What front hubs to buy
#101
Update to my situation:
ART continues to NOT return emails, so I sent a quick note to Flyin' Miata. They are replacing the hub on their own, so of course a big thanks to them for their continued customer service.
However, I think going forward, I'm just going to buy OEM and keeps spares. Not even bother with rebuilding them and just change them when they fail.
ART continues to NOT return emails, so I sent a quick note to Flyin' Miata. They are replacing the hub on their own, so of course a big thanks to them for their continued customer service.
However, I think going forward, I'm just going to buy OEM and keeps spares. Not even bother with rebuilding them and just change them when they fail.
Last edited by z31maniac; 12-16-2013 at 09:26 AM.
#102
On the a similar note to this thread.
Repacked rear bearings saturday. You do it the same way as the front bearings, like almost exactly the same way. There's not write up for it, but you can figure it out. One thing I did find is that the cheap bearing use a different style seal than the OEM bearing and they are not interchangable.
Repacked rear bearings saturday. You do it the same way as the front bearings, like almost exactly the same way. There's not write up for it, but you can figure it out. One thing I did find is that the cheap bearing use a different style seal than the OEM bearing and they are not interchangable.
#103
Hold tight...new hubs
Just FYI, there should be another hub option available next year. Right now we're working on front and rear hubs with U.S. made tapered bearings, which are designed to take axial loads and should (in theory) dissipate heat and loads much better than stock.
The hubs right now are only optioned with 70mm endurance studs (12.9 grade). It wouldn't be an issue to ship the hubs with the studs not installed, just in case someone wanted to install standard-length studs.
The supplier is an OEM Tier 1 manufacturer. The cost...less than current hubs.
Any comments or concerns? Would you all prefer 70mm studs installed or separate?
The hubs right now are only optioned with 70mm endurance studs (12.9 grade). It wouldn't be an issue to ship the hubs with the studs not installed, just in case someone wanted to install standard-length studs.
The supplier is an OEM Tier 1 manufacturer. The cost...less than current hubs.
Any comments or concerns? Would you all prefer 70mm studs installed or separate?
#104
Will these come with all the proper install instructions and torque specs? This will be different than the stock dual row dual angular contact ball bearings. And I'm assuming they're going to have a lower torque spec which could cause spindle fatigue failure rather than bearing failure is my only concern.
#105
Will these come with all the proper install instructions and torque specs? This will be different than the stock dual row dual angular contact ball bearings. And I'm assuming they're going to have a lower torque spec which could cause spindle fatigue failure rather than bearing failure is my only concern.
The bearings are not double-row ball bearing, but U.S. made tapered roller bearings. These have a much, much higher surface area than ball bearing (even double row), which helps spread the load.
Pictures, pricing and test results will follow as soon as they're available, which is to say after the ball drops and the champagne pops for 2014.
#108
Yes I know how the stock hubs are. I've changed enough of them. So I'm assuming from what you're saying is that these will be "non-adjustable" tapered bearings which have shims between the two inner races that set the pre-load So you just tighten the nut on the spindle to the same as stock so you get the same pre-load on the spindle as before and but the pre-load on the bearing is set by the shims between the races. You said these are being supplied by an OEM. Will the pre-load shims be setup for OEM or racing applications, these are typically different. And falls into the "if I'm paying x for this..." category of fiddling.
#109
Yes I know how the stock hubs are. I've changed enough of them. So I'm assuming from what you're saying is that these will be "non-adjustable" tapered bearings which have shims between the two inner races that set the pre-load So you just tighten the nut on the spindle to the same as stock so you get the same pre-load on the spindle as before and but the pre-load on the bearing is set by the shims between the races. You said these are being supplied by an OEM. Will the pre-load shims be setup for OEM or racing applications, these are typically different. And falls into the "if I'm paying x for this..." category of fiddling.
One other obvious point: ball bearings are efficient in a straight line, whereas tapered bearings will take axial loads far better. However, tapered bearings aren't going to give you the gas mileage of a ball bearing...but those are the choices we make for safety and performance.
Not trying to hijack either, so please talk amongst yourselves...
#111
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Originally Posted by Cordycord
hub ****
1. Designing hubs for high-horsepower guys is a pretty fatal mistake IMO. High-horsepower cars don't see enough run time to damage the hubs. Design the hubs for the thousands and thousands of club racing cars that actually wear front bearings out.
2. If the studs aren't ARP (not ARP-style, but specifically made by ARP), then I will not pay a penny for them and will prefer to remove them and install genuine ARP hardware.
#112
One other obvious point: ball bearings are efficient in a straight line, whereas tapered bearings will take axial loads far better. However, tapered bearings aren't going to give you the gas mileage or acceleration of a ball bearing...but those are the choices we make for safety and performance.
Our little motors need all the help they can get. Personally, I would prefer the ball bearing style hub and keep my less rolling resistance. We aren't driving 400 cubic inch, 3500 lb. monsters.
#113
A few quick thoughts for you:
1. Designing hubs for high-horsepower guys is a pretty fatal mistake IMO. High-horsepower cars don't see enough run time to damage the hubs. Design the hubs for the thousands and thousands of club racing cars that actually wear front bearings out.
2. If the studs aren't ARP (not ARP-style, but specifically made by ARP), then I will not pay a penny for them and will prefer to remove them and install genuine ARP hardware.
1. Designing hubs for high-horsepower guys is a pretty fatal mistake IMO. High-horsepower cars don't see enough run time to damage the hubs. Design the hubs for the thousands and thousands of club racing cars that actually wear front bearings out.
2. If the studs aren't ARP (not ARP-style, but specifically made by ARP), then I will not pay a penny for them and will prefer to remove them and install genuine ARP hardware.
As for the studs, so far there's one vote for installed and one vote for not. FYI, I've ordered and used hundreds of thousands of studs for trucks and off-road racers from my current supplier, and none...not one..has failed.
#116
And IMO a tapered bearing really isnt a good solution anyways, just form cost-benefit. Our hubs most likely come with Grade 100 ***** in them, stepping up to grade 5 would theoretically increase life 10 fold, and going ceramic would easily double that. But just a grade 5 ceramic rebuild in $20 hubs puts the price up to $120/hub + grease. I couldnt find steel grade 5 ***** in my quick search but they're going to be cheaper than ceramic.
#117
And IMO a tapered bearing really isnt a good solution anyways, just form cost-benefit. Our hubs most likely come with Grade 100 ***** in them, stepping up to grade 5 would theoretically increase life 10 fold, and going ceramic would easily double that. But just a grade 5 ceramic rebuild in $20 hubs puts the price up to $120/hub + grease. I couldnt find steel grade 5 ***** in my quick search but they're going to be cheaper than ceramic.