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Old 01-23-2010, 10:41 PM   #1
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Default opinions on springs.

The previous owner of my 91, being a complete retard, decided cutting the stock springs is a much better idea than just putting upgraded springs in the car. I was hoping to get some opinions from other people on what they are running on their cars, I was considering either going to Tanabe, Racing Beat, Tein, or H&R. If anyone would like to tell me their experience and how the handling characteristics were I would much appreciate it.
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Old 01-23-2010, 10:56 PM   #2
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Without a shock upgrade at the same time I'd find some stock springs... the stock (non-R/LE Bilstein) shocks won't take much more than stock spring rates and work properly.

I'd find stockers in a wrecking yard and start saving the ~$2k that real suspension costs...
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Old 01-24-2010, 12:00 AM   #3
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well its got a newer set of KYB GR2 shocks already. I'm more worried about the fact that cut springs, aside from being majorly ghetto, are soooo f-ing unsafe. Im not looking for super high performance, since the car is my daily, and will only see any aggressive driving one or two saturdays a month. Main plan for the car's setup will be springs on adjustable shocks, going full poly bushing set, and adjustable endlinks for the sways, possibly upgrade the bars if i want it any stiffer.

Just really want opinions on the springs available for the car. Im really considering the Tanabe gf210 springs.
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Old 01-24-2010, 12:07 AM   #4
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Well, GR2s aren't that great for anything but DDing...tending to blow the hell up when slammed.


Go post a wtb for the 'old version' FM springs. Decent rates, good lowering, should be able to get a set used for like 75-125.
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Old 01-24-2010, 03:49 AM   #5
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Why did you buy gr2's, get used Bil...nevermind

https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/t41991/
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Old 01-24-2010, 05:25 AM   #6
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I didn't buy anything, other than an abused car. I wouldnt put anything KYB makes by choice on any car. The car already had the gr2 shocks with the cut springs. I plan on buying tokicos or koni's when i have the free money to put into it, i wouldnt be thinking about the springs if they werent hacked like they are, there are plenty of other things that need money put into them for now, like i may have a coolant leak at the "cursed plug" to deal with unless im lucky and i wasnt able to get a clamp tight enough earlier today.

Thanks for the advice, i really appreciate it.
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Old 01-24-2010, 10:32 AM   #7
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KYBs were my first setup (found them half-priced new in box), and as much as I hated them they can be alright* for the street.

They absolutely SUCK with the eBay coilovers and will probably blow.

They are comfy and handle nicely with stock springs, but are at stock height.

The Tein S-Tech springs were the best balance. These have good, linear rates (unlike many "drop" springs), a good drop, and a good F/R ratio. They are also cheap used ~$100-125.

I used a rear spacer on mine to get a little more travel and give it a little rake. Only thing I did wrong was ordering the wrong FCM bumpstops (54mm) when I should have order the 36mm or whatever the smallest they recommend for the AGX. I sold them last summer, but if I had put in the right bumpstops I may have really enjoyed that setup. It wasn't exactly what I was looking for anyhow, but was the last setup my wife didn't complain about.

It was certainly better than stock...and honestly the nicest stance I got out of anything until I had adjustable sleeves. Surefooted, predictable, just a little bouncy at times, but not as bad as Konis w 450/300 spring rates.

Take care.
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Old 01-24-2010, 10:38 AM   #8
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I dunno why you guys would water your time on springs like: Tanabe, Racing Beat, Tein, or H&R. If you're actually looking for extra performance and a mild drop, get the FM springs.
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Old 01-24-2010, 12:19 PM   #9
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I agree with Brianeack.

I know you probably want to get rid of the current "setup" as quick as possible, but save and go with FM springs. I have no track experience with them, but on the street they are amazing.
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Old 01-24-2010, 01:53 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
I dunno why you guys would water your time on springs like: Tanabe, Racing Beat, Tein, or H&R. If you're actually looking for extra performance and a mild drop, get the FM springs.
Dude's got a point.

The spring rates I finally settled at (and ride height for that matter) are almost identical to the FM springs.

I was never lucky enough to find a cheap set though.

Good luck. Spend the money up front on suspension = less grief later.
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Old 01-24-2010, 03:49 PM   #11
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Why waste your time on those, do a diy coilover///thread
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Old 02-02-2010, 11:40 PM   #12
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so, while i was putting my 16's on today my buddy was messing around and wiped down my springs with a rag, turns out they are eibachs. Looked up the spring rates on these pieces o' junk. 140 Linear in the front and 70/120 progressive in the rear. I'd feel better if they were cut springs. Thinking I'm gonna step it up next month, since i've gotta dump money into the charging system that just crapped out. Definitely gonna spend some time on research and find what will be best for my DDing the car and hitting the twisties every other weekend.
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Old 02-03-2010, 01:25 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
I dunno why you guys would water your time on springs like: Tanabe, Racing Beat, Tein, or H&R. If you're actually looking for extra performance and a mild drop, get the FM springs.
The FM springs are decent (I have 'em on my '92) but in my opinion, they are a bit soft for really spirited driving. If you've got the shocks for it, I'd go much stiffer- at least 400/300 if not much more.

I'm always amazed when I ride in AbeFMs car how reasonably comfortable it is, given that he's running some insanely high spring rates (I wanna say 700/500, or something in that general neighborhood) with Koni Sports.
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Old 02-03-2010, 01:45 AM   #14
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I agree with the FM's being a bit soft. I still like my R-Bilstein/FM setup, but I would like 100lb/in more per spring. I actually noticed my ride got smoother with the FM springs over the stock springs. My theory is that it has something to do with the stiffer springs doing more of the work, taking some of the stress off of the fairly aggressively valved Bilstein shocks. In the future when the car gets the LS1, it will get all new suspension again, something quite a bit stiffer. ~450f/325r would be ideal for me I think.
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Old 02-03-2010, 02:59 AM   #15
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ok, im sure this is one of the most retarded sounding posts thats on this forum but, where are you guys going to get springs with these more aggressive rates? I'm used to dealing in cars that you go straight for typical off the shelf parts with suspension, like going to Tein or Tanabe.

Thanks, and sorry for being such a noob.
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Old 02-03-2010, 04:37 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drifter2be View Post
ok, im sure this is one of the most retarded sounding posts thats on this forum but, where are you guys going to get springs with these more aggressive rates?
You start by purchasing a set of adjustable spring perches to accommodate 2.5" ID springs. These are commonly (and somewhat incorrectly) refereed to as coilover conversion kits, though of course Miatas already have coilovers- just non-adjustable and the wrong size.

Here's an example of such a device with a spring mounted on it, made by Ground Control, which is a reputable maker of such things, and courtesy of Good-Win-Racing.



And here's a similar setup mounted on a shock, courtsey of FatCat Motorsports. This is FCM's own design:



Many, many Chinese knockoffs also exist, some of which are ok and some of which aren't.

Once you've got these mounts, you are able to run standard 2.5" coil springs, which are probably the single most common size in all of auto racing. Thus, you can buy springs in virtually any length and rate from just about anywhere. Summit, Jegs, Pegasus, etc.

FWIW, Tein uses these standard-sized springs. The only difference is that theirs are green and cost more.
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Old 02-03-2010, 06:05 AM   #17
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I agree with you guys about the FM springs. ^ Good info there, helped me too.
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Old 02-03-2010, 09:24 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
The FM springs are decent (I have 'em on my '92) but in my opinion, they are a bit soft for really spirited driving. If you've got the shocks for it, I'd go much stiffer- at least 400/300 if not much more.
I'm comparing them to the price point and ride height of the tech.S and Racing Beat and other weak *** drop-in springs. If you're simply looking for a spring to throw over your shocks and lower the car and get better performance, at that price point they'll be the best before going to a sleeved spring.

I'm running 550/300 QA1 springs on my koni sports (NA) and I either need to re-valve the shocks or go to like a 400/275 combo. It's damn harsh driving around (the rear literally bounces up on bumps), however, the performance is wonderful.
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Old 02-03-2010, 09:36 AM   #19
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Tire Rack has the Koni coilover kit for $936 for a 1997 Miata. Pretty darn good price.

It doesn't look like the Koni Sport shocks, so I'm not sure how good the progressive springs are, I'm sure it's fantastic for daily driving...but autox and track, is it a decent bang-for-the buck? Dunno.


+1 for the Ground Controls. I'm rocking 550 or (500lb) front, and 350 rear.
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Old 02-04-2010, 01:04 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
I'm comparing them to the price point and ride height of the tech.S and Racing Beat and other weak *** drop-in springs. If you're simply looking for a spring to throw over your shocks and lower the car and get better performance, at that price point they'll be the best before going to a sleeved spring.
Oh, absolutely yes. In terms of a direct-replacement spring for the stock mounts, FM's is far and away the best deal in town. The others are way too damn weak for the amount of lowering, with the result that you're left riding on the stops pretty much all the time.

Just saying that for an extra $150 you can upgrade to full adjustability and get any spring rate imaginable, IF your shocks are man enough to handle it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
I'm running 550/300 QA1 springs on my koni sports (NA) and I either need to re-valve the shocks or go to like a 400/275 combo. It's damn harsh driving around (the rear literally bounces up on bumps), however, the performance is wonderful.
I sort of mis-spoke back there. Abe's shocks are technically Koni Sports, however the particular ones he has were apparently prototypes for the Koni Race, and have been revalved accordingly.



Quote:
Originally Posted by saint_foo View Post
Tire Rack has the Koni coilover kit for $936 for a 1997 Miata. Pretty darn good price.
Great price, though I can't seem to find any info anywhere on what spring rates that comes with, and what the shock valving is like.
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