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Old 12-10-2009, 12:28 AM   #1
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Default Wtf? (1.6 VLSD failsauce bulltrash)

Recently, I've noticed that getting on the gas while turning causes the engine to rev but the car to not move. Basically like a slipping clutch. I'm damn near certain its not a slipping clutch because this doesn't happen in a straight line(that I've noticed, I should really pay more attention to **** like this). Its always wayyy worse on cold mornings. It seems like it catches, like if I had slightly disengaged the clutch then dropped it.

Now I know that the 1.6 VLSD is a piece of **** and turns into an open diff in real short order, but it's been a while since I've driven a completely open diff car. I don't remember my first open diff Miata doing **** like this, but then again I drove that car way differently since I was barely 16 at the time.

Is this just my VLSD being toast? It would really suck to know that out of nowhere my clutch with 5k miles on it is slipping. The only thing that's leading me to think about this being the diff is the fact that I autox'd my high school auto shops car, and it was doing the same thing. My teacher put some shims in the diff and he said the problem was gone when he drove it at the next one.

Opinions/suggestions/**** talking?
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Old 12-10-2009, 12:34 AM   #2
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So is it clutch or diff? How can you possibly not be sure which one it is? If its diff then yes its toast, if its clutch then yes its toast.
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Old 12-10-2009, 12:38 AM   #3
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I'm saying I don't think its the clutch because this doesn't happen in a straight line. My question is basically do normal open diffs do the same thing?
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Old 12-10-2009, 12:40 AM   #4
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So no matter what, if you drive agressively, shift fast, there is no slippage in a straight line?

Well then yes, its your crappy viscous 1.6 diff. While you're in there a good idea would be to upgrade to a 1.8 diff/axles.
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Old 12-10-2009, 12:42 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by 18psi View Post
So no matter what, if you drive agressively, shift fast, there is no slippage in a straight line?

Well then yes, its your crappy viscous 1.6 diff. While you're in there a good idea would be to upgrade to a 1.8 diff/axles.
Actually yea, no slippage in a straight line at all, since you asked it that way.

Yea, I want a torsen but I don't have the funds for one right now really.
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Old 12-10-2009, 12:46 AM   #6
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Get an open then. In either case, get 1.8
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Old 12-10-2009, 12:50 AM   #7
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yah,
1.6 diff = weaker than a baby's skull
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Old 12-10-2009, 12:55 AM   #8
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Btw guys I'm not boosted. I know the 1.6 is weak, but I'm not exactly pushing mad hp to the wheels.
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Old 12-10-2009, 01:24 AM   #9
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Doesn't matter they fail at low hp all the time. Surprised mine has lasted this long...
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Old 12-10-2009, 01:25 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by MartinezA92 View Post
Btw guys I'm not boosted. I know the 1.6 is weak, but I'm not exactly pushing mad hp to the wheels.
people have made metal soup of 1.6 diffs on stock power.
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Old 12-10-2009, 02:42 AM   #11
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Back up a second.

Let's forget for a moment that 1.6 R&Ps are fragile and stock VLSDs are weaksauce.


You step on the gas and the RPMs increase but the car does not accelerate... I'm assuming that this is not accompanied by one wheel spinning- correct? If that's the case, then it doesn't matter if the VLSD has reverted to fully open status. There's no way for slippage of the differental unit itself to allow the engine to speed up without at least one of the two wheels also speeding up.

And then there's the R&P. If it were metal salad, you'd know it. As in: car doesn't move at all, or makes horrible grinding sounds. R&P gears don't slip. They either move in a fixed relationship, or they're chunky salsa.

Either you're spinning one wheel, or your clutch is slipping. Diffs aren't nearly this subtle.
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Old 12-10-2009, 05:15 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
Back up a second.

Let's forget for a moment that 1.6 R&Ps are fragile and stock VLSDs are weaksauce.


You step on the gas and the RPMs increase but the car does not accelerate... I'm assuming that this is not accompanied by one wheel spinning- correct? If that's the case, then it doesn't matter if the VLSD has reverted to fully open status. There's no way for slippage of the differental unit itself to allow the engine to speed up without at least one of the two wheels also speeding up.

And then there's the R&P. If it were metal salad, you'd know it. As in: car doesn't move at all, or makes horrible grinding sounds. R&P gears don't slip. They either move in a fixed relationship, or they're chunky salsa.

Either you're spinning one wheel, or your clutch is slipping. Diffs aren't nearly this subtle.
+1. Why did it take 11 posts to come to this. This forum is sinking - if that is a possibility at all.
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Old 12-10-2009, 09:42 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by MartinezA92 View Post
Btw guys I'm not boosted. I know the 1.6 is weak, but I'm not exactly pushing mad hp to the wheels.
If you understood the mechanics of a VLSD, you'd understand why over time, they are pretty much an open differential.

However, the diff would not be the cause of your issues.
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Old 12-10-2009, 10:08 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
Back up a second.

Let's forget for a moment that 1.6 R&Ps are fragile and stock VLSDs are weaksauce.


You step on the gas and the RPMs increase but the car does not accelerate... I'm assuming that this is not accompanied by one wheel spinning- correct? If that's the case, then it doesn't matter if the VLSD has reverted to fully open status. There's no way for slippage of the differental unit itself to allow the engine to speed up without at least one of the two wheels also speeding up.

And then there's the R&P. If it were metal salad, you'd know it. As in: car doesn't move at all, or makes horrible grinding sounds. R&P gears don't slip. They either move in a fixed relationship, or they're chunky salsa.

Either you're spinning one wheel, or your clutch is slipping. Diffs aren't nearly this subtle.
I get what you mean, and I guess it must be the outside wheel thats doing the work around a corner if engine RPM is going up then settling down once I straighten out. Its almost like I'm a bad stick driver.

Thats the only thing that seems possible since my clutch isn't slipping. This whole thing causes some strange jerking when I corner hard and I'm on the gas, somewhat like quickly throttling in mid corner.
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Old 12-10-2009, 12:21 PM   #15
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When my diff went....it went. There was no "slipping" There was working, and then there was completely ******* broken. No real "in between"

The gears ground into paste...and didn't allow **** to turn. I had "roaring" from the rear end for ~8 hours of driving prior to the final "break" but I assume that was slightly less-pasty gears becoming more pasty and obliterated as I accelerated.

Sounds like clutch is slipping or Perhaps you are spinning out on the corners?

l2drive, l2observe ;p

Strange jerking when you "corner hard and on the gas" sounds like baby dorifto?
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Old 12-10-2009, 12:40 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MartinezA92 View Post
Recently, I've noticed that getting on the gas while turning causes the engine to rev but the car to not move. Basically like a slipping clutch.
Is this behavior accompanied by the squeeling sound, smoke and the smell of burning rubber? Or is it quiet and smells like burning brake pads?

If it quacks like a duck ... your clutch is toast. After all it is a wear item and old as ****.

The diff being bad is about as likely to cause this problem as an exhaust leak is.
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Old 12-10-2009, 01:58 PM   #17
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I get what you mean, and I guess it must be the outside wheel thats doing the work around a corner if engine RPM is going up then settling down once I straighten out. Its almost like I'm a bad stick driver.
You are a bad stick driver, but Hustler forgives you.

Seriously though, I'm not sure I'm following your train of thought here. When you round a bend, yes, one wheel turns faster than the other. That's the whole point of having a diff in the first place.

However, if the RPMs are going up so much that you can actually notice it on the tach, this is more than just normal differential action. You'd need to have a wheel actually spinning, and by this I mean sphincter-puckering "Oh God, I'm going to hit the wall" sort of spinning.



Quote:
Thats the only thing that seems possible since my clutch isn't slipping.
Well, that's a relief. For a moment, I thought we'd definitively diagnosed a slipping clutch. It certainly seemed like a slipping clutch, what with the slipping behavior and all.

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Old 12-10-2009, 02:42 PM   #18
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Is this behavior accompanied by the squeeling sound, smoke and the smell of burning rubber? Or is it quiet and smells like burning brake pads?

If it quacks like a duck ... your clutch is toast. After all it is a wear item and old as ****.
No, no and no. My clutch has 5k miles on it.
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Old 12-10-2009, 02:45 PM   #19
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You are a bad stick driver, but Hustler forgives you.

Seriously though, I'm not sure I'm following your train of thought here. When you round a bend, yes, one wheel turns faster than the other. That's the whole point of having a diff in the first place.

However, if the RPMs are going up so much that you can actually notice it on the tach, this is more than just normal differential action. You'd need to have a wheel actually spinning, and by this I mean sphincter-puckering "Oh God, I'm going to hit the wall" sort of spinning.


Well, that's a relief. For a moment, I thought we'd definitively diagnosed a slipping clutch. It certainly seemed like a slipping clutch, what with the slipping behavior and all.
I'm not doing smoky burnouts here. And its not my stick driving because it happens with my foot nowhere near the clutch pedal.

I'm not saying my diff is broken as in I can't drive the car guys. I mean the "viscous" function of it is toast. I know the difference between a working diff and a blown diff, I'm not a complete idiot.

I'll **** around with this on my way to the parts store later on and see what I find.
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Old 12-10-2009, 02:49 PM   #20
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I'm not doing smoky burnouts here. And its not my stick driving because it happens with my foot nowhere near the clutch pedal.

I'm not saying my diff is broken as in I can't drive the car guys. I mean the "viscous" function of it is toast. I know the difference between a working diff and a blown diff, I'm not a complete idiot.

I'll **** around with this on my way to the parts store later on and see what I find.
the jury is still out in some cases
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