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Old 06-26-2016, 05:25 PM   #201
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erat View Post
I read this on the facebook today.



I am at a complete loss of words. Our children are being taught that words can physically hurt other people, not to mention teaching kids words physically damage fruit... This has really gotten out of hand.


Edit*
I just MUST ask this question.

Has ANYONE who is reading this been physically hurt by words? That's a serious question, because i really lack the mental capacity to be physically harmed by sounds expelled from another humans larynx.

As a child, i was taught the whole sticks and stones routine. I was called bad names, hell i still am. I usually acknowledge it and move on with my dumb life.
My take on the story was that it was a stupid metaphor and highly deceptive to the unsuspecting children (if the teacher never informed them of the initial abuse afterwards). In reality, the apples actually demonstrated how words were undoubtedly irrelevant and it is the actual physical treatment that caused real physical damage.

That's not to say that words can't be psychologically damaging for young minds, but it is an enormous leap to claim physical damage.

I'm in my 50's and I can still recall harsh comments my father made to me when I was just a kid, so they definitely made an indelible imprint. Of course, the same is true with positive comments, as during that same time period, I can recall feeling so proud from minor off-hand praising comments he also made to me.

Of course, the phenomenon of words being this impactful to me is exclusively (and I think appropriately) limited to those that are closest to me though (i.e. my parents, siblings, wife, and children). There is scarcely a way that anyone on the periphery could possibly utter a sound which could cause me any real grief, let alone physical damage.

I think that the better lesson for children is to learn how to understand and apply their own physical and mental boundaries, so that no matter what they may encounter, they will have the best possible tools at their own disposal to deal with them. But again, that harkens back to the issue of taking personal responsibility; a particular ability which is so sorely missing from generation wuss.
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Old 06-26-2016, 05:35 PM   #202
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I think that the better lesson for children is to learn how to understand and apply their own physical and mental boundaries, so that no matter what they may encounter, they will have the best possible tools at their own disposal to deal with them. But again, that harkens back to the issue of taking personal responsibility; a particular ability which is so sorely missing from generation wuss.
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Old 06-26-2016, 05:57 PM   #203
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I found out about a year ago that I am only two degrees of separation from Alanis. This knowledge has had no impact whatsoever on my life.

That having been said, God damn do I have some respect for any man who can be a decent parent to a child in this age...
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Old 06-26-2016, 09:13 PM   #204
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The original post about the Apple has been edited to include that she did inform the kids of the deception.
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Old 06-26-2016, 09:51 PM   #205
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I think teaching kindness and civility is extremely important. So is teaching toughness. They are not exclusive of each other. My only problem with that teacher's method (assuming she did actually reveal the deception) is that she missed the opportunity to teach the latter. Revealing the deception and exploring that would have been a good talking point about "sticks and stones."

Of course, depending upon the age of the children, it might be too much. It takes a bit more maturity to evolve toughness -- witnessing elders being resilient to adversity is one of the best ways, being resilient to your own adversities cements it. Having enough privilege to remove all adversity can doom a person.
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Old 06-26-2016, 09:59 PM   #206
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Originally Posted by hornetball View Post
Of course, depending upon the age of the children, it might be too much. It takes a bit more maturity to evolve toughness -- witnessing elders being resilient to adversity is one of the best ways, being resilient to your own adversities cements it. Having enough privilege to remove all adversity can doom a person.
Being taught toughness at an early age promotes maturity.

I completely understand the need to teach kids not to be verbally abusive. But maybe a little effort needs to be placed on teaching kids what kind of issues they will encounter when they get older and how to deal with them.

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Old 06-27-2016, 09:42 AM   #207
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Teaching kids to be nice to others is a good thing, deceiving them into believing that words really can cause physical harm is a wretched thing. Now, not only are they going to feel like they can get physical "revenge" on someone by treating them poorly, but they are also being taught that the feels that they get when someone calls them names are internal physical injuries - perhaps injuries that must be retaliated for. Seems to me that they've learned the first lesson in "conflict escalation". Had they been taught that words were physically benign, a culture of de-escalation could have formed.

There were several lessons that I was taught as an open minded middle-school / high-school student that I later found to be polar opposite of the truth. One that I specifically recall was how a small group of people that called themselves "Israel" was enslaving and destroying a country named "Palestine" for no justifiable reason other than the fact that they were mean and evil people. That day, I left class thinking that Israel was the scum of the earth and needed to be destroyed.
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Old 06-27-2016, 09:50 AM   #208
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erat View Post
I am at a complete loss of words.
I'm not:

Titty sprinkles.

There you go.
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Old 06-27-2016, 10:08 AM   #209
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Those are great words.
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Old 06-27-2016, 11:40 AM   #210
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Originally Posted by DNMakinson View Post
The original post about the Apple has been edited to include that she did inform the kids of the deception.
In Breaking Bad, there are two scenes where one of the antagonists eats an apple after doing something horrible. I think it's a reference to Adam and Eve.
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Old 06-27-2016, 05:18 PM   #211
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A great perspective on the wonderful subset of this generation:

Quote:
Tayler Gray as a Symptom of the "Selfies":

In a news cycle starved for any hint of controversy, an Allentown, PA's high-school student's tacky and disrespectful middle finger to her peers grabbed headlines. Tayler Gray, graduating senior, has been lauded by the media and thousands of social media supporters for her courageous act-- to receive her diploma and then walk right out of the auditorium.





"I got mine, so long suckas"

The sad news about such widespread attention is that her 15 seconds of fame will inevitably lead to an unsatisfying lifetime of hardship.

When we can witness such cold narcissism in action, it tells us a lot about the person, her parents, and the values she holds. Apparently she is an aspiring ultrasound technician. I would not let her perform any medical procedure on me. The last thing I need as a patient is a procedure conducted by someone that believes she's more important than the rest of us.

If I was the principal, I'd ask for the diploma back until she apologized to her class. If I was her parent, I would demand that she apologize to her class publicly, then spend the summer conducting community service. My guess is that her parent(s) applaud her bravado.

Tayler is a snapshot of a sad population within the Millennials that I like to call the "selfies". While I'm inspired by so many high school and college students that seem to have a fresh genuine concern about people and planet, there is a sub-population that has an enormous sense of self-entitlement, narcissistic focus, and worse, are proud to give a big F-U to the rest of us.

In my workplace we thrive as a team. We care for each other, celebrate each others' success, and solve problems by leveraging our strengths. Tayler would never be welcome on that team.

Graduations are not about you. Graduations are about us. I already have a high school degree and three college degrees, but as a professor I still show up at graduation to celebrate the successes of my students and to honor the institution that provided the mechanism of their minting.

I do it for my students, I do it for the school, but I also do it for me.

See Tayler, it is possible to derive enormous satisfaction from the joy of others, from service, from being part of something much bigger than ourselves. I know you were in a hurry to leave, beat the traffic, maybe grab lunch with your family. Think about how little those events are in the big scheme of things.

Congratulations on being a hero to those with the blinders that only allow them to see the mirror. You are a snapshot of what is wrong with people today, and a poster child for something we desperately need to change.

Graduations are referred to as Commencements, an initiation or a start, a seemingly strange term for a convocation at the end of an academic endeavor. But it fits perfectly because it is a new beginning-- this is the start of your life.

In your first steps into life, you demonstrated your conceit to the world. Maybe it is a good time to check that ego, think outside yourself, and experience the satisfaction that comes when we put others and our togetherness ahead of ourselves.

-Dr. Kevin Folta
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Old 07-01-2016, 03:17 PM   #212
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They're starting younger and younger:


Why police were called to a South Jersey third-grade class party
by Emma Platoff, Staff Writer Updated: JUNE 29, 2016 11:59 PM EDT




On June 16, police were called to an unlikely scene: an end-of-the-year class party at the William P. Tatem Elementary School in Collingswood.

A third grader had made a comment about the brownies being served to the class. After another student exclaimed that the remark was "racist," the school called the Collingswood Police Department, according to the mother of the boy who made the comment.

The police officer spoke to the student, who is 9, said the boy's mother, Stacy dos Santos, and local authorities.

Dos Santos said that the school overreacted and that her son made a comment about snacks, not skin color.

"He said they were talking about brownies. . . . Who exactly did he offend?" dos Santos said.

The boy's father was contacted by Collingswood police later in the day. Police said the incident had been referred to the New Jersey Division of Child Protection and Permanency. The student stayed home for his last day of third grade.

Dos Santos said that her son was "traumatized," and that she hopes to send him to a different Collingswood public school in the fall.

And she wants an apology. She said she graduated from Collingswood High School and has two other children, a 21-year-old who also went through Collingswood schools, and a 3-year-old. Her husband, the third grader's father, is Brazilian, dos Santos said.

"I'm not comfortable with the administration [at Tatem]. I don't trust them and neither does my child," she said. "He was intimidated, obviously. There was a police officer with a gun in the holster talking to my son, saying, 'Tell me what you said.' He didn't have anybody on his side."

The incident, which has sparked outrage among some parents, was one of several in the last month when Collingswood police have been called to look into school incidents that parents think hardly merit criminal investigation.

Superintendent Scott Oswald estimated that on some occasions over the last month, officers may have been called to as many as five incidents per day in the district of 1,875 students.

This has created concern among parents in the 14,000-resident borough, who have phoned their elected officials, met with Mayor James Maley, blasted social-media message boards, and even launched a petition calling on the Camden County Prosecutor's Office to "stop mandated criminal investigation of elementary school students."

The increased police involvement follows a May 25 meeting among the Collingswood Police Department, school officials, and representatives from the Camden County Prosecutor's Office, where school officials and police both said they were told to report to police any incidents that could be considered criminal, including what Police Chief Kevin Carey called anything "as minor as a simple name-calling incident that the school would typically handle internally."

The police and schools were also advised that they should report "just about every incident" to the New Jersey Division of Child Protection and Permanency, Carey said.

Previously, the school district, following the state's Memorandum of Agreement Between Education and Law Enforcement Officials, had only reported incidents it deemed serious, like those involving weapons, drugs, or sexual misconduct. Both Carey and School Board President David Routzahn described the protocol set forth after that May meeting as a significant change in procedure.

"It was a pretty clear directive that we questioned vehemently," Oswald said.

But a month after the meeting, and after police investigations that parents consider fruitless had begun to gain attention, Maley wrote in a public letter that the May 25 meeting was intended to "reinforce the applicability" of the MOA, "not to expand its terms." Prosecutor Mary Eva Colalillo, in an accompanying statement, said she hoped Maley's message "clarifies" the responsibilities of school officials.

Maley said in an interview Tuesday that there had been a "misunderstanding" during the May 25 meeting. But Oswald said the Prosecutor's Office was shying away from its own instructions.

"At some point, it seems, they've realized that the intent of the MOA that they're leaning heavily upon is not what they directed us to do," Oswald said. "It went way above what that MOA says."

Another point of contention between the Prosecutor's Office and school officials is what prompted Maley's meeting in the first place.

In a public letter issued to parents Monday, Routzahn said he was "not aware of any single event" in the district that might have prompted the Prosecutor's Office to ask for a higher reporting standard.

But Maley said the Prosecutor's Office had been concerned about a "delay" in reporting an incident at Collingswood High School this spring. He would not comment further, noting that the incident was under investigation by the Prosecutor's Office.

Oswald said the high school incident had not been raised during the meeting May 25.

"I welcome discussion on that as well," he said.

Several parents said they consider the recent police involvement not only ridiculous but harmful.

Megan Irwin, who has two daughters who have attended Collingswood public schools and who teaches first grade in Pennsauken, said the police had been called to deal with behavior the schools could easily have handled.

"Some of it is just typical little-kid behavior," Irwin said. "Never in my years of teaching have I ever felt uncomfortable handling a situation or felt like I didn't know how to handle a situation."

And Pam Gessert, a Collingswood resident who works as a school counselor in Burlington County, said that because teachers have the best relationships with students, they are most qualified to determine what happened in a particular incident.

Most of all, parents said they were concerned that undue police involvement threatened their children's well-being.

"I don't want this to happen to another child," dos Santos said.

Why police were called to a South Jersey third-grade class party
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Old 07-04-2016, 04:07 PM   #213
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"Brownies" will soon be added to the list of "triggering" words. They're gonna come up with a politically correct name for them.
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Old 07-05-2016, 09:13 AM   #214
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Great, now my neices "troop" is going to be known as the "fudgey cake squares".
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Old 07-05-2016, 09:40 AM   #215
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Great, now my neices "troop" is going to be known as the "fudgey cake squares".
I'm offended by that. Calling someone a "square" is a micro-aggressive form of anti-intellectualism. Just because I'm articulate and have conservative moral values doesn't make me dull or boring.
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Old 07-05-2016, 11:45 AM   #216
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Surely, "fudgey" and "cake" are more offensive than "square."
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Old 07-05-2016, 12:03 PM   #217
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Originally Posted by hornetball View Post
Surely, "fudgey" and "cake" are more offensive than "square."
Are you trying to appropriate my culture? Exactly how many times have you been called "cake" in your life?

Check your privilege.
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Old 07-05-2016, 12:07 PM   #218
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"Check" and "privilege"!! My ears are bleeding!
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Old 07-05-2016, 12:22 PM   #219
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"Check" and "privilege"!! My ears are bleeding!
Sorry, that was insensitive of me not to provide a trigger warning.

Do you need a safe space?
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Old 07-06-2016, 10:15 PM   #220
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We're only a few election cycles away from these two having an actual shot at it:

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