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Old 08-09-2010, 11:54 AM   #21
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Quote:
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no, just koni sports...so they are the shortest of all NA shocks by about an inch.
Except Koni Race, iirc shorter still. Regardless, that makes some sense.
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Old 08-09-2010, 02:05 PM   #22
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If those springs don't work you know where to bring them back to!

Same length springs front and rear are pretty common on aftermarket set ups. My Tein RA's have 6" springs front and rear.

Cut the stops some. Bring the car by my store and work on it here. Happy to help and offer completely useless advice at the same time!
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Old 08-09-2010, 02:16 PM   #23
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do those sleeve still rest on the circlip? if so you can raise the rears to the top mount and gain shock travel of you need it.
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Old 08-09-2010, 09:08 PM   #24
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Yes they rest on the circlip. I don't think I saw more than one groove in the shock body for the circlip.

Cueball, I'm gaining more confidence in the setup after looking at what I need to do. I had forgotten about cutting the bump stops.

Supposedly Cueball got these from a fellow miata driver on m.net, however from how they were setup, they were either never used on a miata, or the fronts came from a shlammed miata, and the rears from a 4x4. Or someone with 500lbs of lead in the trunk.

I am getting tired of taking them out though. I was hoping to be finished with at least the driver side, as the spring isolators are installed on that side. I knew I needed to take the passenger side off. Any hints as to how much to cut off? Bump stop size can be seen fairly clearly in the first post, and as I said they're about 1.2" IIRC.
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Old 08-09-2010, 11:10 PM   #25
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are those races?
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Old 08-10-2010, 12:47 AM   #26
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qui? Koni Races? I'm not sure what you mean, I'm a Koni newb. They're yellow. Would you like some better pictures. And if yes, of what specifically?
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Old 08-10-2010, 01:08 AM   #27
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The Koni Race's can handle stiffer spring rates. According to Webby, they are even shorter then the Sports......... which means they must not have any travel at all!
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Old 08-10-2010, 09:13 AM   #28
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oh wait, they are Koni Sports for an NB which don't have adjustable perches...now I got it. I guess in your case you could go for the rear iscmounts, I found in my case they were pointless and impacted the setup megatively.

If I DID have NB shocks and used the NB mounting bushings (upper and lower), I think they'd be better suited with the isc top hats. I had my suspension in and out in the rear at like 10 times this summer trying to get it perfect. I'm done toying with it, finally, but i do need new shocks.

also remember, 1" of shock travel is like 1.75" or so of wheel travel due to motion ratios. IIRC, 1" of shock travel is pretty typical. But I guess if the car is that jacked up and has that little travel the only solution really is the ISC tophats.
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Old 08-10-2010, 10:38 AM   #29
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Not sure why I think anyone would think this interesting, but these are some of my measurements, all measured at the wheel.

~12.5" rear ride height. I say ~ because my fenders have been rolled and pulled, so I don't take it to be a perfect datum.

3.5" droop from static ride height with FCM rear mounts.

1" bump travel from static AT THE WHEEL until the .75" FCM stop just "kisses," again with the FCM mounts.

2" bump travel from static until my 255/40-13 Hoosier hits the fender.

2.5" bump travel from static until the upper a-arm hits the chassis.

The way I see it, without pulling the fenders more, I can gain some travel just by getting rid of the FCM upper mounts in exchange for something which gives me more shock travel. So, the ISC hats are going in during the next couple days, and the measurements will be repeated. FWIW, the 225/45-15s tuck instead of hitting the fenders, so you guys with skinnies can grab that final .5" of travel before your a-arms hit.

10" ride height is literally a solid chassis go-kart.
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Old 08-10-2010, 10:48 AM   #30
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here was my issue:


Normal ride height (about .5" higher than I wanted; ~13").





Full Droop





"Full" bump travel (car lifted off jackstand, had about .75" more wheel travel)




I had TONS more travel available but I needed 10" rear springs to realize the dream as I was binding, If I had threaded collars like Curly, I could make that happen, but with 10" 250# springs on my current setup and the lowest ride height I could get in rear is 13".
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Old 08-10-2010, 11:39 AM   #31
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Thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you.

Webby, are those all rear measurements? I finally have two days off, so I'll be able to take the time to finish this up. Including:

Raising the driver front to desired ride height.
Lowering the driver rear to desired ride height.
Removing passenger front to add FCM spring isolator, and match driver side ride height.
Removing passenger rear to add FCM spring isolator, and match driver side ride height.

That's about 2-3 hours of wrenching time I'm not terribly please to be doing, especially since I was stupid and tried to make my own isolators to save $60. I'm glad I have something I can trust, but that stupid mistake cost me the time and labor of removing and replacing one half of the suspension.

On top of all this I need to determine if my rears and/or fronts require cut bump stops. Webby and Scott, how tall are your bump stops?

I think I'm shooting for 12.5" ride height at all four corners, does that sound too low? Also, are you guyz measuring static ride height before or after "settling" the car by driving it around the block once or twice? I know when I lower my car off the jack I can pull it out, but if I go driving, I need to pull up on the fender a bit to fit the jack under the car.
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Old 08-10-2010, 11:57 AM   #32
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Mine were rear measurements only. I'm worse off in the back as far as bottoming than the front. My stops are around .75". I measured after just bouncing the car. I think 12.5" is ok, most likely not too low. Most guys go with a little rake, somewhere around 12.25" front would be cool, that's around what I'm running.
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Old 08-11-2010, 04:35 AM   #33
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Managed to get all of the work done aside from cutting the bump stop on the driver front. Adjusted to 12.5" front, 12" rear. Doh. When finished, it should be 12.5" rear, if not 13". Pics coming soon.

Impressions are that it's epically stiff, yet for some reason that's only during cornering, braking, or acceleration. Little bumps and pot holes seem just as smooth if not smoother than before.

This was also my first drive after changing my waste gate source per JP's instructions.

Holy rock solid boost.
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Old 08-11-2010, 01:37 PM   #34
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Quote:
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Impressions are that it's epically stiff, yet for some reason that's only during cornering, braking, or acceleration. Little bumps and pot holes seem just as smooth if not smoother than before.

That's because AGX's suck! Good to know they damp right. I'll have to take a ride in it soon. See how they compare to the Teins in my car. I've never really been happy with them. That's why I had those Koni's laying around. Just never swapped them in to see if I liked em better.
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Old 08-11-2010, 04:51 PM   #35
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Not because I'm trying to sell them or anything, but I wouldn't say the AGXs suck. The stood up to a lot of abuse both on and off track, with only one stupid wrench mistake on my part damaging the one front one. Combined with FM's quality springs and FCM's quality bump stops, they were everything I would expect from a shock in that price range. I could see if you combined them with crappy springs, improperly matched springs, stock top hats, or stock bump stops, they'd be less than desirable.

You can have a ride anytime. I still need to add about .5" in the back, and cut the one remaining bump stop in the front. Shouldn't be too bad, I realized the one thing causing me such a headache was I replacing the passenger side, and then the driver side. In the back that doesn't cause any issues. In the front, the sway bar trying to do it's job with one side of the car lifting a leg puts it in the way of the upper control arm, which I remove to take the coil over out.

I also may add helper springs in the far future to keep droop travel under control.

Mainly because I'm not finished tweaking the ride height, but I'm still more excited about the $5 I spent on changing my waste gate signal. I had a great around town mid range with 10 psi, but only 7 or 8 at red line, which made 2-4k feel faster than 4-7. Like a small, choked V8 or something.
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Old 08-11-2010, 05:43 PM   #36
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Droop? WTF? My single springs have about an inch of preload on them!

Damn I need to ditch these ISC top hats!
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Old 08-11-2010, 07:45 PM   #37
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There's an inch in the back of droop travel, where the spring is touching nothing. 2" in the front I think. I may have those figures reversed though. I've seen a lot of different settings and measurements in the last few days.
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