harsh and I notice it right away. I detest Konis.
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Old 10-17-2011, 11:04 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by cardriverx View Post
Sixshooter,


I have Koni Yellows with 525/335 springs, damping set ~half turn off full stiff. Ride height is slightly lower than stock.

It rides much better than stock on the street. I was surprised, but the point I am trying to make is if you go with yellows, don't worry about a harsh street ride.
I might have to try out the Yellows if I get some real springs. I'm afraid of them jacking down with the stockers I have now. I have heard so many wonderful things about fatcat's custom revalving of Bilsteins that I think I'd have trouble giving up on that idea unless the Konis felt awesome when I tried them. I dunno, it is a lot to contemplate.

Edit: Brain's post echoes some of the sentiment I've heard before. I wonder if any of that is a result of how the owner has them adjusted or if they are always somewhat harsh?
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Old 10-17-2011, 01:58 PM   #34
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That would be great! I was sitting here contemplating buying a set of ebay sleeves and springs just to have to chuck out the springs and shop for proper rate springs.

According to wisdom posted on the interwebz, "outside of the NB Bilstein tube is a bit over 50mm or 1.97 inches." If I am able to collect the proper parts I'll send my Billies out for a revalve eventually and get serious about this. After denying myself the ability to spend a few bucks on the car for so long I'm finding it hard to stop now, especially after getting a taste of the track. I gotta get another fix. I'm going to be a full-blown trackhead.
Hmm. Mine are apparently 52mm ID. Not sure if that'd work or not, or if you could find/fab an inner sleeve. Might be too big for the spring clip even if you could do a sleeve.
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Old 10-17-2011, 04:26 PM   #35
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awesome pics, looks like you guys had alot of fun
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Old 10-17-2011, 04:26 PM   #36
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Edit: Brain's post echoes some of the sentiment I've heard before. I wonder if any of that is a result of how the owner has them adjusted or if they are always somewhat harsh?
Almost all my Miata suspension experience is with the yellows, being that they were on my car when I bought it. Most of my time in other Miatas has been focused on the boostz and I wasn't critically evaluating suspension or even paying much attention to it. That said, the car was on stock springs when I got it, and I didn't think it was harsh at all. After I put on wheels & tires that are heavier than stock and installed 450/300 springs is when I noticed the harshness. When I installed those parts was also around the time when VDOT started tearing the **** out of all the roads I drive on for HOV expansion projects and other construction. When I get out of town and drive on roads that haven't been strategically cratered, little bumps and pavement seams just don't bother me that much. The ride is controlled, and though it isn't glass smooth, I don't find it bothersome especially since the Miata is not an obligate daily driver for me.

The Koni adjuster changes rebound damping. The car will feel tighter through corners if you crank up the damping, but increasing the damping as a band-aid compensation for low spring rates really exacerbates the jacking down phenomenon when you encounter bumps. I'd guess that anyone who is more than 1/2 turn up from full soft on stock-ish spring rates probably has them set way too stiff. You have about two turns of adjustment to work with. On 450/300 I'm about 1/2 to 5/8 turn down from full stiff in the front, and about 1 turn down for the rears, give or take (it's been a while since I adjusted them). One good way to set them is to find some speed "humps," the smoother kind used to control residential neighborhood traffic that you can take at 25-30 mph. Start at full soft and turn up the damping 1/4 turn at a time until you have mitigated the "hobby horse" effect induced by the hump. That will be a good point to leave it for street driving on smooth roads, or you can back off ~1/4 turn if you live in a bumpy area. If at some point you do an event on a smooth track you can play with cranking up the damping and see how you like it.
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Old 10-17-2011, 08:11 PM   #37
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Hmm. Mine are apparently 52mm ID. Not sure if that'd work or not, or if you could find/fab an inner sleeve. Might be too big for the spring clip even if you could do a sleeve.
I'm willing to try it. Nothing to lose but whatever you are asking for them. What are you looking to get? PM me. Thanks.
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Old 10-20-2011, 02:56 AM   #38
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Everytime I drive in a miata I think is harsh as ****, I will ask the owner, "are you on konis?" I'm almost always right. Doesn't matter if it's 500/300 or 375/250 or 318/222 or oem, konis are harsh and I notice it right away. I detest Konis.
Really? I don't have much to compare to, but my koni setup is noticeably better ride wise than my stock shocks/springs with 100k miles on them (I assume they were never replaced). And for the price I paid, I am 110% glad with em.

Maybe my old **** was so blown I was just straight up riding the bumpstops. Or you just have a really sensitive ***

Also, keep in mind I am just slightly under stock ride height, not really low.
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Old 10-20-2011, 03:09 PM   #39
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Concrete blocks would have been better than my old stockers, so I understand. It was slam into the bumpstop then bounce off of it.

I'm working on getting the used coilovers from Stinkycheesemonkey. Does anyone have any old springs that might be useful to me? Anything between 200 and about 550lbs would interest me. Cheap and ugly makes me smile. Cheap and pretty is sheer joy!

Thanks guys.

Last edited by sixshooter; 10-20-2011 at 03:31 PM.
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Old 10-20-2011, 03:58 PM   #40
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I have a pair of 8" 7K springs (2.5ID), and 6" 6K springs (2.75ID).



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