aidandj

iTrader: (5)

Wut. Everyone in this thread told you not to.

ApexAddict

True. But nobody really explained it in detail. Anyone can tell you whatever they want but unless it's broken down for you, it's hard to believe what they say. I mean, afterall, it's the ******* internet. It's hard to believe what people say. But, in the end, I called FM today and changed the order to just the DP4 up front and the stock calipers in the rear with the sport rotors. Sure it might not be as pretty, but it doesn't ******* matter when it comes down to squeezing out the best lap time. Now I have 800 more dollars to put into power upgrades once I figure out exactly what I want to do.

zellers88

iTrader: (1)

So Andrew takes the time to write up a detailed explanation for you, you only listen to his advice, then you go and order from FM instead of him? I wouldn't expect much more advice to come your way.

turbofan

iTrader: (1)

OK man... wat? Here are some quotes from this thread:

They told you the same things I was told when I was thinking to go with 6-pots... except with even less detail. I ended up with dynalites (dynapros weren't as common then) and I am happy with them, though bling of 6 pots is awesome.

Ah, no. You'll notice that he bought the BBK before Andrew really dropped the knowledge.

ApexAddict

I had already ordered the kit before he posted.
That picture from google addresses the dimensions of the calipers and the other post doesn't address my question about balancing my brake bias with a 6 pot up front. Sure people gave me advice, but Andrew's post was really the only one that addressed my question...

ThePass

iTrader: (3)

For the sake of thoroughness in this thread, I'll add that the DP6 is a much bigger pain to change pads in: pads can only be loaded/unloaded from the bottom (so must be removed from bracket to change pads) and the two slider pins, while easy enough to pull if you know what you're doing (pocket screwdriver works well) are way more troublesome than the simple W clip on the DP4 or a standard bridge bolt on the ST42.

Completely agree with everything you've noted about DP4 vs. DP6 except for this only because as a blanket statement it is not completely accurate - it depends on which DP4 we're talking about. The ~10% greater pad volume of the DP6 vs. DP4 lug mount translates almost linearly to ~10% longer pad life. There IS more pad life here. But, that difference may be less than 1 full track day on a high power car and therefore not a dramatic enough difference to make a case for that caliper especially with other variables in the mix. But "no improvement" is completely true if the DP6 is compared to the DP4 radial (or ST42 for that matter) because the DP6 has less pad volume, making those other 4pot options the lighter and longer lasting choices.

ApexAddict

Interesting, I was under the impression that the DP6 was the same as the DP4 as far as changing pads goes. I'm glad I wound up going with the DP4 over the DP6, I don't know what I was thinking when I ordered the stage 2 kit.

Savington

iTrader: (31)

Emphasis mine. Yes, 10% longer life, but most people aren't willing to stretch the pad life to the point where that would make an appreciable difference. Actually getting that extra 10% out will mean measuring pad depth after nearly every session, and it may even mean swapping pads at lunch or mid-weekend, something most people aren't willing to do. So in practice, for most people, 10% can be effectively rounded down to zero.

ThePass

iTrader: (3)

Agreed

LanceMach

In your defense, I can say that Nick was a bad influence on you: he spent most of that weekend at Thunderhill brainwashing you with his American Iron "Bigger is Always Better" mentality!

ApexAddict

I'd say you would still get 10% more regardless. Because with what you're saying, is it sounds like you're assuming one would get every last lap out of the DP4 pads but change the DP6s out when they get close to being done. In that case, they'd have about the same life. But if you change out both pads when they have say 3mm left or if you change both out when they get as close to the end as you're willing to push it, you'll still be getting 10% more from the DP6. I know this is worded horribly, but I can't really express what i'm trying to say over the internet.
Yeah Nick was a bad influence

Savington

iTrader: (31)

Two friends, both with Miatas. They do track days together. They probably do other stuff together, but this is a family-friendly post, so we'll overlook their implied extracurriculars.

One friend has DP6s, the other has DP4s. The friend with DP6s gets 10% better pad life.

Both friends are getting ready for their next track day. They've got their Hoosiers (for the track day bro), they've got their sunscreen, they've got lube for the hotel the night before. Both friends decide to check their pads. The friend with DP4s notices that his pads are 80% worn, down to just 1.8mm. He decides to install fresh pads, because going to the track with 1.8mm of pad is ill-advised.

The friend with DP6s, eager to display his dominance, checks his pads, expecting to benefit from his 10% better pad life. His pads are worn down to 2.52mm, or 10% less than his friend with the DP4s. (DP4s wore 7.2mm total, DP6s wore 6.48mm total). He.....also decides to install fresh pads, because going to the track with 2.52mm of pad material is ill-advised.

In the real world, 10% just isn't enough better to make a difference.

ApexAddict

That's a valid point. Also, lube is for pussies. Tell them to man up.

LanceMach

That's my boy!

I blame his mother...

thumpetto007

iTrader: (15)

Huh, that is nice to know my radial mounts have big pads. They also fit under 15x7 avanti storms with sticky wheel weights and no spacer.

ApexAddict

Nice. I saw a post about the BBK fitting under 15x8 RPF1s but it looks too close to allow sticky weights.

NiklasFalk

iTrader: (1)

If you have an interest in maximizing pad life you need to swap sides of the pads after every stint anyway with same sized pistons (to work against tapered wear).
In that scenario you change pad when they are done, and 3mm thicker pad means 3mm more to wear down before change.

With the fast (w) clip this adds about one minute per wheel inspection.
I'm probably stupid for doing this but when the taper is visible after 15min, why not add the routine (which also makes you look at the pads regularly).

For endurance it's a big difference if pads live 0.8 or 1.2 race.
But if the difference is 1.4 and 1.8 race it doesn't matter (you will start on new pads regardless to skip swapping).

ApexAddict

That's actually a good point, especially since you typically have at least an hour to kill between each session.

BARMY

Wilwood didn't answer me when I asked if this could be done, so it's good to hear of someone doing it. I've been tearing up even their H compound pads for too long but now Savington has pointed me at Hawk DTC 60s which will hopefully last longer and not overheat in the last 25% of a long stop.